Eddie Bravo (Part 1)

00:00The Joe Rogan Experience Brothers and sisters, lovers and children, Brian Redman and Eddie Bravo are in the building. What's up? Hello. Much respect to the Korean zombie. Eddie Bravo is wearing a Korean zombie shirt. And what this means for you non-MMA people. There's a guy named Chan Sung Jung. They call him the Korean zombie. That's his nickname. And this weekend on Saturday night at the UFC against Leonard Garcia, he pulled off the first twister ever in the UFC. And the significance, of course, is that Eddie Bravo, our guest today, actually invented the twister. No, I didn't invent it. Well, you invented the setup. The setup. The setups, yes. The finishing move, no. It's an old wrestling move. But people used to finish people with it in wrestling? You can, definitely. But did they do it your way with the S-grip on the forehead? I thought that was all like your innovation to turn into a submission.

01:23No, no, no. People were cranking. I don't know if they were cranking it exactly the way I crank it, but I'm pretty sure. Had you seen other people get submitted with it before you ever started doing it? We would like that in high school. I wrestled a couple of years and I wrestled in Santa Ana High and in ninth grade, a guy named Jesse Barrios and another guy. His buddy is the one who showed me. I can't remember his name. I couldn't even remember it for my book. But Jesse Barrios is his friend. Santa Ana High School, 1985. If anybody out there is from that, there's Jesse Barrio's friend, the other leg rider on that wrestling team. Fuck, I don't know what his name is. Anyways, he showed it to me. And both of those, and in wrestling, leg riding is for weak people.

02:06And all that means is we're so weak, we need to use our legs a lot more than the big, strong dudes who are wrestling and hitting the weights and had big chests and shoulders. Those guys really didn't rely on their legs as much as the weak guys like me. I would skip weightlifting practice. I was in the back where I was hiding. I was weak even back then. I was a terrible athlete. I've never been a great athlete. So I had to rely on using my legs. And I thought, you know, they came to me. Jesse came to me and I go, dude, you'll be perfect for this. You know, because they knew I'd just get smashed if I try to go heads up with people. So it's a pinning move that I learned in wrestling. and um i got i got pretty good at it i would that was my shit even in high school that was my that was the thing i always tried i got some cool ass stories that maybe one day i'll i'll uh i'll talk

03:03about them but i have some cool wrestling stories but anyways i sucked at wrestling i only had one takedown in two fucking years i sucked so i i just totally relied on leg riding and and using it's actually called the guillotine it's actually not called the twister it's called the guillotine But when I started doing it in jujitsu, Higgin Machado and Jean-Jacques Machado would just call it the twister because the guillotine already existed. There's a lot of people out there that think that I, like, took this wrestling move and I said, I'm going to try to fool the world and change the name and say I invented it. There's thousands of people that think that. It's hilarious. In my books from day one, it was the guillotine. Hold on a second. You're being a little bit modest because you invented all these setups and turned it into a very high percentage finish. Yes, yes.

03:51You invented a lot of setups from a lot of different places. Yes. Where it became, I mean, none of that stuff existed. But this is the transition. So I ended up quitting wrestling. The work ethic you need to be a good wrestler is something that is just not in my body chemistry. I was not made to work really hard physically. I hated work, regular jobs. I knew that's why it was all about rock stardom or, or playing football. It was, I just wanted to be like a famous dude who just played for a living and got paid and was a fucking adored by everybody. That's what I wanted. I didn't want to work. I hated work. Of course. Who doesn't want to? Oh my God. What worked like actually like killed me inside. So it drove my artistic side. So once I realized that Mexicans don't play football, I'm like, oh my God, I was in ninth grade. and I was the slowest motherfucker out there. And that was it, you know?

04:48I had these dreams of playing football or making it a music. Football was crushed in ninth grade. Once everyone starts growing, you know what? Junior All-American and peewee football, that's fucked up. I played defensive lineman and middle linebacker in football. I actually thought I was going to be a defensive lineman and a middle linebacker because when you're eight and you're nine, everyone's the same size. and you know you did some brainwash going on that really thought i was going to be a football player i really thought i was until ninth grade shit oh man when when i was in sixth grade i was supposed to make the football team because in my neighborhood in my neighborhood uh i was pretty i was a pretty good football player around mexicans from like a really poor neighborhood i was pretty badass but when you go to school when you go when i went to sixth grade and in junior all-american

05:35and, you know, football, peewee football. I was pretty good. But once people start growing and start changing in sixth grade, I went to sixth grade and I didn't make the football team. They cut me. I was supposed to be the football star. I was so embarrassing, but it was flag football. It wasn't tackle. So in my head, I'm like, wait until ninth grade when I get to high school. I'm going to play some tackle. I'm going to show you what the fuck's going on. So that's what I was thinking. I go, fuck this year. Fuck sixth grade. So seventh grade, I transferred myself to a school far away that I only went to because there's more stories where I was driven away from my junior high school. So I went to another school. I tried out for the football team in the seventh grade. I got cut again, but it was flag football.

06:21But I was so embarrassed that I told my friends growing up, all my kids, I told them that, yeah, I made the team second string quarterback. But you know what? I got in a fight. So they had to cut me, man. It sucks. That's the story I told them. I told the kids that I grew up with thought I made the team, but I got cut because I got in a fight with a dude. That's hilarious. I kept that going. That's so funny. I was so embarrassed that I didn't make the team. I was so embarrassed. And then in the eighth grade, one of the guys that I grew up with went to that school too. He made the team. He was awesome. I didn't make the team again. And he never brought up the fact that he never asked anybody, didn't he make the team last year? That never got brought up. They never humiliated me. Maybe they were talking behind my back. Like, I don't know. No one ever brought it up, but I did lie about it.

07:11And I'm coming clean with it now. I totally lied about it. Don't you think for dudes that competition like that, any kind of competition, whether it's football or wrestling or anything, is so important for kids in their growing up to know how hard it is if you really want to get good at something? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. You got to tell Mexicans, Listen, if you're Mexican and you think you're going to be a football player, look at reality. Listen to me. Look at reality. There's one Mexican and he plays quarterback. You think you're going to be him? Get out of football. Get that shit out of your head if you're Mexican. Unless you've got some tall motherfuckers in your family. There's a couple Mexicans out there, but what are the odds? Kane Velasquez could have easily made it as a football player. Maybe. You think maybe? Dude, there's a lot more than just being an athlete. Everybody's an athlete in football.

07:53You've got to have some serious skills and serious magic. he could have just been a really strong athletic guy look at Matt Mitrione, strong and athletic, Matt Mitrione's a fucking athlete, you know he didn't so do you think that if those guys came over to the UFC, those super athletes, those NFL dudes, do you think that that's what we're seeing with like John Jones because that's the talk, that you know John Jones has two brothers I believe that are playing football right now I mean we've seen John Jones is a super athlete and there's dudes that are super athletes that are in maybe other sports and we're starting to see him in the UFC. That's like a big topic of discussion. Like what, how much of a difference does like serious athleticism make? It makes a huge difference. Hell yeah. John Jones has been a fucking doing, he's been doing mixed martial arts for only three years. Before that, he was a wrestler.

08:41Yeah. I mean, that's incredible. We're going to, you know what? It's already happened in boxing. Just look at what happened with boxing culturally. Yeah. Look what happened. It's interesting though, that football and it's, I guess it's just where the money is that the high money ones like football and basketball, they get the best athletes. Yes. I mean, even though the UFC has been around now for, you know, since 93, it's not been like a real accepted, you know, mainstream thing, but for like the last five or six years, right? Wouldn't you say? Yes, yes. You know, it's the super athletes that start jujitsu early, wrestling their whole lives, and striking early. They put it together like the Ruffo brothers. Yes. It's the best athletes that start off like the Ruffo brothers. You know, I mean, some people can start off with jujitsu and wrestling and striking early

09:31and achieve so much physically from it, but still, they weren't born with the athleticism. You know what I mean? You've got to be a natural. It's got to all come together. You've got to have all the pieces together to make it in the big sports that we see today. I mean, like, you can't start playing football when you're 22 and make the NFL. If you do, it may have happened once or twice, some African guy. I don't know. It may have happened. You know what I mean? You know, one of them Mutombo, Mkembe guys that started playing basketball for 18 months and he's in the NBA. You know what I'm saying? Every now and then you get those freaks. But generally, 98% of the time, look at what's going on with all the sports. Did they just go and find that dude and say, hey, you want to play basketball? I don't even know. I'm just making it up. How weird would that be?

10:18One of those dudes, I'm sure, Minute Bowl, Akumbe, Mutombo, I can't even say his name, but one of those dudes, I'm sure, started playing basketball late. Do you imagine what it must be like living like Minute Bowl? It's like you're living in dollhouses everywhere. Everywhere you go, they're dollhouses. Everyone's building is built for dolls. You have to hunch everywhere you go. At what height, naturally for girls, for girls, taller guys, naturally, the taller you are, the more attractive you are, naturally. But what, exactly what size, 6'8", 6'7", does it become a turnoff to girls? Because there must be a turnoff point. Or are they turned on by guys that are 7'3"? Does a girl look at a guy, 7'3", and it's totally attractive to him. He's 7'3", so rare, I love him so much. Or is it like, mmm, that's too tall. I don't like them that tall. It's ridiculous. Yeah. You know what I mean? What is it?

11:14Well, they would also worry, I think, evolutionarily about that. Is this real? Is that a real word? About the baby getting too big inside of them and get stuck coming out of their pussy and just blow it all out. If you've got a 7'3 dude, imagine how big his fucking babies are. If it's half his baby. You know, you've got a 15, 20-pound baby inside you, hooker. How about that? You know what? I will say this, though. I am not attracted to. Does it work like that? I'm not attracted to real tall chicks. I'm just, you know, and especially when they get fucking ridiculous. If a girl's six foot one, usually they got to be, they got to have really pretty faces. And usually their bodies start to get out of whack. You know what I mean? It's just like, but I have looked at big, tall ass chicks. And when you see them in public, the thoughts will race through my mind.

12:00Like, damn, that'd be nice just to pump a load into her and see what my baby would, see what my boy would turn out like. You know what I mean? How proud would I be of that fucking kid? you know what i mean he's six foot three and that's my son can you imagine he's six foot five and that's my son and he's beating ass todd duffy looking dude that's my son that'd be cool dude how cool would that be can you imagine that's what you look for in a girl that's how you who cares what she looks like just give me a son keep on two conversations at the same time can you imagine that's how you found girls that's like how you went to go date girls just by looking at them as a mother to a child like a super athlete like you i think well that's what um that dude who zulu Remember Zulu, the guy who fought Hicks and Gracie? Yeah. He has this story about the way he described it was a large negress

12:47and that he knew that she would make great babies for him. So he found her and he described like what he did, like how he shot loads into her to make a boy, that he knew that the way he was doing it was definitely to make a boy. He had some method. And then Zulu came out. Dude, I would pay $50. It's a great story. I would pay 50 bucks right now if you said I got the DVD, the documentary of that. I would go, I'll give you 50 bucks for that. I would even go 75 bucks, but I'd go, your dad's a lot, but God damn it. I'll still pay for it. That's an awesome story. You imagine how much of a pain in the ass it must be if you're a kid and your dad was some fighter and you're supposed to be a fighter too. You're like, God damn, really? I can't just have fun. I can't just go hang out. No, I got to go in a fight. Oh, shit. Or like any profession. Like his son His son didn't really seem like he wanted to be doing that

13:37Right? You know? I mean it's almost like I mean You almost have to If your dad is Zulu You know Your dad is this famous guy Who got in a bare knuckle cage fight With fucking Hicks and Gracie Back in the day Maybe he wasn't into it And he kind of got just like You know what? I don't want to work a regular job I got a name I can actually fight But he did do jiu-jitsu though He was alright at jiu-jitsu He was like a purple belt back when he fought so He was doing jiu-jitsu So in a weird way Zulu, like Jiu Jitsu beat Zulu, but Zulu's son was into Jiu Jitsu. That's pretty cool, right? Yeah. Do you remember that Hicks and Gracie footage? For those of you who don't know, Hicks and versus Zulu is one of the very, very first like no rules fights, you know, that was like where they planned it out. They had a whole arena full of people in Brazil checking this out. And a young Hicks and Gracie, he was like 18.

14:27I think he was a representative of Jiu Jitsu fought this giant super athlete black dude named Zulu. and this guy's just yoked he just just slamming him and hickson eventually gets his back and strangles him and it's one of those all-time great videos where people watch it like jujitsu guys back in the day it was like this is proof man this is proof like look if you get a good jujitsu you can overcome a guy like this like and you're he's only 18 it was like a big fucking deal and the footage is so bad but it looks cool it's like 50th generation all that footage it's dudes taping it off VHS somehow it got the DVD and then a copy and it already started off as terrible footage now it's like silhouetted it's like a yellow and black and orange type thing but it's classic one of the coolest things that I ever got out of being famous was I got to have dinner with Hickson

15:20that to me was one of the coolest things ever I had dinner with Hickson and then we went over his house and we watched fights and he broke down what dudes were doing wrong he was watching Mario Sperry fight in Coliseum and he was just talking about space he's talking about I give no space I give no space he was talking about so like such an intense dude you know like he was talking about you know like his philosophy on jiu-jitsu very simple we started zero and from zero we're going to one and we're not going back to zero and then from one we're going to two, from two to three to checkmate. That's where we're going to go. I was like, God damn! You get the chills talking to him. You're like, I'm sitting here talking to Hickson motherfucking Gracie, and he's giving me some intense life philosophy on how he strangles dudes. He's into it. We're watching all these fights, and he's breaking

16:15shit down. We watched the Funaki fight with him and Funaki. Those Hickson fights, man. God, I wish there were more of them. so annoying man so annoying that you don't get to see the the best supposed representative ever of jujitsu at the time fighting those guys you know fighting all mark coleman's and you know all the fucking guys that everyone was scared of mark kerr and all that shit how fascinating would that have been man yeah fuck that would have been awesome damn that would freak me out it really would um it would freak me out to sit and hang out with hicks and gracie he's cool as fuck that would freak me out he's a super nice guy his son is cool as fuck nobody else in jiu-jitsu like they would freak me out like hickson you know what i mean marcelo garcia to me marcelo garcia is the number one jiu-jitsu guy that's ever lived i think marcelo garcia is the number

17:07one guy that's ever lived you know uh but hickson would is the most uh uh mystical and rock star-ish you know what I mean he's like the fucker was in the Incredible Hulk you know what I mean you saw the Incredible Hulk with Ed Norton when Ed Norton is learning how to calm and control himself Hicks and Gracie slapping him in the face that's the man I would freak out if if like me and Hicks and would you're sitting there talking to Jiu Jitsu I mean it's not out of the question that might happen in the future for sure it might or might not I would love it that would be a fucking dream of mine to hang out and talk jiu-jitsu and break shit down to the core. For the people who don't know the history, Eddie Bravo tapped Hickson's brother, Hoyler, in Abu Dhabi in 2003 in this giant upset when Eddie was a brown belt, and he caught him with a triangle. So there's like perceived animosity sometimes because of that,

18:07but there's none exists. You've never been anything but respectful of any of those guys. You know, it's just there's a... I know that they were trying to do some sort of a rematch with you and Hoyler, But I guess that was badly organized. What happened is a promoter called or emailed me last October, maybe. October or November. And it was a guy that I've done privates for. I know who he is. And he's really high up in jujitsu in the Middle East and Abu Dhabi. And they're putting together, they were putting together a no-gi world championship in Abu Dhabi. They never had a no-gi one. They're doing Gi World Championships out there, but the no Gi ones, they wanted to have one in April. And they asked me if they wanted to have me and Hoyler as a super match. But they never contacted him? They told me. This is what happened. Then I emailed him back and I'm like, you know me, I'm down to rematch Hoyler anytime.

19:06I've always been down. I've never been the one denying it. I want one more match. I want to train.