John Anthony West

00:00two one and we're live Mr West Mr Mr Rogan pleasure to have you here in person doing it on Skype was fun it was nice and you are to this day the only podcast I've ever done on Skype really yep oh well yeah but I just I had to talk to you this like if you couldn't get down here there's got to be a way so it was nice to be able to do it that way but much nicer to see you here in person and much better to be here in person and actually what's responsible for be being being here in person is that I wouldn't actually come all this huge distance even to be on your show unless you paid me lots of money of course which you're not prepared to do but but because I have this conference coming up at the end of the week called CPAC which I'm surprised you didn't know about conference on pression and ancient knowledge uh which is the end of this week for those living in Southern

00:55California might want to take a take a take a look at the yeah tell tell everybody where where is where is that and what is it about it's Rancho Mirage which is a great name it means there is no Ranch but um Rancho Mirage which is somewhere near Palm Springs and it is about exactly what it says um conference on pression and ancient knowledge and it it questions to begin with the whole um how shall I say the whole the whole scenario the standard scenario about what causes procession which is supposedly a kind of a wobble of of the earth caused by nobody knows exactly what and the counter theory is that it isn't that it's that there is a dwarf star of some sort orbiting the Sun upsetting the balance of the celestial mechanical balance of it and that makes a difference you say well what's the difference one way or another there's procession it does make a a difference

01:51actually in the big picture because it means that our solar system basically conforms with all of the other solar systems which most mostly are dual in nature Sirius for example has the dwarf star that circles around at sirrius B that's responsible for all sorts of measurable phenomena so it starts off from there but then the ancient knowledge comes in because precession and this is a big mystery precession seems to be a factor of virtually every ancient Society be it sophisticated all China and India South America meso America or so-called primitive word I hate to use it simply means unintellectual eyes or not expressed incoherent Western Philosophy for whatever that's worth the the um but procession is is a known fact um discovered actually long time ago you'd think by now it would be common knowledge and everybody would teach it in school which is a sort of a joke it's

02:57kind of interesting that people don't teach it right is bizarre thing that it's it's so prominent in ancient cultures in ancient society that they literally ma this out this 26,000 years cycle this wobble of the earth and that we rarely talk about it ever no because it upsets the notion that there's a knowledge of this going back to ancient times presupposes that there's a very Advanced observational astronomy dating at a time when supposedly people were still living in trees so this is actually a big deal though hence the conference on precession and the ancient knowledge comes into it because understanding that there is a highly sophisticated scientific understanding that goes back not just to ancient Egypt itself but far thousands and thousand Millennia Beyond upsets what is effectively the reigning religion of today except it doesn't call itself a religion it calls itself

03:58science which is based supposedly on reason it's not none of those things are true it's not based on science and science is not based upon reason maybe we'll get time well some Sciences but archaeology in particular is very rigid in its ideas and a lot of it is based on the professors that have written books and that teach these ideas and they don't want to let them go and when new knowledge is discovered that challenges those ideas they fight it rigorously even if it's knowledge like the stuff that you exposed with Dr Ron shock Robert shock rather which was the water erosion on the Sphinx which we were talking about the PO before the podcast which is one of the best pieces of evidence because the last time there was rainfall heavy rainfall in the Nile Valley was what was it 9,000 BC is that what it was they debate it but it's anyway it's way before the beginning of

04:47dynastic Egypt and then it's a question of how of how old or when those Reigns fell because interesting bit of bit of thing here that I'm now at Liberty to um to relate publicly originally I wasn't when I first got shock over to Egypt which is a another twoh hour podcast in itself the the history of getting shock interested in this stuff and when he finally agreed very hesitantly and very skeptically to come along because he had to see the evidence for for himself and I scraped together a bit of money to bring him over and we got into the Spinx enclosure I don't think it was got in Legally I think we bribed our way in very early in the morning well in Egypt everything is possible and bribed our way in and he walked into the snx enclosure actually we get that up on the screen you'll see the uh you'll see the the the the level of the water the extent of the weathering of the water

05:45weathering and Chu looked at it and everybody else walks into the snx enclosure and has this actually this this shock of recognition of in the presence of this fabulous work of of sacred Arch sculpture in fact fact of sacred sculpture and shock looked but shock is a is a is a no that's not way back Jamie right to the beginning first slides and shock everybody else sees the snx as a work of art shock sees the Rocks he geologist and he back like this and he said wow these rocks look like they're hundreds of thousands of years old and he said don't quote me on that cuz that's of course absolute heresy that the most spectacular sculpture on Earth should be I mean tens of thousands of years actually even the the 4,500 years that are that it's associated with do not conform with anybody's idea of how civilization developed this goes back to your of of why the the academic I call

06:51it the quadem establishment is so is so passionately uh defends the old Paradigm the way that it does because the reigning Paradigm the reigning religion today which is not acknowledged that as religion is that this is this is the Church of progress and it's Credo just like the Virgin birth is The Credo of of early Christianity or present day Christianity not that they know what they're talking about um the the the The Credo of the Church of progress is a we are the most sophisticated human beings that have ever lived on the face of the planet with our hydrogen bombs and our nerve gas and our striped toothpaste and our Disneylands we're the best that ever was and secondly that progress as it's called goes in a straight line from primitive cavemen up to ourselves and when it becomes self-evident that in very very ancient times they had knowledge of precession which is an incredible thing

08:00to it's almost unimaginable that it happens through careful observation because the sun I don't know if all of the audience will know what what this is so maybe it's worth talking about the sun if if you look at the Spring Equinox now it's in the last the sun is rising against the last um the last bits of um of of um of Pisces it may even be in the earliest St of Aquarius and the gradually the Sun precesses as to say it goes backwards around the Zodiac in a cycle that takes 25,000 canonically 25,920 years to make a complete circle what this means is that it actually takes 72 years precisely for the sun to precess one degree so there is nothing who's going to be sitting there for 72 years watching the track of the Sun in a in a in a a cycle that takes 26,000 years to go around and observe that there's a discrepancy enough to write it down pass that information down and then

09:09why should they care it's somehow or another deeply connected with the civilization of that time and with our civilization and you look at the numbers involved this is another hours of conversation actually the 72 and the 73 are significant numbers in practically all of the developed numerologically based society so in Egypt set who's the bad guy uh derivative probably Satan is derived from set He's the bad guy but he's also a great God that is to say the gods are not gods in any superstitious fashion they represent the embodiments of cosmic principles so excuse me set is he who fixes spirit and matter and the whole basis of an esoteric of any esoteric Doctrine including most of the religions that are around even today in their depraved forms the objective of any esoteric discipline is to free ourselves individually and collectively from our imprisonment in matter this is the Quest for

10:15immortality and so in some sense or another that processional cycle is very important and the numbers are important in the myth which again we don't have time for but Osiris is the good King actually this is all very carefully uh expounded very brilliantly in fact in the hamlet myth which becomes Shakespeare's Hamlet and then in The Lion King in Disney's Lion King the movie especially which is really pretty brilliant anyway set is the good King who is beloved by his people and set is his wicked brother his evil brother um who's determined to unseat him and steal his sister wife Isis while he's at it anyway set sets a trap for Osiris and it's it's set and is 72 followers so 72 is this number associated with time and the 72 to 73 is a very significant ratio actually which pervades the philosophies of as I said of all of the esoteric civilizations so all of this stuff instead of all of this

11:24instead of being the kind of ask a quadem the same guy you were talking about earlier who still thinks the six is weathered by sand ask one of those what ancient myth is about they say oh well it's just a fabrication written by primitive people who are trying to explain the mysteries of the universe it's the other way around the Primitive people are the ones with the phds and back then they not only did they understand these scientific these astronomical these astronomical facts but they orchestrated their whole civilization around those facts and the more the deeper you get into this the more miraculous um the the extent of ancient knowledge becomes now what is the mainstream explanation when they when they talk about the prevailance of the number 72 and their understanding of the procession of the equinoxes do they address it at all like what how do they

12:21how do they sort of explain how they knew about this 26,000 year cycle I was a very quick answer to that actually for a change no they don't explain they just ignore it is it sort of like the Parthenon the Acropolis you know which one the Acropolis is the building and the parthenon's the structure right is that what it is no both both are temples both are buildings but what is the uh what's the the the base the base is the one that they don't explain right they just go well we don't really exactly that's the gigantic enormous base the huge stones that the Acropolis is built on right which one is the acropol I always screw those up copis is the one on top right okay see the Parthenon is what they're built on this the the base structure or whatever it is the the the bottom area I don't I don't know actually I've never really looked that deeply into it other than that there's a

13:14friend of mine who's worked with the proportions and the sophisticated proportions of the parthona even though it's much later than Egypt much later than Egypt but no one knows who built it and no one knows why they built it it's one of those weird ones where it's not really described in the text and the Acropolis is built upon it um at least that's been explained to me by by Greek historians by people who understand Greek history they just really don't understand where it came from well I believe that's true except that I think it's pretty certain that it's not it's not of Egyptian age although if you're talking about gigantic paving stones at the bottom of it I said I don't know but whenever you see those gigantic Stones that's a a pretty good indication of an earlier period of construction as at balbec they have these right monolithic 12200 ton blocks that they think the Romans put in

14:14there that's in Lebanon right that's Lebanon yeah so there's a ton of this of this kind of indirect evidence and when you put it all together you get there's enough of a picture there so that it over rows the basis I said what's important about it is in one sense who cares in another sense it overthrows the supposed scientific basis of the Church of progress that we're the most sophisticated people that ever were and we can do whatever we please with this once glorious planet of ours without worrying about it because we're the best and everyone before us was primitive well there's a lot of new evidence now since you started your work um particularly all that nuclear glass that they fonding that corresponds with meteor impacts throughout Europe and Asia and that that's somewhere around the end of the Ice Age really in the same sort of uh time period when they do

15:08core samples and they find this nuclear glass it's all at around 10,000 plus years ago um that kind of stuff really starts to indicate that we're looking at possibly an event that might have shaped human history or a reset of a large percentage of of the people on this planet where civilization and many areas was all but wiped out and then they had to rebuild again yeah this is I mean actually this is coming to the four now there's a lot of evidence for these I think it's the tech ties they're called um shock thinks that they are the result of a gigantic CME coronal mass ejection giant solar flares and there's a lot of evidence with this actually we know if we get into talking about it here I will at CPAC for sure the shock will be at CPAC anyway the that it's but it's it's unlikely that it's actually a nuclear blast because it would be inconceivable of well at least

16:08by our standards a a man-made nuclear blast although when you go into the Hindu texts and I think it's the upanishads where they describe what sounds like I mean it's described as a battle of the gods but for all the world it does sound like like a nuclear configration I mean a human-made nuclear configuration I'm not I don't think anybody knows enough to say what it is other than that that story is in there and in fact one of the I'm a because I'm a writer by trade I'm very interested in the way that that language is used and so myth is one of the one of the principle misleading words that um if you look in the dictionary the first D the first meaning that it gives for myth is a lie you always talk about the myth you know MythBusters ghost that myth is a lie but the Ancients didn't see myth as a lie what myth actually is when you get into it fairly deeply is it is the

17:17it is the interplay of cosmic principles described as drama rather than in mathematics so once you get a a good look this is an extraordinary but opaque book called Hamlet's Mill by Georgio Dan santiana and herto Von deant who were historians of science at MIT which is about as respectable as credentials can be so as as soon as as soon as myth is understood as having both a rigorous scientific as well as as well as philosophical and spiritual base the whole the whole understanding of myth turns around and you see for example in Hamlet in Shakespeare's Hamlet which is based upon a Danish it's based upon a Danish folk tale um which then becomes quite brilliantly actually The Lion King uh in the Disney film you see how the myth I mean in other words you could decode the Osiris Isis Horus myth as as pure as pure science and might call A A Spiritual or a sacred

18:31science and at the same time it's a ripping good story when you when you put it that way a story because then everybody can understand it even if they don't understand it or even if they can't articulate what they've understood the power of the story soaks through so myth is actually the more you know about it my case it's not that much but at least it's better than nothing um the more you know about it the more amazing mythology becomes that they should have been able to put together these complex High hierarchical esoteric Concepts in a way that resonates as a story otherwise in so far as I mean our own cosmology is next to impossible to understand unless you're a cosmologist and schooled in the abstract mathematics that make the thing work I mean I can't I mean I the mathematics is absolutely Beyond me but some of my astrophysicist friends can explain it to me in such a way that I

19:36understand but it still doesn't have any emotional impact so essentially what you're saying is that they didn't have the sort of scientific uh discipline that we have today they didn't understand a lot of the things that we know today as far as uh the way um academics or scientists relay information about space or about cosmology so what they did is they combined theater and story with the actual facts that they knew so that was the way they would relay this stuff and that's the way that stuff would be passed on that information be passed on through these stories but in those stories was an actual history of the world itself as far as they knew through through through through that and through symbolism and this is this is an infinitely Superior way of communicating knowledge because you don't have to be an expert you it soaks into your bones in such a way that

20:33it it directs personally and collectively people's behaviors and it's my firm conviction that this is why Egypt lasted as a coherent civilization even in its dynastic form for 3,500 years and our Lunatic Society is coming apart at the seams in front of our eyes in 300 years I wanted to talk to you about the the written history of Egypt and the hieroglyphic history of the Pharaohs because uh I remember I think it was from magical Egypt 1 you were talking about the historical record like what they have written down in the hieroglyphs about the Pharaohs that it goes back far beyond what we think of as the birth of Egypt you know with the this the construction the the Great Pyramid I believe they put it modern academics put it at 2,500 BC correct yes and they you believe that it's possible that Egypt existed as far back as I think you said 34,000 years well that's

21:32that's their own that's the Egyptians account not mine right as as expressed as expressed in a couple of in a couple of in in a in a stone tablet called the Poo Stone because it's now in palmo Italy um and in a very fragmentary Papyrus called the Turin Papyrus which is now in Turin and both of these documents one is a stone Steeler and the other is a Papyrus tell or recount um long periods when Egypt was ruled first by the neru which means the gods themselves which I take to mean fully fully realized Divine human beings in other words human beings that have attained that have have passed the the test of the quest of for immortality who are in effect they've outsmarted death or they've outd developed you why do you believe this um because their Works speak for themselves as it were um and the the the level of the now we talk going back even to even to um to dynastic Egypt because

22:48the temples themselves and the level of art involved particularly in the sculpture is such that standard might say St genius is rare enough but standard human genius doesn't seem to apply to these incredible constructions and the qu academics simply dismiss it out of hand as really very talented um exponents of a barbaric and um and and primitive understanding of the cosmos I leading my trips there which I do as you know a few times a year next one coming up by the way anybody listening in could people go on one of those trips with you oh it's very easy to pay okay where do they where do they find you though on on my website um johnanthony west.com yeah on the website or or my my email J aw Spinx aol.com oh you messed up you gave out your email that's a disaster my people horrible people going to send you naked pictures for sure oh not of themselves I hope

23:55but I familiar with the term dickpick because it's I am now yeah there you go um so your your thoughts are that these people that live 34,000 years ago were incredibly Advanced like much further advanced than we are today which doesn't take much but right when you understand what's involved but I I know what you're saying but I mean we we're pretty damn Advanced compared to people a few hundred years ago correct in certain ways we are we still can't we couldn't we couldn't and wouldn't build the the Cathedral of chatra mhm there's nobody there's nobody alive to the best of my knowledge who could produce a building that is based upon sacred principles that even comes close to sacred geometry and Sac even that I mean a few people really know quite a bit about this but they couldn't design chra and that's well that's you know 12th century anyway what what was it about

24:51Egypt in that time in particular that in your opinion I mean obviously there's a lot of speculation going on here because there's so little evidence from 34,000 years ago but what is it about that area that you think develop people at such an incredibly high level cuz unless there's more evidence to be found there doesn't seem to be any parallels anywhere else in the world like that one spot actually there's there there's a fairly there's a fairly simple explanation for that for a change as most of the stuff is so complicated but just to go back a bit to the the rule by the neru the gods themselves and the names of those rules rers are given and the length of time that they reigned and then there's another group of the line the line the line of time is incredible right well this is where we're getting the 34,000 36,000 BC from yeah because you add the

25:41the the times up the Turin Papyrus has a similar thing of the rain rule of the neru and the rule by that's called the shemsu hor the the followers or the the followers of the companions of Horus and again the names are given in the regnal years and when you add those all up together you get around 34 36,000 BC weren some I'm sorry to interrupt you but weren't some of the Pharaohs didn't they live hundreds of years there's no evidence for that but wasn't it written that they did I'm not sure I'm not sure what those dates are actually I've not actually deeply researched them I get those figures from SCH SCH deik great genius with the unpronouncable name who put together the whole interpretation of symbol Egypt from which my work is derived I mean I regard myself as schwers Boswell um making his basically impenetrable work um accessible accessible to dummies like me

26:44no smart guy smart guys like you not dummies like politicians and qu academics no so but what when you're talking about 34,000 years I mean the average person today lives to be about 80 years you're talking about an incredible number of arrows then yeah you are and so all that is depicted apparently apparently the names the names are given that's I get that from schwaller from the one from the one long chapter he wrote called the the the the chronology chorography he calls it not the word for it but the chronology of Egypt where he's looking to back up to to from a scholarly point of view from a The Scholar the argument that the Egyptians knew what they were talking about when they were assigning these long Reigns that these are not fictitious um this is not made up history in order to you know fool the people who couldn't read the hieroglyphs anyway only the scribes could read the

27:44hieroglyphs so schwaller wrote this very long and thoughtful and scholarly um lecture sorry not lecture but chapter and then at the very end of it his throwaway line and is of course the Great Sphinx of Giza has been weathered shows unmistakable signs of aquatic erosion and that was my little Epiphany because I picked up on that and said wow the rest of this isn't science but that's geology and if the geologists can be you know can can will agree that this is this cannot have taken place since 2500 years 2500 BC when the sinks is supposedly built this will upset the whole Paradigm all of civilization will have to be our view of civilization will have to be rethought and that's began this long long now four decade long quest to find somebody to back it up and we're now my sense of it is closing in on beating down the opposition and this will be another

28:47thing actually in fact I'll probably be talking about at CPAC but probably would said a little bit more politely than I feel it necessary to talk about here I'm here with you and that is riffing on a line that probably everybody who tunes into this is pro is familiar with Victor Hugo the the the French poet um novelist a dramatist of the 19th century France actually France's most uh most popular poet of the of the 19th century was V Victor Hugo and it was Victor Hugo who wrote the famous line there's one thing stronger than all the armies in the world and that is an idea whose time has come you know that line right everybody knows that line but what Victor Hugo didn't think of or if he did he didn't express it was that the second strongest thing in the world is an idea whose time has not yet gone and since it is it is a matter of record that all of the armies

29:50in the world be a military economic Financial cultural agricultural even wherever there's a paradigm there's an army devoted to protecting that Paradigm and this is where we stand now that that the idea whose time has come only comes when the second strongest the armies of the second strongest thing in the world are beaten down in are beaten into the ground and somebody breaches the port Cullis to the Ivory Tower where all of these guys live and this is a particular interest to me because I am a scholar by default but a satirist by nature and really my whole my whole adult life has been devoted to proving a vision that I had at the age of 13 or so that I was born into a lunatic asylum and at the age of about 19 it a very uncomfortable place to live where everybody called it progress and I thought it was crazy and at that age about 19 or so I knew I wanted to do which was to be the little

31:00boy who said the emperor has no clothes and to prove to everybody's satisfaction that indeed the emperor has no clothes and it's a lunatic asylum the end result took me a few couple of decades to realize that was that um in in real life what happens is that no the people all don't say whoa look the emperor has no clothes and everybody lives happily ever after what happens is that the disgraced Emperor gets goes back to his goes back to his Palace and regroups the Empire and at the end they all of the all of the forces of Empire conspire to prove to everyone that the emperor's clothes are real but it's the child who's imaginary we were talking about this before the podcast and this is a really fascinating aspect of uh this discussion was your when I first became your aware of your work was that Charlton hon narrated documentary about the Aging of the Sphinx The Mystery of the Sphinx

31:57which believe was on NBC mhm uh what what I thought was shocking uh was when Dr shock was speaking to that egyptologist who was saying what evidence is there of a culture that existed 7,000 years before ancient Egypt what there's no evidence he's like there is no and he was laughing and the way he was doing there was so much ego involved in what he was saying I was like wow this is not how I would picture and egyptologist laughing well that got me curious I started getting into it why would anybody think like that and then I realized oh these guys write books and they teach lectures and they teach classes based on this information that they're they're teaching and now this information has been shown to be not true anymore when Dr shock was showing this water erosion he was saying that this was all before the discovery of gockley Tey and once they discovered gockley Tey now they

32:52know that there is a sophisticated structure capable of massive Stones circles that that was 12,000 years ago at least when it was intentionally buried so it could have easily been several thousand years old then we don't know but we know at least 12,000 years ago someone was capable of incredible design and incredible stone structures with three-dimensional animals carved into these stone structures which is very sophisticated now has that guy been talked to since then and has he amended his position on it as far as I know he has and I know ler reasonably well we're civil to each other and it won't be long now I mean he's the he's he's one of the generals of the uh in in in in in the in the army of the idea whose time has not yet gone and his his time is coming up pretty shortly does he address gole tappy now mean because his whole his whole position was there was no

33:53civilization what evidence is there well now that you have this evidence what does he say I haven't actually spoken to him and I don't know if anyone has I see him in Egypt every once in a while I don't know if anyone has and I I ran into him fairly recently I just said hello and I'm I don't think I'd really I'd necessarily want to bring it up with him um off the Record I'd rather have him with the cameras on us right and and just see what happens but other wise otherwise otherwise he's a dead duck but it's just so he seems to be just clinging to this idea because he he can like mainstream Academia hasn't accepted this predating of the Sphinx or or also the the difference in the structures like the difference in the construction methods that were used one of the more fascinating things that you sort of highlighted in your ancient Egypt uh series magical Egypt which is fantastic

34:54and I highly recommend it to anybody who is even remotely curious this you will be sucked in in an incredible way it got to the point my wife was going walking by the TV she's like Jesus Christ you watching Egypt again and I'm like it's it's like six discs it goes on forever eight um so the different there's a clear distinction between the older methods of construction and the newer methods they use different methods and it's really obvious to someone like me who's not even a I don't know anything about it but you could see the difference and also that these older structures were below the newer structures like you had to dig down to get them that's right yes but the fact that they don't address that the fact that this isn't it's like they want to lump this all into the same people is kind of crazy it it it is and but as long as they can get away with it they

35:41will continue to get away with it as I said the second the second strongest thing in the world is the idea whose time has not yet gone and anybody who doesn't let's say among myself myself and my colleagues who are all in this let's say the the the quest to prove to demonstrate that advanced civilization existed in the very distant past which is in my case and some other cases not necessarily but in mine it's because that opens the door in and of itself doesn't doesn't affect the price of eggs but on a much more profound philosophical level once it's understood that that understanding that Civilization goes back way much much further leads to the understanding and the acceptance that our role our destiny as human beings is to achieve immortality this is as simple as all as that otherwise it's just a head trip in other words if it's not understood that we have a role to play in this Grand

36:48Cosmic scheme there's no civilization possible what do you mean by that our our our goal is to achieve immortality do you mean as individuals or do you mean like and what's in what way that we we arrive at a level of Consciousness that is not subject to the death of the physical body all all of religion is based upon that all of the the stories of the Saints and the rishis and the Masters and so on is based upon all of it is based upon their experiences that have led them to this understanding if it's just a head trip it's no good it has to be part of your very being the purpose of sacred art is to and of Sacred Music when it works is to communicate even if only momentarily and fragmentarily this understanding that there's something else and speaking from my own personal experiences I've never gone through a full-blown mystical experience but I've had lots of these

37:50moments particularly in Egypt a long study and these moments in Egypt where there's this sudden realization that the world as it as it as it manifests to our our our faculties you know our our our normal faculties is not the only World there is there's something else beyond that which was understood a lot better in those days than now and actually funly enough I forgot to mention this but I don't know if you know this I've been spent the last couple of years of sidetracked from my regular work working on a book um written by a friend of mine good friend um who was not a writer so I helped him with the editing and contributed to it and this is a maybe the definitive book on N ndes you know what those are right near-death experien near-death experiences he was a Christian Pastor a rare guy who actually lived what he preached named David Solomon and as he

38:53had collected all of this material huge amount of material that he was trying to systematize because this is now a it's certainly not a common experience but there are like 5,000 verifiable accounts of people who have been clinically dead and who have been revived usually through Modern methods because now one of the reasons why it's now so common and before it was reserved for the Saints the great Saints and the mystics that modern medicine has has has improved to such an extent that if you get to these people quick ly enough any number of people who are clinically dead for X number of minutes you know not two days but minutes sometimes more extended period than that come back with these Tales of this realm beyond that of the senses a realm of higher Consciousness basically what it is what they've experienced is is Grace in Christian terms it's Grace it's a it's a moment and they come

39:57back transformed they come back convinced that everything that they were doing before is either nonsense or unimportant and they often come back with a mission even though they don't have the schooling let's say they don't understand philosophically or spiritually what they've experienced they know what they've experienced and they laugh at the debunkers who are saying it's all hallucination of the brain dying brain this is all garbage what they've experienced they've experienced and David put these together in a systematic fashion and then as he was just he collected all this material and I was telling him this is he's a good friend he financed our trip to golee five six years ago and he started losing his balance and he was a taiichi guy who you know knows a lot about balance also a bonai master and a Christian Pastor unusual guy and he started losing his balance and it wasn't

40:49going away and he the the doctors finally figured out what he had what was wrong with him and he had a Goma gly blastoma something I forget something do you know what a Goma is it's a form of brain cancer that is 100% fatal it's the only thing you have is a you can't determine the timeline and they gave him something like 10 months to 12 months to live he actually lived three years and at that point he had all of this material and I told him when he was telling me about I said D I should write a book this is really good stuff the way you're doing it is not like anybody else has ever done and he said no I'm not a writer I'm just doing this and then when he found out the diagnosis then he had a mission which was to get the book out but he wasn't a writer so he drafted me in to to put the words in right order and he lasted just long enough to get the book

41:41finished and get it published and it's it's it's really if this went viral it could make a difference it's called he was very good at titles David it's called um it's called the dead Saints Chronicles subtitle a um a Zen Journey Through the Christian afterlife and it it really it really is an an absolutely extraordinary book and it becomes quite clear when you go through this that what people have experienced is a state of grace that's not all the same I mean some people it's more profound and some people less so but all of these people are unprepared for what they've experienced and all of them come back transformed and of course the quads this is one of the ways they protect them El peer review is one way and the other is their insistence who the hell made gave them the right to make the rules from science that that apply to science or they're scientists

42:37that that makes gives them the right to make the rules no the rules are the rules and one of their insist one of their Chief element one of the chief ways in which they protect themselves is to insist that anecdotal evidence personal experience doesn't count I don't know about you but I wouldn't Buy a cookbook by someone who's never fried an egg so these are guys who've never fried a spiritual egg and these 5,000 accounts are people who have actually been there to this right Superior realm and come back to talk about it no but you say you you haven't had a mystical experience you mean a psychedelic experience no that I've had yes you've had psychedelic experience what which kind of psychedelic experiences have you had oh I've done iasa and I've done and I've done you know you name it I so then you're so you've done DMT yes and I've done and I've done uh not masculine but um the

43:32other one acid okay all of those no the experiences come actually for me as I said they're not a major it's not the state of grace that these people are talking about you didn't experience a state of grace when you did DMT not quite no not not compared to what the the the uh the ND the can I ask how many times you've done it one one time okay did you do a lot of it I don't know you got to do a lot of it did you just dissolve did you go to this crazy geometric infinite Universe where you're you didn't get in there then I didn't get in there I might how long are you in town for pardon how long you in town for only until tomorrow we going have to make something happen you got to you got to go deeper that experience that people are having a near-death experience is mirrored by the same exp I'm sure are you aware of Dr Rick strasman oh yeah sure sure um he I believe actually was

44:24in that's right met chance was doing the brilliant guy and so important because what he has created by his book uh DMT The Spirit Molecule they did these clinical tests giving people DMT in a clinical setting and uh at the University of New Mexico and what they found was these people achieve this incredible state of understanding more relaxed uh vision of the future they're more confident like the the the idea I this is also mirrored by some of the John Hopkins test that they've done with people with psilocybin where people have uh you know they have just a much better Outlook about the future they don't think that this is it and that whatever happens to them when they're having these trips and the way strasman did it is much more intense than most people do it because they did intravenous doses which uh last longer a typical DMT trip lasts only about 15 minutes unless you

45:19just jump right back in which is what I usually do but he um he gave these people intravenous doses which to take them just very deep for more than a half an hour and they all had very similar stories and similar stories to people that have had near-death experiences I've had friends that have had near-death experiences and when they talk about it it's very similar to the way I've talked to other people that have had DMT trips where they are in the presence of this Divine greatness this something so but that is also a chemical that's produced by the brain now this is where uh neuroscientists step in and say well what your experience is is experiencing is some sort of a h ination and uh they might be right but it also might be some sort of a chemical Gateway that your brain produces when we we really don't know and that might be the way the soul quote unquote air quotes

46:09whatever but for lack of a better word transitions to this next stage of life now when the anecdotal evidence that you're talking about is measured up what's interesting about it is similar accounts over and over and over and over again that's right the people that can remember things they remember this incredibly Divine experience but you know the question becomes is that experience and this is something that I've been boun bouncing around in my head a lot lately is that experience a hallucination or is that experience an actual real experience in a divine presence and does it matter because is it the same thing no matter what if you just think you're experiencing God and divine greatness because you're creating it in your mind versus actually Experiencing God and divine greatness isn't the experience the exact same thing and is is our mind locked into the

46:59idea of a physical thing like this laptop I can pick it up I can drop it I know it has weight I can touch it I can measure the width we can't do that with psychedelic experiences we can't do that with Transcendent experiences we can't do that with mystical experiences you can't measure them you can't put them in a bag and take it home with you but it might be the same thing it's entirely possible that this is what many many ancient cultures experienced as well they found the use of psychedelics very off for early on and this is also something that you documented in your work and they they documented it very clearly in a lot of the Egyptian work they had deep understanding and knowledge exactly Joe this is one of the important things about the drugs the drugs and the nde experiences in my view the nde experien is more so because there's nothing in the way there's

47:51nothing obstructing it they're dead and this is where they go with the drugs you're you don't you you know you're you um mhm in these experiences and the problem interesting the problem I want it's not a problem the wrong word but um with the nde experiences I mean absolutely Joe sixpack everybody Ordinary People many of them some of them even atheists go through this and come back literally transform their whole lives that changed by it with the drugs it really is for the most part it's a trip it doesn't have this let's say this lasting transformational value it does on some people it does sometimes yes the John Hopkins study showed that a lot of people decades later had a vastly improved quality of life different outlook on things and especially when you're dealing with terminally ill patients oh well when they've given it to terminally ill patients significant

48:49lessening of anxiety and fear of death oh sure it it would be but the hallucination this is another scam by the by the so-called rationalists who in fact are not there this idea that it's a hallucination and what's a hallucination and what's it what's its evolutionary value why should there be where's the hallucination Gene this is all actually and what it actually is is not based upon reason as they like to as they like to as they promote themselves what it is actually is the rationalization of their own inner emptiness they can't handle the fact that there might be something else and in fact their whole intellectual lives are consecrated to the to proving that life is indeed as meaningless as their own but is that what it is or is it they're just trying to look at some sort of uh give it a a critical objective View and and go over all the possibilities we know that drugs do

49:47affect the mind in very strange ways we know some people take drugs and it completely distorts their reality alcohol is a perfect example of that right it's a great drug for distorting reality you can watch someone get drunk and have a very bizarre version of the what of what they're looking at um there's many drugs that change the way people look at things like physically the way they see things they will hallucinate they they do so we know that drugs have an effect on people that's right I mean it seems rational though that a scientist would look at those things and try to find some sort of a scientific explanation for the chemical process that's going on in the mind the way it's affecting the visual cortex and the things that the person is quote unquote hallucinating un lying that contention which is not science in and of itself that is just a hypothesis that

50:32is speculation and I said what is based upon is protecting their own vision of the world which is that the universe is is an accident and anything that is Mystical or or so-called spiritual is hallucinatory and they have the answers and these people as far as I'm concerned are more dangerous even than politicians they are they are are put it this way um it's the it the Church of progress is the religion of the of the emotionally defective the spiritually dyslexic and the philosophically depraved but to put it into into other terms you actually martial arts master I studied with briefly used to say in his Japanese accent if you want if you want happiness in this crazy world you do not talk about moon beam to the blind or sun or moon beams to the blind music to the deaf and you absolutely do not talk about sex to Unix they just get angry um and this is what you're dealing with

51:39when you're dealing with these with with these intellectually based scientists These Are Spiritual emotional and and philosophical um Unix and it's no it's no surprise when they behave the way they do who's surprised who's surprised when the when the when the Unix snigger behind the Sultan's back and and deride his passions the problem is that with our church of our church of progress when the Unix take over the palace and call their terrible disability reason then the Empire is cooked you sound like a person who's been deeply in the trenches against academics for years you sound like a bitter man John Anthony West no I'm not bitter I'm not bitter I'm just realistic and I know what's involved from being in The Trenches I know what's involved in fighting this particular battle which I've been engaged in all of these all of these all of these decades particularly yours

52:36because you've been dealing with archaeologists they're trying to refute evidence they're all just as bad as each other what I bring to the table that my colleague Graham Hancock was an excellent writer and some of the others who are very brilliant people rert sheld is also a very good friend and a very good scientist what they are not is satirists by nature and I yeah now let's go back to this idea that human beings need to uh fulfill immortality or that there is our ultimate Destiny to fulfill immortality what what do you mean by that exactly because if there is an afterlife right if we do die and then we go to this other place that people are seeing in these near-death experiences why do we have to do anything why can't we just sit around and wait for our physical meat body to stop working and then transcend well this is again this gets addressed in in David's book in in the

53:29dead Saints Chronicles um because it's our job to transcend in other words if if we don't do anything well something happens to us and again here's where the the near-death experiences get interesting because almost none of them are negative what happens to the real evil monster people that are out there in this world I mean does Dick Cheney go to heaven GE if he do I don't want to be there that would be hilarious um you imagine if you get to heaven you're like dick chenes up here you got to be kidding me man I should have done so much more I mean he's in the special waterboarding division where they have well maybe he just you know realizes it no but seriously this is the purpose you'd never know it from listening to these guys this is the purpose of religion it's a it's a practice it's not something you believe in it's something that you do and if you don't do it you

54:24don't unless you go through an ND and you come back and you start doing it in one way or another but it's my own personal conviction is that unless enough people are doing this and getting somewhere with it it's not as though everyone's going to become enlightened they probably are again going deep into the whole theories of reincarnation and return and so on which is part of Egypt and part of the all of the Eastern cultures reincarnation no chances are you don't make it in in one lifetime but these things let's say there's a report card a Divine report card where these things are measured I me Jesus says and so far as I mean the Bible is is a is a scholarly morass and I I usually try to avoid using it as as evidence for things because it's so open to interpretation and it's so convoluted to begin with and who knows what's original to it and what isn't but you know many are called few

55:24are chosen but those who are called who do their work or who try to do their work reap the benefit of that on an internal level that the quac ademic can't measure and don't want to measure and don't believe can be measured but somebody with a presence is very different from somebody without any Presence at all you see that in the world around you as you go yeah I want to bring you back around though because I'm still confused what do you mean by it's our goal to achieve in uh immortality like what do you mean by that do you mean like the physical body no longer dies and do you believe that like whatever I read I do not remember what I read but what I read about the early the earliest depictions of the Pharaohs that was that they lived an extraordinary length of time similar to like Noah like Noah in the in the Bible was 600 years old when he built the ark

56:18correct something like that something like that um and that this is a common thing now now is this because the way we think of time they had a different interpretation of it and what 600 years is to us is not 600 years to them is it like like in the Quran when they talk about 72 virgins that you know when the expression 72 virgins is not really 72 what that what 72 virgins means well it's interesting because it's 72 again what it means is a a large it's like a shitload like someone saying a shitload you'll have 72 virgins in heaven like oh whoa what am I going to do with all them you know it's just a a large number it's it's the the actual it's not it's not the actual number 72 it's just sort of a a euphemism for a large number that's one of the theories of all of those different strange numbers in the Bible and I don't know any better than anyone else as far as I know the Pharaohs lived

57:10ordinary lifespans and of course there's no evidence physical evidence of the the the Pharaohs the neru and when the Divine rule is ruled and the shuar when they ruled there's none of that and we simply don't know the Tibetans have accounts if you want to believe the Tibetans and I tend to I don't see why they should lie of great llamas who live several hundred years and go when they choose to I don't know simple as that and actually it's a it's a you might say it's a it's it's it's no more than kind of mental it's an interesting hypothesis like big foot but who cares um the only thing that actually counts is the inner work and if you're doing it you're doing it and and if you're not doing it and you don't measure yourself either as soon as you're looking for results that's already a way of not getting them very it's a very delicate and yet profound subject and you got to good zen master

58:13the stuff is still around there are there are there are Masters my own my own Focus as you probably know or maybe you don't is the ger Jeff work because when I came across ger Jeff an extraordinary character he was the first person I'd ever encountered uously he died in 49 and I found out about his work in the 60s um who was as contemptuous of Western Civilization as I was the difference was that he knew how to live in it and I didn't and at a certain point point I figured out particularly what you're talking about before the the the the my life in the trenches good subtitle for something I still don't understand what you mean about achieving immortality so if you're not talking about physical imort immortal you're not talking about someone living a thousand years and plus no absolutely what are you talking about you're talking about the ideas that they

59:03they promote transcending and moving on no I'm talking about a level of Consciousness that transcends death that the body dies and that understanding is that that understanding is where you are I mean the drugs do that you have these moments that with the body you come back cuz you get out of the trip let's say it's it's it's an eternal trip and the Ancients talk about that all the time even even in their mythology which is always taken as as fanciful let's say in the pyramid texts the the script reads that the the when the Pharaoh dies and the Pharaoh being let's say the embodiment of the realized and enlightened sold when the Pharaoh dies his bar unites with his CA his Spirit unites with his Essence becomes a star a star and traveled with raah across the sky in his boat of millions of years this is and in fact I've often wondered if the Egyptians actually knew what he was

60:08being what they were talking about and the Stars themselves are the realizations of enlightened Souls it's as good as any other explanation that they that they they're simply balls of gas how did that get there that automatically at some point accidentally um col less into galaxies and nebula and universes and the whole thing goes on meaninglessly um I don't think anybody thinks it's meaningless but it is kind of fascinating that stars themselves are the only reason why people are alive like we are made of Stardust which is just we are indeed incredible to think that the seeds of human life and all carbon life in fact come from a star exploding like wow like everything that you see like the sun the sun is a seed for future life that's bananas EX exactly yeah well that that you you've answered your own question as it were that that that that understanding and I wouldn't even call

61:05it a philosophy it's an understanding by people who understand more than we do certainly more than I do but but isn't but if you say that's our goal to achieve immortality that sounds like we're going to get it anyway no matter what well no actually with the NDS no what happens not really no they they they've had their their experience they've had their X number of minutes of Grace and come back and come back um transformed and realize that they have to live their lives differently they don't even talk about you know about the the future or anything like that I mean this is a very obviously a very big thing that that not many that not many people evidently achieve but the effort like everything else the effort is the effort and it's it's on the scorecard it's like it's not so different from everybody who picks up a violin isn't going to end up in in in Carnegie Hall and everyone who

62:03picks up a baseball bat isn't going to play center field for the Mets or any other team it's but it's the effort that counts and it's it's a certain kind of directed and intelligent effort that is painful in its own way that but carries its own reward and it it manifests in a kind of presence and just in our daily lives even with people who are not consciously doing it but they're doing it they have a different level of presence and you notice it when you meet them now what is it that you think these ancient Egyptians when you talk about the earliest Egyptians that you believe had achieved this incredible state of mind or Consciousness what is it that you think that they did to achieve that like why were they so Advanced why were they so beyond what we think of when we think of even the possibility of a human being living 34 plus thousand years ago like how did how

63:07did they achieve that we don't know we don't know all we can see all we can see is the manifestation of of what they did when we actually when you really understand Egypt even to the extent that I do you you you regard it as miraculous you don't see how beings ostensibly like ourselves should even imagine such things much less be able to do it and this is what I'll pitch my trip okay I often start a lecture off by saying that Egypt is like sex that gets everybody's attention why is it like sex because you can read books about it and that's informational of sorts you can look at pictures that's a different kind or a different level of information but until you've experienced it you you do not and cannot understand it and Egypt is like that magically that magical Egypt series is as close as anyone has ever come to communicating the the Wonder and the magic that is Egypt as anyone has ever

64:14has ever it way Head and Shoulders above what anybody else has done and that's my genius partner chance is doing in its entirety it's you know symbolist ideas and I play a big role in it but it's really Chance's baby and the the uh but but the visit to Egypt at the end of a couple of weeks there I can talk from now till doomsday which I'm about in the process of doing um and nothing nothing that I say can come can come even remotely close to what it's like to be two weeks in Egypt day after day after day after day in the presence of of sacred art of this of this quality and there's nowhere else on the left I mean I'm sure that China and India and all of these places had not pyramids and not that kind of structure the nature of Egypt it's it's a kind of freak of nature as it were all desert except this little strip of of of Nile and then the Delta that until recently

65:20was impenetrable swamp so it's practically unattackable and the food theile floods and the food jumps out of the ground and under the under the with with with this with a series of genuinely enlightened rulers or at least pretty close to enlightened rulers ruling them that all lasts for 3500 years and how did they live you see everything that they did in fact until quite recently there were no such things as Jobs there were trades and crafts and skills and art and everybody I mean yes in the in Europe the combination of a a repressive church and an oppressive nobility kept everybody you know IM immersed and surf them in one way or another but what people actually did with their lives was in some sense or another transformational all of it it takes a lot of smarts to be a good peasant all of these things that people used to do as a matter of course and in Egypt you see

66:24it you see it carved into the walls and everyone thinks these are the scenes of daily life well they are scenes of daily life but they're decodable as transformational activities so anything that you do and what you're doing Mar martial arts this is a highly developed skill you are somebody that you wouldn't be if you would didn't have that skill if you were doing a podcast and what you did for a living was flipping burgers at McDonald's you wouldn't be Joe Rogan You' you've you've you've been doing your homework without maybe even thinking that it was homework because any anything that you're involved in that that you go at with a quest for Perfection of whatever it is has this transformational value and when you recogn when you know it let's say when you know it intellectually when you can articulate it it doesn't it it implements the actually the

67:23activity itself so it's possible even to do that you could be an you could be an enlightened Burger flipper and the sufis are very good at you know the Sufi is in life but not is in sorry is in life but not of it in other words you can you can practice waking up as it were uh in the midst of the most mundane thing you you could be you could you could be an Enlighten garbage garbage collector as long as you knew what you were doing it's a totally different thing I would imagine I'm not a garbage collector it's a totally different thing to collect the garbage consciously than it is to just do it resentfully because that's the only job that you can get although right so when when we're talking it's it's not as though this is it's not as though this is anything actually new it's is it's the oldest idea that ever was and it's something that people have been doing

68:21for thousands and thousands of years that said go going into the whole thing of precession and the and the and and the ages particularly as expressed Plato they have the Golden Age and a silver age and a Bronze Age and an Iron Age the Hindus do it in rather more sophisticated fashion I forget exactly the names are on the tip of my tongue of of those ages but if they if they are let's say analogous to our Seasons particularly if you live where I do and not in California where it's all one season but the seasons the is that it the yugas the yugas that's right it's it's it's if if it like if if they're compared to the seasons it's a very different thing to grow roses in June than it is in January it's the same effort when you're talking about people you know about waking up and all of the rest of it this is a Dark Age I mean this is this is the kuga as far as I'm concerned to do anything

69:26of a spiritual nature now with all of these forces with all of these forces lined up against you not consciously of course but unconsciously it's it's an it's an incredibly difficult thing to actually practice a genuine a genuine spiritual Doctrine first of all you have to get interested in it and that's only a small chunk of it of us and then you have to try to do it and you have to have the time you have to have the focus make the time and the focus and that's right focus and the will and all the rest of the things and that so that's so growing roses in January takes a lot more effort than to get to the same Rose than it takes in June when they're jumping out of the ground so my guess is and it's only guess it's speculation that in these higher levels of these higher periods of of you know golden silver bronze and so on it's just much easier it is much

70:24easier for people to recognize what's demanded of them and to do it than it is in the middle of a of a of of a from a spiritual point of view a spiritual but brightly lit how brightly unilluminated but brightly lit dark dark age well if you where we are if you look at the influence that Egypt had uh clearly on Greece and clearly on a lot of other civilizations where people literally came to Egypt to learn if Egypt wasn't what would civilization be like I mean it's such a unique place in that there's there's really nowhere that you can compare that has the level of sophistication as far as the structures in the ancient in the ancient world there not I mean it's almost like they what they created was undeniable like I think Giza the great pan of Giza has 2,300,000 stones that weigh between 2 and 80 tons yeah like what like how that's insane like the there the level

71:26of sophistication in creating something like that I mean I've only seen it in photographs but one of the greatest photographs I've ever seen is from someone with a GoPro standing on the top of it so you get this kind of you get a a sense of how immense it really truly is yeah and you just think about how how incredible that must have been when especially when it's covered with smooth Limestone before they cut it all off right I mean what what you're seeing is it's it's an undeniable mastery of physical things to the point where you just it makes you just it makes your head spin cuz we I mean people say we can do that today well okay maybe we kind of understand that it's been done and that we we can do pretty immense things we have some pretty incredible tractors and machines and everything like that but they didn't have those as far as we know they didn't have those

72:18they might have had something else what do you think they had I don't know I mean do you think about do you do you have like some hypothesis some theories in your head about the construction methods some a bit that that actually in from Tibet there's actually a funny little book I've done some lectures out at uh um what is it called um in Joshua Tree you know about that about um it's a contact in the desert they're mostly interested in the UFO phenomen and stuff like that but the the place itself Joshua Retreat Center is founded by a very interesting guy who is sort of the Tibetan Krishna morti in other words it's interesting little book he wrote terribly written but his his studies in Tibet and at the end of this little book he's talking about he's studying with the with the llamas he Des describes certain of the certain of the things he has seen them do and I see no

73:17particular reason to dismiss what he says he's talking from experience and it has the Ring of veracity to it he talks about um going into an underground chamber that has no lights or electricity or anything like that that's all lit up actually you go to Egypt you have these deep deep shaft tombs that go down and around and all like this and people say well how did they light the thing up can't have had torches it would have it would have used up all of the oxygen and it would have smoked up the ceilings and all the rest of it some people say well mirrors no mirrors will do and you need silvered mirrors for it to go around corners there are gypsy caves in ceville that are have four or five rooms and that are lit with mirrors from on top but no somehow and I used to joke and say well you know they had an inner light joking but maybe that's what maybe that's what it was that they they

74:10produces and he talks about other llamas he's witnessed doing incredible Feats of that you couldn't do you know that you just couldn't do in your ordinary State probably you as a martial artist have had moments or Witness people who can do things that are for anybody else impossible yeah but they don't light up tunnels no they don't light up tunnels but but they can do they can do physical things that are that are that are they're extraordinary they're almost miraculous that nobody else could do them yeah but that that's a it's a really important Point what you're saying about the construction methods that they used where they did have these long tunnels and these passages and these places but somehow or another they managed to navigate these things without leaving any marks or soot from from torches which are everywhere else where people used candles or anywhere else

75:06like you know even the cinee chapel like the entire ceiling is covered with soot you know they have to clean it yeah to PR to prepare it so people could see it again but that's um that's really fascinating to think that they had some other method of Illumination that we just haven't discovered yet we don't know what they did or how they did it that's one thing but you look at a jillion other things when you particularly this is again one of the reasons why the snx theory is is so is so contentious to these so dangerous to these guys because the snx carving the sinks is one thing but okay limestones are relatively resilient Stones relatively soft Stone enough guys with chisels even if they're copper chisels could do that given enough time and enough genius but the temples either side of it um are built of stones half the size of this room slotted into place like pieces of a jigsaw

76:02puzzle this is unbelievable and again what you just said is really important copper copper tools that's what they think copper tempered with arsenic I mean that but those same copper tools are supposedly are supposedly used for for carving the granite the if you go to Egypt actually you should get you a huge audience get a Jo Rogan trip together and come on to EGP I'm not going with people listen to this podcast well have a test too many freaks well 90% of them would be great that 10% well keep out the 10% just do a do a prepare have to have a filter conversation with them prepare a filter get him in a room prepare a filter and how many people would you take at a time I have a Max of 24 interesting because more than that is unmanageable right and when you see it I mean one thing after the other and it's totally safe to go to Egypt right right now well it's as safe as Los Angeles I

76:59mean or anywhere else here in in in dumfuckistan it's you know this is fistan for Americans for Americans to of all people to be afraid of going somewhere we're worried about Islamic terrorism more than anything because we've been it's here it's already here and Islamic terrorism is itself a tiny little bit of the terrorism that goes on on the day daily basis you pick up you open the internet and there's some nutcase kid somewhere or another shooting down a mall I mean the terrorist the terrorist the known terrorists have accounted for it's not even a statistic it's an X number of people that they've gone after but the you know here here in this crazy violent country you're never safe anywhere schools aren't safe malls aren't safe what's safe right so has some nice hotels too right oh great hotels yeah we stay at a place actually right across a stone throw from the

78:01pyramids itself so you can look at the pyramid out your window yeah you can wow that's right you can do that when I look at uh the Great Pyramid or I look at the uh this destructure that I've seen uh online or in your videos or things along those lines what's shocking to me is how and this is kind of we weird thing to say how Egyptian it looks and how Egypt stands alone In This Very distinctive way and that the the construction methods the the just the intricacy of the building and these pyramids I mean people talk about the Mayan pyramids and I've been to chichin and it's an amazing place and it's really beautiful and crazy to look at but it pales in comparison to the structures of Egypt yeah everything pales in in comp what happened how did that happen well as I said because it was in a kind of a blessed one it had it had a philosophy you know it had a a spiritual philosophy

78:58underpinning it that had the that had the that that had you might say that had the that United the people in their entirety doesn't mean that they weren't you know criminals and murderers and stuff like that but basically the people were United in their in their Faith United in their belief Herodotus when Egypt was 6th Century BC Herodotus and and Egypt is already in steep decline says the Egyptians are the happiest healthiest and most religious of people and wasn't the Egyptian Chamber of Commerce that was telling him to say that he was a patriotic Greek but it was like that and it was a combination of the philosophy wedded to in in a in a society that was protected on all four sides and almost un almost impregnable it was conquered a couple of times over the course of 3,000 years for a relatively brief period of time um and the food jumped out of the ground the

79:58Nile flooded and took practically no work and that made a quite substantial population it gave him months of free time every every year so how did it all go wrong now we're talking about the cugas um the whatever the whatever period Egypt is assigned to is on a downhill slope it just plain was on a downhill slope and you can you can watch it trans form in front of your eyes it it disintegrates as a coherent religion rises in another form that we call Christianity actually and you can see it happening in front of your nose with Coptic Christianity arising all the rest of the stuff gets completely decadent under the Romans I me Rome what's his name Gibbon Edward Gibbon and Decline and fall of the Roman Empire talks about the Grandeur the glory of Greece which which is absolute nonsense or totally near total nonsense and the Grandeur of Rome yeah they were building coliseums in in

81:02order in order to torture in order to let Gladiators kill each other and they built good roads but Rome was a three ring B three- ring bureaucracy actually and that's the beginning of the end in in Europe anyway it's very traceable the the Asian countries less so but they too have high civilizations that decline and in Europe you see kind of a turnaround in the Renaissance very impossible to actually date and then you have it leading in a sort of in a one very one-sided development in which in which technology advances by Leaps and Bounds and everything else is arguably a lot worse than it was a couple of hundred years ago from a from every spiritual psychological point of view we're a lot worse off than let's say the Colonial Americans you really think so oh yeah but the depictions of the Colonial Americans by um by the ancient uh people when when when you uh

82:07who was it that described the atrocities that Columbus and his crude had done um what preacher priest oh yeah no loads of them sure they had done horrific horrific things oh those are the conquerors yeah I'm not talking about the settlers murdered all the Indians oh and the this is all that stuff monuma was a piece of you know Slaughter of 880,000 slaves after they built to2 how do you say that tan to wakan this I don't this I don't know about and I don't know what again but they seem like bad people too right oh loads of bad people around they didn't have the internet no but I'm I'm talking about they certainly didn't have the internet and lots of other goodies they didn't have um no but there was a certain let's say about the populace in general in America a certain gravitas about them there's a certain presence that is of our great great grandfathers well not mine because

83:06they were in Hungary at that time my great great but there's a certain sort of like Emerson self-reliance I mean this is this is a piece of meanwhile of course they whooping all the slaves in the South and they're murdering all the Indians and the and the billionaires as is their fashion are beating up on their Irish immigrant workers because why have slaves when they can mistreat their their workers and build their you know and build all of their uh their railroads across the country but nevertheless there's a sense of I say gravitas is almost the only word I can think of because it's not as though it's intellectually advance or anything like that but there's a certain seeming solidity to 19th century America than than there is now in this crazy chaos that don't you think that there's always this tendency in human beings that long for a for Nostalgia they look

84:03back to the past to a moment when things made sense it seems to me that there's always that and even when people are full of about it like they look back in the high school days man those are the good old days like what are you talking about you had pimples you were out of your mind insecure you're terrified of the future that wasn't the good old days this is this is true yeah Trump make America great again yeah bring back slavery find some more know that we run out of Indians murder the Muslim let's go to the uh let's go to the Arab Nations or let's go let's go to the Amazon yeah let's import them and murder them and let's bring back all of that stuff no it was never great but as I said there's just there is a kind of maybe I'm more optimistic I think there's an Awakening going on right now with human beings that's unprecedented and I think it's because of the internet

84:50I think uh because of the fact that we're combining our thoughts and some sort of a strange way in sharing ideas and information in a way that no one's ever been able to do before I just I don't think people have ever been this aware of how crazy things are uh but at the same time it's look at the lunacy of last night's presidential debate you realize like I guess we really haven't I mean we might be aware of things but actual progress is not really being made we we have the ability to be aware of things yes but we are not we are not at least in sufficient numbers doing we are we are not doing anything about it and that's the Crux of the matter it's one thing this is why intellectual spiritual you know intellectual mysticism is a total waste of time only this like intellectual violin playing no you got to play the violin yeah or it's not music right so

85:45thinking about Egypt is not good enough you got to go the ability well that yes the ability to to to get information is now absolutely unparalleled yeah there's there's as far as we know there's never been anything remotely like this at the same time there's never been that much static so see we were talking about earlier the you know the the crystal sniffers and the unicorns and the Ancient Aliens this is this is all a vast amount of static so you have to be able to find your way to you have to find your way through the static to the music how much does Ancient Aliens frustrate you not much cuz I don't I watched a couple of programs but if you did you throwing things at the TV and scream no I I don't I have low expectations so it's TV it's supposed to It's Entertainment and the people who are putting it together you know don't know what they're doing except they see

86:40that it works and they want to make money is it possible that the aliens made the pyramids when they have all these experts everything it is is it possible that extraterrestrials I guess it's possible that's right well it is possible and Georgio of course pushed into a corner says yeah all of this and that and so on still it's aliens Georgio sucos yeah he's beautiful I love that guy he's a funny guy he's a funny guy um when you think of ancient Egypt and you you think of the the the Public's understanding and awareness of it what do you think the average person is missing all of it all of it basically yeah they so you think it's like right before Our Fate front of our eyes and most people just have no idea the majesty and how intensely unique it is no look our mystery of the Spinx which is at that time one of the most one of the most watched TV documentaries of all

87:36time and I really had a massive audience and people who saw it remember it I mean even to this day got me um you saw it oh you did okay I have a VHS cassette tape of it sir really wait I brought it wait Did I bring it I forget if I brought you get online now I think it's might be on YouTube on DVD I was going to bring you a DVD actually but I maybe forgot I've almost memorized it well that's good yeah anyway few times that had a certain impact even if 30 million people saw it 300 million didn't right and then going there is really what's up and well that's the that's that's the Big Crunch and only X number of people can go there I went to the Vatican last summer this past summer um my first time ever in Italy and uh I had seen it on television before obviously I'd seen videos and stuff I've seen photos boy when you're there and you're you're like uh in what

88:33is it St Peter's Basilica yeah when you St Paul's St Paul's no Paul's St Paul's wait one of those guys now you Mook it's St Peter St Peters with the Dome where the pop always comes out and you you look at it you go when you're inside of it and you realize the insane magnitude of the construction the fact that it took hundreds of years to complete and they did it all without saws without power tools rather they did it all without any modern equipment and it's unbelievably beautiful yeah incredible work of art and it pales in comparison to what they did in Egypt yes it does which is like it there's I I think I got to go because it's one of those well they also have an obelisk that's a 4,000 year old Obelisk that's in the middle fromp they sto and you just look at that and when you're there physically and you look at it in person you just go wow how the did they make this wait a

89:26minute now wait this is the cathedral is Basilica is very interesting and all that how did they move how did they get this actually is an interesting book by my now deceased friend Peter Tomkins on the magic of the obelisks where he's talking about you know ripping there out of their out of context and bringing them to Rome and New York and England and it was interesting because they were brought over in the 19th century and it's already you know technology is pretty Advanced I mean have huge cranes and all the rest of it and it strained the the the Victorian technology to the utmost to get these things over and then you realize that the Egyptians did it with none of those tools yeah at all they somehow got them ripped out of the Bedrock brought down the river taken offloaded from the raft or boats or whatever which is a big job transported across the ground that's doable

90:24erected in place precisely to the mill millimeter on the base that's a big mystery did they have levels what did they have levels like bubble levels not bubble levels but they had other kinds they did it with water somehow or another the the that's that's I think reasonably well established but I forget exactly how it was on how they leveled for example the base of the pyramid to a millimeter or something like that yeah I mean everything that you look at in Egypt when you go there the the deeper you look the more mysterious it becomes and you Marvel at how the devil that they well the king's chamber is one of the most bizarre ones right is well it's no bizar more bizarre than than other things I mean it's a but just the enormity of the stones the way they're they're set up that it's just it's such a complex system the way the way they've set them in place is so incredible

91:19you're talking about the ones the the the the so-called relieving Chambers which are really resonating Chambers resonating Chambers yeah that's that's another thing yeah they're not they they don't they don't relieve anything architecturally completely unnecessary to relieve the the stresses from above directly below the king of chamber is the so-called Queen's chamber which doesn't have that at all has a simple gabled roof and that protects it from anything that it needs the other Chambers when you're in the king's chamber it's it's like being it's an echo chamber you can't it it's it's really a miraculous place and of course everything is precision cut and all of that but it doesn't look that fantastic it's the it's the the levels above that are the most amazing things is these are the 70 ton blocks of stone I think that's what you're talking about yeah how they got those into place

92:10no one knows but they are responsible for the Resonance of that of that particular chamber and it's my belief that resonance plays even not necessarily resonance for the human voice but when you're in there the the I forget the acoustic term feedback or whatever that you can't for example if we're in the king's chamber and we go we rent the pyramid for a couple of hours and for a meditation session on on my trips and when you're in there you can't have a conversation the way we're having it now you have to talk like this otherwise the reverberation is such that it scrambles your voice wow this can only be deliberate and you can hear from the you can hear from the king's chamber if you do set up you do a chant in the king's chamber if you go all the way down the ground gallery and then there's a place below where you have to make a turn and then there's a descending passage that goes

93:11as deep below the ground as the as the pyramid as the king's chamber is above the ground it's about 12 story shaft that you go down below the ground 12 stories 12 stories down below and then 12 stories wow look at that and all right very good and um I uh and and if you set up a chant in the in the king's chamber you can hear it down in the in the pit below 12 stor below yeah but you shouldn't be able to hear it at all because the sound has to go down and then turn around and then go down the other shaft by the way I should say CU people are always asking me now it's a function of age how long are you going to keep doing these trips yeah and um I say well you know unless and until um I can't get up and down the king chamber up to the king chamber I'll I'll be doing trips unless some media thing takes over but as they say in Texas if you can do it it ain't bragging and good

94:13line so um I was in Egypt recently on my on a research wcky trip but that may lead to something and I may not will say wcky trip Rec reconnaissance oh the film lingo for okay reconnaissance I thought it was like like a like a meditation no not re not Reina and and actually so normally go with the group up to the king's chamber but I don't bother to go we open it gets opened up and you go down into the pits I said ah it's my on my 84th birthday I happened to be in Egypt so I said okay I'll I'll I'll test it so I went up to the king's chamber and down the shaft so that's 12 stories up 12 stories down went down to the pit was 12 stories down and 12 stories up and I figured that was pretty good for ready4 so that's pretty good um so I'll be doing the trips for a while nice well that's good because I mean I don't think anybody's capable of doing the same kind

95:10of experience that you would provide like your knowledge of Egypt is is pretty rare in this day and age well I was hoping when I had this idea to do my own trips I thought oh finally I'll make a living out of this stuff but what happened was that no sooner had my guide book come out you probably don't have a copy of that but and it's out of print now but I have copies um that um back in ' 85 the first of the terrorist things happened and these guys hijacked the cruise ship off Alexandria and pushed this poor old guy in a wheelchair over the side of the crowd of the cruise ship and and he drowned and that my book had just come out and instantly the tourist trade was killed look at my people being afraid for a whole year it took for it to develop and it it did develop again but the book had disappeared from the shelves by that time anyway still available of course but um wait I lost

96:10my thread um with the trips like what did you say with Egypt um someone doing them like some oh someone doing it my plan was I wanted to train a number of people up to who familiar you know steeped and symbolist Egypt to to spread the word as it were and while while I was at it get a commission from from the trips to you know provide some useful wolf repellent so you can have some nice uh passive income some right but it never happened because you know one thing led to another and it was hard enough getting my own trips filled up but yeah the unfortunately as it now stands I'm the only one only a handful of people no symbolist Egypt well enough to communicate it and as it just so happens I'm the only one who does trips so I really I really am the only wheel in town in that regard well you brought us a bunch of slides so why don't you tell me what what what do you want to

97:07show us and what did you bring here well I brought that's my whole long lecture um you want to see you want to go to the to the geology of the sanks the water weathering um and then other slides um related to that the gigantic blocks Paving blocks um around particularly around the second pyramid and um and um second pyramid and yeah mostly around the second pyramid and then I mean all of that stuff relates to the the scientif the geological evidence then I wanted to get into I didn't want to touch the the symbolist the Quest for immortality because that's a whole big subsequent thing I did want to get into and we didn't even talk about it um yeah the map of the map of dumfuckistan and and what I call the the and I've got a great graphic for it actually the you everybody you know certainly and everybody probably most of your audience will know about the Four Horsemen of the

98:20Apocalypse right from Revelation who are actually interesting study in its own right The Four Horsemen are war faminine war famine pestilence and death and what's interesting about the four horsemen is that only war is really under human control at least in theory you know famine pestilence plague as it were and death comes to us all it's a peculiar Choice actually for the four horsemen but but I invented the five cowboys of Apocalypse 2.0 and and they are and they are capitalism patriotism democracy technology and entertainment all the stuff I love well that's that's the end well no it's just another way of looking at things actually it's really human Folly all of it right well call it Ry call it capitalism call it technology it's it's none of those things it's human Folly it's the human the the error and human use well yes well so okay capitalism is really based upon the

99:38philosophy everything for me nothing for you you see everybody's fighting for market share why can't you love a guy stay alive they W competition but if it wasn't for that competition we wouldn't be here we wouldn't have planes that shoot across the sky we wouldn't have laptops work so well we wouldn't have internet that's so fast I don't know we might but we might not it's very possible that we wouldn't and there's a downside to all of those things but there's an upside too there is an up I'm a glass half full kind of guy John Anthony West that's the technology side of it I haven't got to that yet okay capitalism is based upon everything for me nothing for you patriotism is based upon everything for us nothing for them the bumper sticker says God Bless America the hidden Sticky Side says and everyone else right that's patriotism democracy is that the idea is

100:30that the the dishwashers elect the chef and tell them what to do I don't know about you I don't eat in the restaurant with the dishwashers elect the chef and tell them what to do it's flawed it's hopelessly flawed to begin with which Plato recognized perfectly Churchill said democracy looks like the worst of all possible of all possible political systems until you look at all the others at the same time this is fun and it's not necessarily untrue the same time he also said contradicting himself the best argument against democracy is 10 minutes of conversation with an average voter I don't know about you I don't want my leaders elected numerically by the average voter right actually if they had a test for if they were if they were if there were which is next to impossible to even conceive if if it if if voting were a privilege I mean when the country started off it was a privilege but you

101:27had to be a white male who owned property which is not as elitist as it actually looks now because in those days they were the only ones who were substantial enough and probably had some sort of an education it doesn't mean necessarily that they understand the principles and they you know they they were the you might say the the solid citizens who at least could read I mean nobody else could read except people with an education of some sort so that was that was the rule and it wasn't a terribly good rule but it might have been in its own way anyway that's as a principle that it shouldn't be a privilege to vote just as like anybody could produce why shouldn't anybody be able to do brain surgery you know or design engineer design a bridge I'm as good as the next guy I've never designed a bridge I don't have any training but I'm it's a democracy why can't I do that or play

102:26center field for the Mets you know just and that's what the president is really essentially anybody you just have to say I want to do it step up this is my plan and get people to vote for you well that it's it's a cast anyway put it this way in its current form and in fact as far back as you could go in America it's been a disaster democracy technology is certainly a mixed bag the problem two big problems with technology the main one and we touched upon this earlier is that technology deprives the average the normal human being of making a living out of his own productiv out of his own creativity it deprives them technology does how so it the only people who are creative in technology are the people who are creating the technology everybody else serves the technology they work in the offices that serve the technology they they they're basically slaves to the technology what about the

103:26people that use the technology to separate themselves from from slave jobs like there's a lot of people that have started their own businesses online yeah because they could use technology now so you Crafts People create things that's the upside but it's it's a relatively small part compared to the number of people they talk about they talk about all these good jobs going at to China those are shitty jobs nobody in their right mind would want to work in a factory if you ever worked in a Factory no or been in a factory really yes I've been in factories cuz I went to school as seldom as I possibly could in Bethlehem Pennsylvania which is where the the Bethlehem Steel Center was and we used to go there on field tribes holy mackerel the this was like working in Dante's Inferno these blackened figures jumping up and down in the blinding heat of the besser converters and the other

104:18kinds of jobs of robots stuffing things into boxes or flipping ERS the vast majority of people yeah they get the you know they have their television sets and their internet and stuff like that but but the vast majority of people cannot do not and cannot make their living out of their own creativity and before however terrible things may have been in medieval times people did creative transformational things so that's the downside of technology and the other bad side of Technology you talked about the good side the bad side is is that it's it's not immoral necessarily but it's amoral so as long as they can do it they do it um hydrogen well hydrogen bomb why not we don't invent that somebody else will do it nerve gas well that's a very good way of getting way with you know around stuff striped toothpaste well it's a waste of time and effort and stuff like that but maybe we can sell

105:16more striped tooth toothpaste than unstriped toothpaste and the rest of it is in other words a percentage of it yeah the medicine is very good until it gets into the hands of big Pharma who then make sure that the most that that that that people are ripped off for you know to get at the medicine that they need and the medicine that they that they have available is not usually a cure it's a way of keeping people alive and buying more medicine anything that's actually a a cure that comes from alternative sources is fought to the death by by the big pharmaceutical companies M so technology is certainly a mixed bag and entertainment depending on how you define it is what what you do to kill time before it kills you for the most part it's a waste of it's an absolute waste of time it's takes your mind off the of the boringness of your own life um art is different art is not entertainment

106:16there's a broad there's a broad line in between that at least in theory could or should be filled by comedy which is not exactly entertainment but it's not exactly sacred science either but it it plays at least theoretically it it it can play a kind of a transformational role you can real high level comedy is enlightening it's it it points out and comedy is based upon you can't laugh you can only comedy is based upon what's wrong you can't laugh at what's right you can't make fun of good sex or good food you can make fun of attitudes toward good sex or good food but you can't laugh at what at what's right not easily but you can laugh but you can and do laugh at what's wrong and so let's say at some inner level by laughing at what's wrong inadvertently it's a recognition we have within us let's say a moral we have a moral compass or comp the wrong word we

107:32have a moral thermometer or something of the sort that recognizes by recognizing what's wrong we're assenting giving Ascent to what's right it is to cultural of course what's funny to an Eskimo is not necessarily funny to an African or funny to an African is not necessarily funny to a you know to a Chinese but but comedy has this potential to play at least in my view a transformational role but anyway mostly it doesn't and entertainment at the American level turn on your television set is that entertainment it's certainly not art it's it's it's a deadening it's an anod it's it's sort of most of it is is is is a kind of is a is a kind of um what's what's it that you take to go to it's it is a basically a kind of sedative or the opposite or a it's like a Benny it's a you know s it's it's a stimulant actually with you know with the Terminator and all of these horrible

108:34vicious things that they do so that's let's get to the slides right let's CU we're already two hours in here oh yeah let's um let's take a look at some of the slides of uh where do you want to start let's start with the geology start right at the beginning and I'll just whip whip you past okay now why are they this is a really confusing thing to me why do they continue to rebuild that thing because when they're rebuilding it they're rebuilding the feet and the pause of the Sphinx and I I understand there's considerable erosion that they have to mitigate but it's not the Sphinx anymore I mean well it's bringing the snx back to supposedly what it was originally the problem is really is an engineering problem they don't know themselves and at least a few of them acknowledge it sh shock thinks this and mean he's not he's not in charge of doing doing the repairs that it may be

109:24doing more damage because it's still weathering on the inside and by covering it over with these usually very badly badly done stuff but they're actually doing more damage than that well the department of Antiquities zo's no longer he's no longer Pokey did they lock him up no no no never been able he well in he was in trouble but they couldn't pin it on them they would if they could no listen zah I'm a person level that's another long story and we've already gone on for two hours but on a personal level I can get on with zahi and uh and he's now back in not formally in a position of power he's not head of the department and he he's got his problems did you see the debate that he had with graham Han walked out he was a yeah he was a disaster and and all of his friends even I mean the guy who runs my trip Mohammad Nai I called the surgeon CU he really knows how to operate his

110:22wonderful guy and he's a good personal friend of of zahi and he said you know zahi this is a disaster but he out you know he lived through it and uh he's back back on the scene as it were anyway we're looking at the Sphinx enclosure here and uh this massive massive structure with this all this erosion around it right all this erosion to it and then people see this on YouTube um yeah when when you'll see as we go through a few sides you get a few slides you'll see the sense of that erosion this is just a wonderful picture of it taken by a good friend of mine keep going this is why thought about this is why this is why the sprinks could not have been weathered by sand what we're looking at right now for the people that are just listening is it buried in sand which it has been many many times when um when Napoleon found that it was buried in sand correct right completely

111:13buried in sand and probably for a few thousand years this is taken photograph taken about 2000 when it had already been excavated and filled up with sand again which happens pretty quickly so basically you can say give a take a few hundred years that since it's supposed construction around 2500 BC it's been buried in sand about 3,000 of those 4500 years that's that's the proof yeah that's there's the evidence and still the geologists go on ranting about sand when you talking about this friend of yours was going to the Dre say okay how did it how did it weather by sand wind and sand right how how did it wind can't affect it that way wasn't that the original text of whoever who who do they attribute to the construction of the pyramid to Moses no no no no no Pharaoh kafra the successor of kufu who supposedly built the Great Pyramid which is not true in its entirety they the the

112:11pyramids this is another comp complex argument which as you see everything's complex they're almost certainly built in stages and the earliest stages probably date from whenever the Sphinx was origin Al built and the argument for Coffer building it wasn't a text that said that he had a dream that if he uncovered the Sphinx that he would become Pharaoh no that's to Moses Moses a thousand years later they attribute it to kafra because the causeway that leads from the Sphinx if you go the behind it you see the beginning not really you see just the back of the Sphinx the causeway the causeway leads up to right to the middle of the P of the Pyramid of the FR pyramid which he almost certainly did build or anyway superimposed upon something that was there before because you can prove that okay keep going did they used to think it was Tut Moses was that no no no they always thought it was

113:04they always thought it was KRON because uh well that again what is this right here that's not the Rosetta Stone is it no no no no that's the that's the Steeler of tot mosis that talks about how in a dream he it's covered with sand oh that's it right there that's in 145 BC so that means 1450 BC was cover covered in sand exactly and with a certain number of other evidences of that sort you can put together the timeline that tells you I swear I've read online someone attributing in Tut Moses to the creation of it but there's a lot of erroneous a lot of junk on now the face of the Sphinx this is a really controversial thing right because the face of the Sphinx is clearly newer than the body it's less eroded and it's also a very African looking face do they think that which obviously it's the continent African but do they think there's the Nubian had conquered Egypt at one point in time

113:56right wasn't the speculation that one of the Nubian pharaohs had created this well some said that 19th century Travelers lots of them noted that this was really an African face but what they meant is that it's a sub Sahara African face it's a real African African face the Nubians are very black but have more or less finer features they don't have the jaw like that I mean that looks more like an NBA basketball player than you know than an Egyptian anyway the headdress is all re redone the picture before with it was covered with sand right you see how weathered the headress was they they redid the bottom they redid the headdress in its entirety the face itself is a much harder outcrop of limestone so it hasn't weathered to the same extent that the body of the sinks has weathered so you think it's of the same era we don't know actually we because you see the the African face is

114:56a is a real problem actually of course the the Egyptians there as Prejudice as everyone else and they don't want to actually believe that the Spinx itself could be a subsaharan African maybe from an earlier period when the Africans were pharaohs we don't know wasn't there some speculation that initially it was an actual Lion's face and that the Lion's face was cut down to create this pH that's us speculating that way because the the head is way too small for the body and it it certainly and we had the NYPD we did this big study I think that's the next slide coming up um yeah there it is there you see the with Frank Domingo who is the um NY well he was a forensic senior forensic artist for the NYPD it's a guy who knows about you know phys phys so we did a a study um of the comparative faces of the sinks and the of the sinks that's the one on the right

115:54and phoh krine his conclusion was that no artist no competent artist or sculptor could possibly have used the same model for the face of the sinks as for the CRA face C face and there's a few kafra faces floating around so the my my criminal partner when when Frank gave us that study um his his comparative study Boris Zed said H for the for the for the academic establishment this is bad news and worse news the bad news is that there wasn't Atlantis and the worst news is they were black my black friends like that phrase but anyway so and then in the 90s I did an uped piece for the New York Times and I carefully left that part out just I just compared use the Frank Domingos drawing versus the the Sphinx but a couple of weeks later a letter was published from an or from an orthodontist who also knows about faces saying hey hey that Spinx is actually a subsaharan African face I didn't say it

117:06he said it so I'm not in trouble for that right but anyway until until something better is discovered it's a subsaharan African face and we don't know when it and it was recarved and we don't know when so it's entirely possible that it used to be a lion and then some came along and said I don't like that line Mak my face no it may have been that the the head was so weathered that over over time that they said well we can't we can't repair the the face the way that we can repair the body and so they recarved the head and of course the face was most likely still above ground while the rest of the body was covered so it was subject to more erosion well it would not well it's also a harder Limestone so probably again this is specul but we reckon that it an outcrop of stone was sticking above the sand level to begin with and somebody at some point a jillion years ago um decided to

118:06to to carve the sinks by by cutting around it cutting the Bedrock away from around it leaving the outcrop above and carving that into whatever it may have been originally it could have been an African queen could have been how much information did they lose when the Library of Alexandria was burned well since it was burned we don't know it's amazing though really imagine a million Scrolls was brag that they had a million Scrolls who knows what was on them one of my one of my one of my dreams not dreams but um sort of vision whatever but the hope is that one of these days somebody turns over a spade in you know in in Damascus or in somewhere up there and discovers a cache of of you know of of hidden of hidden scroll Scrolls from the from the Library of Alexandria it's quite probable that the so-called maps of the of the sea Kings you know the P Reese map and some

119:13of those other things are copies of maps that were originally part of the part of the library and I have a whole film script actually what's the latest on this supposed uh chamber that they found under the Paw of the Sphinx there's been some radio oh us that's us it's the seismograph that says that there's a chamber there and the seismograph doesn't Channel and it doesn't and the g physicist who did it said yeah there's a void down there now does that mean that it's it could be a natural void that's certain kinds of limestone that riddled with those kinds of voids but this isn't that kind of limestone so more more stuff when when the opposition finally caves in and says they never say they're wrong but and says well this deserves further study then maybe we get permission to go and really look back in into that stick a probe down or something like that and

120:10see if there is indeed something in there we don't know God that seems like an important thing could be I mean just to find that there's something there just to find there's something there is important yes now has there ever been any discussion whatsoever about I mean I know they've done all this uh repair work on the Sphinx has there ever been any discussion of taking the Limestone that was pulled from the Great Pyramid and somehow or another putting new Limestone back up there to recreate its original look no nobody has ever talked about that as far as I know but it would be a nightmarish job because all of the all of those um core blocks are all crumbly and uneven and damaged and stuff like that and besides they have other fish to fry you know they've got technology to worry about and I know but I mean just if people could see what it used to look

121:05like I mean whoever did that when they raided it to build Cairo like what that's what they say I'm not even aund I've never seen a study that actually has documented where those stones are and they're big massive stones and they slope like this you can't build a bridge out of those stones you'd have to cut the edge off which is almost as much work as quarrying the stuff out of out of the out of the out of the raw Quarry Rock which is closer to Cairo so what do you think happen I don't know I don't know but I'm I'm not 100% happy with that explanation I don't I don't have a better one but but but that one is subject to let's say is subject to question now has it been firmly established that it was covered in smooth Limestone ah pretty much yeah much um Yes actually the the Roman Greco Roman writers who were there at the time studying talked about it being

122:01absolutely perfect and unpenetrable in fact one of them said there's a rumor that there was a hinged block at the entrance that if you pushed it it or you know did something with it it opened and I've often thought that I wonder if that's the origin of open sesame in the in the thousand one nights because there are a lot certain of those thousand And1 nights tales that have their origins in ancient Egypt wow that would be a good study go ahead keep going what else we got here uh that's the head of Kaa with the with the Falcon wow very different face totally different face I mean you can't miss that and there's more long story but we're already going over here and I won't go into it okay here's this water weathering that when shock took one look at it said wow this looked like there hundreds of thousands of years old just keep going hundreds of thousands of

122:55years that was his just his you know when a geologist he wasn't thinking what he was he was just saying it just he was just saying it but it was massive water erosion it was massive water erosion by a guy whose expertise is in is in that field right so if he thought about it you know we can't document that until we get a bunch of guys there really looking seriously into it but how old do you think it is if you had a guess know I don't know um because of the way it's oriented one of the reasons they come out with the date Hancock and Bal originally came out with this 11,500 because as a processional marker because that's would be the time as a lion that would be the time when it last Saw its own image in the sky Leo the Lion the constellation of Leo that would have been the last time I think not that there's too much going on it's in too chaotic a a stage to to have been

123:52done then I think it may be the pr the age before that which would be about 36,000 BC which would correspond with the Egyptian text themselves however that said it wouldn't surprise me if we were older still until we get a bunch of geologists and experts in their various fields to see if they can put a fix on it and they might not be able to but that's what that's that's one of the things we look forward to doing if we get permission to go back in there get the funding very important and the permissions to go there and actually get this done and this is where actually we were just in Egypt I when I climbed up and down the pyramid myself at 84 and um we got complicated story but we did get to meet the new minister of Antiquities and who was very cordial and and of list did the things that we had to do in order to get formal position but in any way we we established a

124:57personal contact with him which is very useful and then we also met up with the director of this new gigantic Museum that they're building and that is going to open in a year or two ago and he was he was very open to anything even controversial that they could apply science to so if some of the other pieces of this trip didn't go as planned we couldn't had to see some of the things we wanted to see for complicated reasons but anyway that we we established the potential foothold for getting the next stage of the of work accompl that's very very promising that's promising now correct me if I'm wrong but they think that people in this form the form of you and I have only been around for somewhere around 300 to 500,000 years is that right well that's the current thinking the current well then it changes all the time yeah it changes so let's bring it back let's go

125:49crazy and say it's a million years old when when you're looking at something like this and you're talking about 36,000 years boy that's uh just it's just crazy to think that there was this period where people were just throwing at each other and you know and throwing pointed sticks at animals and and uh kind of Barely getting by and then something like this just sort of erupts out of the imagination and the Ingenuity of people that lived tens of thousands of years ago yeah but it shouldn't be that difficult because as you keep going through the slides you'll get to the Paleolithic caves now is that that's more evidence of water erosion correct you're looking at right there no no I'm talking about but right there with this image right there same image those well that's the same that's the same what water weathering it's just another view of it that's the back end of the sinks okay

126:43and that's interesting anyway part of Mark Lan's theory is that you know is that it's it's it flaked away you know over time and that's what's responsible for these the curved profile but this is a tomb that's been cut in it's old it's not Old Kingdom it's it's what's called late Kingdom but it dates from about 600 or 700 BC and those are The Masons marks still as original 20 you know 2600 over two and a half thousand years later still perfectly visible so no the theory Theory EXP exped well that definitely puts a damper on the uh wind and sand erosion theory that too absolutely yeah especially considering that they they still think the Sphinx is 26 or 2500 BC yeah yeah well listen this is this is remember I said the second strongest thing in the world yes and this is not you don't trifle with them and if you think that just because the evidence is good enough

127:46they're going to accept it no they're only going to accept it when you beat them into the ground sufficiently so that they can't get up well as long as their reputation is Stak on their you know their original assumptions being correct there's going to be a problem oh and so there is yeah so what are we looking at here this is the corner of cro pyramid and you see the two very different styles of architecture the huge blocks below very finely dressed and the much cruder core masonry up above this is evidence of two separate stages of construction it's like if you had a if you bought a Victorian house house with an Ikea kitchen in it you wouldn't say oh well I just decided to you know build this Victorian house and put this cool new kitchen in no right you know in two seconds that it's two different stages of construction anyway let's we got a lot of stuff to cover

128:38here here what stop you see where these people are walking mhm do you see that this one block you see those people yes there and then all the way down where the third guy down there is walking there's another goes down to there there and then it goes like a 20t plus BL it's about 20 by 30t block and then next the next slide that's what it is Edge on those are the blocks people walking on top that's what we were just looking at so those blocks are about between 6 and 8 feet thick go back to the bottom one so not only they're 6 and8 ft thick but they're stacked on top of each other that's right to build it up to that level wow yeah 6 and8 ft thick and then stacked on top of another one that's of a similar height and if you go poking back into it it's all you see the joints between them are pretty rough but in fact if you poke back in there you see that they fit together that you can't

129:27you barely get a credit card between them that's just that's that's you know lots and lots of weather over lots and lots of years then those are the the the blocks of the Great Pyramid which are much smaller and almost pre almost presuppose a later state of construction H yeah those the same okay that's the Red Pyramid you know we're going to take up too much time here keep going okay that's the interior of The Red Pyramid and you see that's a megalithic construction it's always called a plundered tomb chamber a it's not a tomb chamber because nobody was ever found in in it it doesn't look like any Egyptian tomb chamber and B it's not plundered it's simply ruinous it's this is a this is an earlier this is an earlier construction that for whatever reason the builder of the red P Red Pyramid decided to incorporate that into his pyramid it's not like an Ikea kitchen

130:24incorporated into the Victorian house it's something that was there before and that they built the Pyramid on top of so there's some older construction and then a better more stay up there Jamie stop moving there there's a so what you're seeing the lower cruder level is uh an older method of construction then above it you see like really smooth yeah yeah much much over well and also you see really smooth CU it's in perfect shape there's nothing to the inside of the pyramid nothing nothing could it's like it was done yesterday whereas the bottom has been out in the weather for a long time that's the secret it's weathered by it's weathered not like the not like the the exterior of the Spinx but but it's style is typically is typically U megalithic it looks like certain of the constructions in in Ireland and Scotland and Wales megalithic constructions there

131:17so you mean like a cruder cutting much much cruder and and but dating from an earlier period 6 7,000 BC something so much like when they go and they do excavations in Mexico City they're always build they're building like buildings down there and they have to stop construction because they find like some ancient pyramid or something along those lines exactly so what this is is they had an old structure and they built the new stuff on top of it the new stuff is what we think of as the original structure but there's evidence to point that there was some ancient stuff below that exactly okay interesting okay what do we got here well that's more just other shots of shocking myself in there okay this is another piece of the puzzle this is part of abidos um behind the temple itself Temple is off to the right and this is again a good friend of mine has just

132:06done an elaborate book on this and even though he's not a an egyptologist it's being academically published but it's going into into all sorts of of things having to do with this strain structure which is one of the most resonating powerful places in all of Egypt we are convinced shock and myself that those Central pillars date from a much earlier period and then the rest of the temple is seti the 1 which is about 1300 BC but this is too elaborate to get into here and I'm running out of words why do you think that it's older one the construction method Style style of construction mostly style of construction and the way that it cited sort of buried it into the ground which is almost unheard of in for an Egyptian temple to be constructed into as a Subterranean structure it would have had a roof over it and so on at some point or another but anyway that's it's it's a

133:05complicated issue there it is it fills up with water sometimes and now they won't let you in down but uh anyway and this is we'll go SCBA divers This Is Us actually at yonaguni oh in Shan and myself in hanok and and the the Graham still now he's getting a bit cautious more cautious about it but we went there financed by this Mega millionaire um Japanese um industrialist um really I mean he wanted to prove the existence of Lura and as you see I mean all of those geometric um looks there and chak and I came to the conclusion after a week of diving there that seductive as it looks it really is a natural entirely a natural way and we could even see we don't have the pictures of it because it was the last day we were there you could even see the way that it was formed by the the nature of the Rock and the action of the waves and the terrific tides that that Prevail

134:10there so this is what this the that's me you can tell um you were so you actually did the diving down there how old were you when you did that oh when was that 10 12 years ago pretty gangster in my 70s what it's pretty gangster yeah well get down the bottom of the ocean when you're 70 well checking out rocks well and I don't like being underwater either but for archaeology I'll do it um okay keep going oh well this is the famous this is the famous carou that some people think are is here these are now these are the Paleolithic caves this is the best of them called chave This is dated this is in France right this is in France and this they date they date not us they date to 31,000 BC or older this is genius stuff um great artists did this great artists are not primitive they might be shooting arrows at rhinoceroses to eat and why not it's a lot better than going to the

135:16supermarket and the organic you you never heard of a GMO right noceros but but this is this is fabulous work and who knows what was going on the rest of the time when they're doing this in the dark hidden away in these caves and this is 31,000 BC so the date for us of 36,000 or thereabouts for you know for the Sphinx and all of that is not as out of out of the question as as you think because they date this to 31,000 and and this presupposes a an extremely sophisticated art Artistry and you know supremely sophisticated Artistry is not done by morons mhm or by by Primitives it just isn't keep going look at this great stuff yeah they definitely had a a very good sense of how to capture what these animals that they worshiped and went after looked like but it was crazy here you see that looks like a rhino down there and horses it is it is and the horses yeah Wild

136:29Horses wow well maybe not that's so this is gockley that's the artist artists study of gockley now correct me if I'm wrong but I think they've only uncovered less than 10% of gockley T yeah much less I think it's 5% or something like that and they work well now it's near the Syrian border so God knows what they're doing but they're covering it over because once they started Excavating it been protected by the fill for all of these thousands of years and it started deteriorating so now they've unfortunately you can no longer see it the way that CH and I saw it six seven years ago so what are they covering it with oh they've got sheds and roofs over it and it's completely destroyed its magic but I can't blame them if the weather is is getting at it well they when did they discover this it was actually discovered in the '90s '94 or so and they've been working on it ever

137:19since and it only came into public view around 2004 or thereabouts and here here's some of the detail and which is why shock is fascinated by this because that kind of thing of the anthropomorphic of the of the hands grasping around the corner that's the doing that was something almost identical to that in Easter Island we think Easter Island plays a role in this whole Lost Civilization hypothesis wow that's more again this is raised relief you have to chop the stone cut or abrade the stone away from the figures this is tough to do it's 3D stuff and also aren't there animals depicted on these things that aren't even local they're not even available on that continent nor do they think there's a history these animals I am not sure this is but this one is the that one there is a kind of a feline of some sort um hard to tell exactly what it is because it's stylized right but it's a pretty

138:18brilliant piece of sculpture and you have to you know carve away the whole Stone surface in order to get at that I'm not sure what I'm not sure if they if they know or surise what that is yeah it definitely looks some sort a puma some sort of a some sort of a puma something this is interesting that's a bead that they found there from gockley teepe and the this is a big mystery in a small bead because how did they drill that hole it's a very very very hard Stone very hard Stone a very small Stone too cuz this is sitting in your hand that's about the size of your your the last digit of your thumb yeah it's tiny it's tiny and it's thin and so there's a tiny little hole in that and again we're talking about a time where there was no steel that's right so how did they do that exactly well aren't there there's a bunch of pottery in Egypt in terms of a carved Stone Pottery where they have

139:14zero idea how they how they constructed it with a very thin lip and then it goes inside Contour yeah I think we have one of those there this is a this is a a bracelet found recently in Turkey made of obsidian which is an almost impossible Stone to work with and the the ridges on it they again not us have found by doing a careful study of it geometrically that it's very sophisticated geometry at work I forget exactly what it is that's at at at issue here but it's not just a couple cavemen saying well you know my wife is pissed off at me so I better give her something nice for our anniversary so I said oh is a nice chunk of obsidian I think I'll I'll uh I'll do a little bracelet for her and do they know how old this is yeah it's dated by the strata that it's found in around 8,000 BC wow wow okay this is more stuff this is Sardinia which is a a treasure of

140:09megalithic un misunderstood look at these extreme fantastic structures we think shock and myself that this may be a lot of this may be in answer to this massive coronal mass ejection that happened maybe thousands of years earlier even and people are still building things to keep them safe from another one of these now what what would be the effect of a coronal mass ejection right now yeah catastrophe right as far I mean now it would it would kill the satellites and be a lot of issues it would freeze the it the grid it would fry the grid right I mean instantly the only people would hang the only people who would survive of the survivalists who are off the grid the begin those are all well those kinds of survivalists real problem yeah those those kinds of Sur but other people are off the grid you know doing um My Pal clay who's here is buying 10 extra Acres that I have that I'm not

141:10doing anything with and is planning to in fact do exactly that to go off the grid and build a permaculture 10 acres self- sustaining self-sustaining that's a great way to do it to have like a farm and if you if you could afford the land and have solar power and all that jazz and well water few people are doing that it's a great way to do it if it's possible there are some people but it you know when when the the world is overpopulated to the extent that it is it's not going to get to an awful lot of people very quickly it's it's difficult to do yeah these are the interior of those extraordinary noraj they called sardini is an incredible Place actually and that's in Italy right island off the coast of Italy wow and what do they date these two well they dat it the 2600 or so 2600 BC and shock and I question that but we don't have we don't have any data that

142:07that tells us otherwise what is that this is the stone circle in Egypt in nolia as it's called that is looks completely fragmented and and rough but in fact even this the academic the archo astronomers acknowledge is Arch is astronomically oriented and there's a physicist archo astronomer named Tom broy who studied it much more carefully and has found much more sophisticated alignments than just solstices and equinoxes again that's a that's a Common Thread in ancient uh architecture which is really fascinating is the the alignment with celestial bodies Lions big on that yeah always well what they're doing back to procession for whatever reason that we don't understand but with the evidence is there there and festivals and all sorts of things like that are attuned take place at these at these critical these critical let's call them energy points and what they're doing and it's

143:12quite clear that they're doing it is that they're they're orchestrating their entire civilization they're tuning their entire civilization to the movements of the heavens this is quite clear and this you can kind of demonstrate what they're achieving by that we don't know but it's very important to them what do we got here more more the same that's the devil's dick well close looks like it yeah that's the that's that's naob theer and that's just a drawing of naob theer and this is this gets into complications of the cosmology of it this is the dogen this is the work of my good friend lar Scranton who you may know of I think yes yes the dogen tribe that's the tribe that thinks that they're they come from the constellation Sirius well or who think they got their knowledge yes that it comes to it through them directly from Sirius I don't think they think they come from

144:10syrius they might I'm not sure but anyway L work started out just as a sort of amateur thing um looking for looking into the cosmology of the dogen and at a certain point he decides to see how that matched current technology he's a techie guy he's a um expert in computer languages and things like that so he's he's he's very good at at this kind of work and he finds that in the first book of his called science of the dogen um that this dogen cosmology of this you know rather Sim simple tribe in um western western Africa Molly Molly I think it is um has their cosmology which is is they know about they can transmit it is in fact consistent with the latest wrinkles and string theory and torsion Theory and high energy physics and all that sort of stuff and then that led him to the study of other civilizations and he's now six or seven books into it and really what he's doing

145:20and it's not to it's unrecognized except by a handful of people you know they're not bestsellers and they're written very well it's very very simple and easy to and easy to follow he's he's showing that this this complex cosmology is understood and expressed by every society virtually every society that he's looked into including the Chinese um that was a relatively recent book and he's ending up by with a a master pict puzzle of all of these ancient civilizations and there's no dating them exactly but it's become quite clear through this body of work that the Ancients had this same effectively the same cosmology and the same understanding of it and we think that this is a hand me down from the ancient civilization that we're busy trying to to validate and the so meaning the survivors of this coronal mass this the survivors of the the people that existed before the coronal

146:28mass that achieved some sort of a high level of sophistication and then these people with the whatever knowledge was left over whatever they had managed to save something of that sort or they were the same people who were everywhere and had it to begin with what you're seeing up here figure 12.4 the quantum fres frenzy can cause a string anti- string pair to erupt and annihilate yielding a more complicated inter action what is that well that's from again that's from the physics lab actually they're talking about I'm not sure this is like some sort of a geometry thing and or a physics thing and they're looking at this is dogen Art is that what this is no but it's dogen art has has that figure in it keep going no down down I think let's see go somewhere the Doan have that well there where is it Jamie okay maybe no no h I think it's the one right after it well very close let's see anyway

147:30anyway you have to read L's book yeah science of the dogen it's really all there and then it's the same in all of the civilizations all over the place and as I said earlier I don't I I I dislike using the Old Testament the Bible for for scholarship because it's a Minefield you just don't know you can select from it I mean you know the inquisitors found a way to justify the Inquisition from the Bible and you can justify just about anything well there's so much craziness in there there's so much so much craziness going on in there but one thing that did strike me and the corresponden is our corresponden is one of the one of the Intriguing bits of of the um of I forget where it is Tower of Babel if it's Exodus or no it can't be Exodus Genesis maybe anyway one of the early books of the Bible where they talk about the Tower of Babel and one of the lines that's very suggestive is before

148:32the the the or before the the tower was built all of all of humanity spoke in one tongue was that the eskimos spoke the same as the Polynesians what is this you know when the Polynesians spoke Chinese no it doesn't seem that doesn't seem logical I mean the linguists don't find that sort of thing but if the common language that they spoke was the cosmology and lar finds the same cosmology wherever he looks that's interesting it's not anything that you can base you know you can't be sure of it but suddenly that that strange line does have some corroboration I think it's very hard for us to put it into perspective what it would be like if there was some sort of a high level of sophistication involved in the society back then and then the experience whatever it was whether it was meteor showers super volcanoes asteroid any whatever it is and then trying to retain a certain amount of it

149:31and pass it on to your children and how things get so convoluted and distorted and there would be very little left yes yeah I mean something like that it's and but the people would be of the same sophistication in terms of the same kind of Minds the same sized brains the same capability they would just have to relearn everything all over again well that's this this is a good I think there's a good case that can be made for that because stuff gets after after this cat catastrophe things really do go into a tail spin and then around 3,000 BC 4,000 BC all of a sudden all over the place very sophisticated civilizations arise but based upon this this ancient knowledge the the mythology is all there to begin with but suddenly there's Samia and around the same time there's Egypt there's there's China for sure there's India and all of these all of these seem to arrive at a

150:35very high level of understanding around that 4,000 or so date especially Su when they go over some of the ancient those uh clay tablets when they see the depictions of the solar system that's where it gets really confusing it's like how the hell did they know this how did they know that there was a sun in the center and that all these planets were in the correct size I mean they they had Jupiter in the correct size in the correct position Mars in the correct position was very very strange stuff I didn't know that actually you seen those yeah beautiful have you ever followed Zacharias hch and stuff he's got some really wacky well it is wacky I fun to read if you're hot but uh the anunaki and those from Heaven to Earth came and created people monkeys and alien DNA he's a he's a galactic darwinian well he was now he's now he's wor food and I call his I I call his I call his followers cinis

151:33sitchin well uh I've read little use for the 12th Planet I think that was called the 12th Planet horrible stuff yes but when you know when you don't know anything it's awesome but uh pull up the an image Jamie of the uh just to show it to um John of the um solar system depiction in the um clay tablets because it's really fascinating stuff I mean it clearly shows a sun with what we you know our standard sort of image of a sun where it's a circle and the radiating sort of lines outside of it and then it has all these planets circling around it yeah there it is right there look at that oh kind dra the sun is a star no that's just it's not a drawing it's just outlined that's the actual original clay taba but they theyve drew uh on as an outline isn't that amazing I you can find the actual tablet Jamie too so and you can zoom in on it so you can see it better but really really incredible

152:29stuff when you consider the fact that they uh made this somewhere around what was this 5,000 BC 4,000 BC I don't know I think that one right there I don't know if it's that early but it's somewhere somewhere in that neighborhood see if you can find a a better full version of it there young Jimmy but incredible stuff and weird stuff I mean they depictions of people with tals sitting on the laps of Giants and that that tends to decode symbolically actually those hybrid creatures and stuff like that those those those most of those things I think should not be taken literally right um like you were talking about myths yeah myths because things change shape and one thing becomes another and when those are shown pictorially it it it doesn't mean that it's to be taken literally there's the original so you can see it there in the background pretty interesting stuff huh

153:35but where where are the in the background where see right there oh there oh yeah yeah yeah and but the Stars that's the original M so that you have the sun in in the middle of the Stars actually that's a motif that you see in Egypt often really where you have where you have a a star with a solar disc and in in in in the middle of it and often they're just Stars they're five-pointed stars and then it's with a solar disc in it and what they're talking about I think the egyptologists talk about a stellar cult and a solar cult and that as soon as you call anything a cult it becomes it becomes you can talk about it because it's somebody else's religion and therefore Superstition but what what what it's talking about and probably this too um is is two levels in other words it's the it's this it's the solar Sky our solar system and the star around it is the zal

154:36sky is the the con constellational sky so it's two two levels of the hierarchy simultaneously but just amazing that you're talking about such a long long time ago and had all the little planets there but all the all they have they don't have Uranus and they don't have Uranus we's see what they have there pull it back up again Jamie I'm finding a couple different versions too oh yeah yeah so there's more than one version of it yeah one only had seven planets they have another one that has nine Ah that's interesting if they have nine this one only has seven right but that was a different one where that shows a star and then it has a bunch of plants off to the side who knows what that means go full view on that one Jamie yeah look at that one it's just so cool to look at something that someone made you know whatever 5,000 6,000 years ago and see their their attempt go back to that please

155:33their their attempt at trying to uh show and convey what they knew about the world or what their thoughts were about the world like what are we seeing here well see that looks like war that one is not well that's a a common theme in in uh that's a common theme in Egypt too the Pharaoh the Pharaoh Smite smiting in the heads of the of his enemies it's the conquest of the forces of light over the forces of darkness in this one the seven might not be there it is um you have that you have that um as I said off often in Egypt or or very similar but the other one the star and the seven the seven Planet could be planets but see it's a different looking star too it's many one two three yeah it's a different one the other one was six it might be it might be it might be a number symbolism thing with the thing and the and the numbers the Egyptians do seven not as

156:34circles like that but as as as dots it's you know it has it has a numerical validity rather necessarily than an astronomical one that one the other one go back to the other one Jeremy yeah now that that one's that one's really interesting yeah all this stuff is interesting yeah the relative sizes the relative sizes that's pretty mindboggling yeah and again and the two the two on the on the Outer Edge is really those two yeah that's that's interesting yeah very that's interesting indeed I'd like to see that explained any other way then then uh they knew something they sure as H knew something I me or it's an amazing lucky guess no that's this is not guess work no it's just uh unraveling ancient civilization it's like putting together a puzzle when you only have five six pieces yeah well we're this is the thing that when we started out there were few pieces and

157:37then now a lot of pieces have been added to the puzzle right like the nuclear glass the coronal mass ejection stuff goe is a big chunk of Gung Padang in in U Indonesia is another one I don't have any photos of that but chak has been to that and is absolutely convinced that it's very very old a that it's that it's human made and that it's very very old so this things are showing up all over the place so go back to the slides and um it's just it's such a uh immerging thing as far as like uh people talking about it too the slides M oh I'm sorry um this is something that's being discussed over and over again now it's much more mainstream and now that Graham Hancock has got a lot of uh traction on his work and his new book magicians of the Gods and Randall Carlson who's an expert on asteroidal impacts has sort of impacted his work as well and really sort of um made it more interesting

158:40because he's provided a context with uh some historical uh like actual scientific evidence of impacts oh yeah go along with it so what are we looking at here that's that's golee again and I'm not yeah that sorry not golee that's not the plier but that's one of shock's one of shock slides I think and I'm not sure what he's what he's driving at there some sort of cellation in the background that's brophy's I think that's brophy's slides where he's looking for much more sophisticated information in the in in natilia and even if his even if his more far out speculations are just speculation I think they could be just the basic the basic premise is already um of great significance that that that this is because this is dated to 5 6,000 BC so that makes at the oldest datable stone circle now one of the things I was going to bring up with you I forgot when we

159:40were talking earlier about this uh idea of the procession of equinoxes uh the wobble of the Earth being caused perhaps by a dwarf star that we don't know exactly where it is uh that was one of the theories about whatever it is outside of the Kyper belt that uh there's this object out there now that they're 90% plus sure exists and they're calling it you know Planet X or whatever it is that they think that it's at least four times larger than the earth and it's some somewhere outside of the Kyper belt which is now what they believe Pluto is a part of right Pluto okay when Pluto is no longer a planet it got listed as an aster poor old Pluto downgraded got the shaft but they think there's something out there and one of the one of the U theories that I had read was that it could be some sort of a dwarf star ah that is uh that exists so far out there that we can't see it oh well Brown dwar

160:37well this is I mean Walter cruttenden who runs who started CAC would be I don't know wonder if he knows about that I'll be seeing him in a few days and uh some interesting stuff going on at CPAC it's the strange you didn't know about it well you know about the planet that they they're pretty sure of right do you know about that I think which well let's see if you can find that like they they think that somewhere outside of Pluto that there is a large body they don't know what it is they don't know exactly how big it is but they think it's far larger than the earth at least four times larger than the earth mhm and that it exists and it's its gravitational effect is having a response here it is new dwarf PL discovered far beyond Pluto no Jamie that's not it I think that's a different that's a dwarf planet this is something that's much larger this is like uh they think it's larger than

161:29Earth just look up planet four times larger than Earth uh believed to be outside of the solar system they think it's a part of the solar system but it's on this gigantic orbit like way way way out there so most of them are binary star systems right most of them I think so yeah yeah CH would know that he's he he knows his astronomy a lot better than I do but it's interesting um if there is some sort of a star or a dead star out there like way out there yeah that it's affecting us it's causing our Earth to wobble maybe yeah I mean here it is astronomers say a NEP no no no no not Neptune neun is that it is that it well Neptune's big it could be of okay that's right huh I didn't see that one the claim is the strongest yet in the centuries long search for Planet X Beyond Neptune the quest has been plagued by farfetch claims and even outright quackery but the New Evidence

162:33comes from a pair of respected planetary scientists I don't want to say that guy's name yeah look at the language look at the language that it's quackery if they don't agree and if it's not one of their own and if it's one of their own it's respected until somebody comes along and shows that they're wrong right but their language is tempered by guys like Zacharias Hitchin isn't it well yeah he brings it on himself that's right but some of their stuff is is is equal that's why I call them the quack ademic because every week there's something coming along disproving stuff that they've been insisting has been right for the last 10 or 15 or 20 years look at this thing but they're never quacks they think it orbits the Sun every 15,000 years great yeah okay wow that's awesome I mean it's just it's so interesting we we know so much but so little at the same time you know uh I

163:25think it was Dennis yeah Dennis McKenna had this great saying that when the bonfire of uh how did it work the bonfire of understanding grows it illuminates the surface area of ignorance well good line yeah that you realize like the the brigh or the light like wow there's so much you don't know and then also you have to distinguish between and understanding yeah for example with the quemic egyptologists they they have a lot of facts at their disposal that they do not understand at all and that's why I mean my own work schaller's own work couldn't have been done without all of that careful factual work by the egyptologists and and what I do or what we do I mean those of us who are looking into this we take that factual material and cherize it and that gives us a certain degree of understanding which those Jer don't have at all those jerks let's go back to the

164:23slides what else you got here that you want to show us I don't know lot there's a lot but some stuff I want to skip okay I keep going I want to skip stuff now because I'm getting I'm running out of Words which is hard to do these are that's one of those very hard Stone vase um with this thin lip and the walls of the vase are about as thick as the rim of the lip and this is all made out of one one uh piece of a very hard stone called Green shift and we think actually shock and myself and an idea by another friend of mine good very good writer named Paul William Roberts was his suggestion that hey maybe these Stone things as there quite a few of them date from the earlier period and have were kept as sacred objects all of those years and of course if they were kept and guarded and not broken when a hammer breaks it but we're kept in t in one piece you know X number

165:21of thousand years they wouldn't be weathered or anything they be fine as long as they were protected now is there any speculation whatsoever as to the method that they use to create something like this well there there's some stupid ones let's hear the stupid ones well that they're shown with with bow drills that you know that go way like you light a fire with sticks like this well it's a kind of a drill that they put in there with balls of some kind of you know Stone and once you get the drilled thing down you can kind of work your way around and gradually gradually gradually hollow out the inside this seems insane to me and that it would take I mean one of those guys should devote his life to taking a block of green shift and trying that method and see how far he gets in 10 or 15 years it's very hard to imagine that they could do that with a method like that

166:18otherwise no one know but isn't that like sort of uh doesn't it balance out with the insanity of building a pyramid in the first place I mean building a pyramid is just an incredible undertaking didn't they say that like if you cut in place 10 stones a day it would take you 664 years to it is mindboggling yeah but but in fact um it's quite clear that they did it it's it's not at all clear that they did it in the allotted 25 years or something of the sort why they did it I mean again you see to a to an academic the the only possible explanation is that they were tombs even though there's no evidence whatsoever that they were tombs but if they say they were tombs they don't need evidence what do you think they were I don't know except what I'm pretty sure is that they weren't tombs and and they weren't tombs only my my general sense of it is that since everything in Egypt

167:12has has its focus the Quest for immortality in some way shape or form that they enhance that Quest they make it possible to do things that you wouldn't otherwise do I can tell you you get enough people together and come on a trip or come on your own when we do our two-hour meditation in the pyramid you come out of there knowing that you've not been just in a quiet bathroom um it it this place surges with power and you get a group of people in there all of whom are especially if they're some who have practiced some meditation it's it's really it's it's something and I mean you come out of there knowing that you've experienced something that you've not experienced before so how they were used and to what end I don't know I mean this is a quite common theory that there were sites of high initiation well there are sites of high initiation and when you understand

168:12what initiation involves that that's not a that's not a dumb Theory it is a dumb Theory if you don't think there's such a thing as initiation and if you think that illumination is dependent upon electricity well you not be able to think Egyptian but if if you've been to the to the places and have experienced for yourself the power of these places then exp explanations of that sort even though they don't count as I mean they're speculative for sure but when you don't have any evidence for them being tombs that's pretty speculative too right and building them is incredible beyond belief lighting them up is only slightly less incredible yeah yeah it's the whole thing now do you have any theories at all is how they could build some sort of a stone thing like this no no I don't pretty incredible stuff but let's go cuz we got a lot of stuff and I don't want to take

169:06okay that's us and my criminal partner Boris swinging the digital Sledgehammer looking for underground Caverns so what you hit that thing and it makes a sound and the soundra the sound goes into to the Earth interesting the next slide is what we found and there it is see a that's that's the that's the that is a cavern or a chamber or of some sort it's a void underneath the Bedrock and that's the so-called Hall of Records people think that that's edigar Casey is talking about we're iffy about it other than that the seismograph does not know how to channel so it just says what's there and what there so it knows there's a void it knows there's a void and at the very back it's a little bit you know see it's the edge of the sea see at the very end by the rump MH that is also a chamber and that's absolutely it's known that it's there and this gives you the

169:57same profile seismologically but there's no way into these things yeah the back one there's a way it's a very rough cut chamber and there's a just behind there one of those stones if you pull it away and you can get in and it's a room uh rough it's very rough but about the size of the room that we're in here the studio and that's a room so if that's a room then it stands to reason that seismographic reason anyway that a is also a a cavern or a grotto or a construction or something so what we're looking at with a when you see all those circles around it and the the rough shape of it that's the shape that they believe the room is so it would be similar to the one that's at the rump where it would be like kind of a rough well well the the seism graphic those are the I think get Top O lines or something that give you the depth that the thing is at and but it's not like a

170:48Square 90° angle well it it's roughly rectangular says Tom Tom decki who is our Geo geop physicist who was doing that work so what's the hold up as far as examining that well two one they don't want to be wrong um two that it's very difficult to do it's under about five about 15 ft of Bedrock that Happ the snx is a probably the the most let's say the the the archaeological High spot of the Universe I mean nothing is more open to you know excitement than all the rest of it is the snx um secondly the water level has risen so that that whole chamber is probably filled with water now so anything that isn't Stone would have been obliterated long ago imagine if you got down there and you found wet Scrolls well maybe or or stone something or another but in theory you could put a little fiber optic something down there and study it but they don't want to be wrong about this and anything invasive

171:56the sinks is really in disastrous condition so any little vibration or something like that could you know could could conceivably damage it I don't worry about these things the geology is much more important as far as I'm concerned and my guess is that when we finally break open the port Cullis and capture all of the you know all of of the capture all of the the the the quadem Maks that that it protects at the moment um which I don't know maybe we'll waterboard them but anyway we C we capture all of the qu academics and get them the hell out of there at that point when it gets when it is when it is accepted and these things do happen this is this idea whose time has come when it has come things change and at that point maybe then the funding shows up and the and the and the determination comes up to actually look into that void or chamber and see if it is indeed a void

172:57or chamber and if there's something in there is it possible that there's some other things in Egypt that haven't been discovered yet oh Lord they even know where they are a lot of them because yeah but what do you call it lanat infrared something you when you can photograph underground they have yeah they there are hundreds of sites that they know where there Graves and you know and like that but most of them I don't think the I don't think that kind of photography I there's a name for it I don't think that kind of Photography goes deep enough for for us to establish the the Lost Civilization it'll be under the sand level it'll be at the bottom of the sand level and so far at any rate it doesn't get down that deeply but they have lots of places to excavate if they had the money okay let's keep going here keep going okay okay well this is now this is shock's book and he'll be at CPAC is

173:52this a recent book that's his last book yeah that's a recent book the role of solar outbursts in our past and future forgotten civilization is the title yeah very very interesting H very interesting thesis and backed up by a lot by a you know a lot of solid a lot of solid scholarship and shock will be at the CPAC this this particular seatback so he thinks it was a a a solar Outburst more than the think it was an asteroidal impact he thinks although that they're not necessarily antithetical the dates the dates in other words it could have been either more I mean shock thinks shock thinks that it's a an impact in the earlier catastrophe that brings on the younger dras that the the intensification of the Ice Age and he thinks that it's the solar Outburst that that puts an end to the the entire civilization and melts all the ice whoa wow uh Northern Lights what else we got

174:53well keep going just just go whisk by here because this is Anthony parat who's a physicist at the it's his thing and here these are these figures that show up in the you know in the in the electron through the electron M microscope and that are mirrored by those strange dancing multi-headed multi-armed figures at the the petroglyphs at the top usually at the upper registers of those of the Petroglyph facade um facade H which also mirrors that's the rango rango script shock is fascinated by the so far untranslatable rango rango script where's that from Easter Island which shows as as letters presumably those kinds of weird humanoid figures H one of the great mysteries of linguists oh yeah yeah huh okay keep going that's the end of it is it yeah it's the bottom of the whole thing mhm of my whole show yep really yeah there was a whole bunch of other stuff that I wanted on not well

176:01some stuff I didn't want I wanted to whisk through but what was up there maybe I'll send it to you is the map of dumfuckistan of Greater and lesser dumfuckistan which is which is very useful and my five Cowboys and the and the graphic of the five cowboys jefic graphic my stepson found it somewhere online but it it really shows the F Cowboys in action which is as I said you pick up the pick up the daily newspaper or turn on the internet and you see the Cowboys at work you've been at this for a long time now you've been at this for many years L late 60s I came across from when I was born yeah okay I was born in ' 67 well it's around that's around the time I I I came across schalla duich yes around then do you feel like people are slowly but surely starting to come around at these the the concepts of these ancient civilizations being not the Primitive people that we've been told but maybe

177:06perhaps really complex oh yeah well a lot of people the trouble is that it's that the the the picture is muddied I mean the academics are as almost as qu academics are as staunch as ever in their in their delusion but the the trouble is that the whole scenario is is muddied and it's almost unavoidable by Ancient Aliens and Zechariah sit and a whole bunch of nutcases that think that aliens built the pyramids and all of that sort of stuff so yes more people are interested but how many the percentage of those that are actually capable of of sifting the evidence and intellectually honest enough to accept what stands up to scrutiny and not numerically there there are lots more of them than they were but statistically they're a very very small percentage of very very small percentage of the populace that actually care or understand it but it only takes a certain small percentage have you ever

178:15tried to get your your magical Egypt series on Netflix no not not on Netflix but they probably wouldn't take it because they they'd have to they' have to make a you have to cut a really lousy deal with them and B um the the the numbers probably wouldn't justify it I don't know about that well they they love documentaries and why would you think that uh they would want to cut a lousy deal they do I mean they they they they they really they really don't give you much I mean The Mystery of the snx is on there but it's the guy who um the guy who uh who did the who does the um reproduction of it that that negotiated with him and chance the downside of chance is that he he's a bit paranoid about letting stuff out of his control so I've told him you know the thing on Netflix or you know but I mean people have stolen it and it's on YouTube yeah in a very you know in a very you know

179:17it's said the reproduction is you really don't see it unless you actually own the DVD right and but it's Chance's baby as far as as as pitching it and he doesn't and it's not so he hasn't even brought it up to Netflix I don't know if he has or not it seems like it'll be right up there alley you would think but I I've given up sort of arguing the case if he doesn't it's his it's his it's his baby yeah but it's not I mean it is and it's not but it's a big part of your work I mean I just think that that would be a great venue for it I think it would be too but you write him and tell him that should well I have a Netflix comedy he been trying to get on your show for a while has he been well he's been emailing you a couple of times and emailing the wrong address nobody responded so he he gives up uh anyway I never got any emails from the dude we we'll talk about that after the show

180:08we'll try to figure that out but uh I got a comedy special coming out on Netflix in October I'd be happy to talk to them and uh say hey this is something you guys should look at mhm you know I mean I don't have any idea what kind of deals they cut in terms of documentaries but what I do know is that what you did is amazing and then I think that it would uh it would it would be great for everybody to have that have more access because I agree just the just the sheer depth of the information when you you go over like the temple and man and all the the different just the the different incredible structures that exist in Egypt that most people don't even discuss oh they they don't know about and they don't want to discuss said but chances I mean that's you know the way to really watch people have told me this that me too I mean I'm not I'm not much into even dope I casually smoke it once

180:59in a while but I'm not much vodka my vice such as it is I don't even consider it vicious but um watching that a couple of toes to watch magical with a couple of toes cuz it slows things down the editing on that is is breathtaking yeah and there's a hypnotic quality to it it's really I mean it's an extraordinary achievement and shock did it on sorry shock I mean chance did it on a zero budget you know and doing all of the photography I mean everything single-handed on nothing it's really the the Heroic Production and and you know and we made nothing out of it nothing let's let's try to get it on Netflix I really want I'm going to try to make an attempt so when you attempt yeah I will I'm going to try to make an attempt I'm going to bring it to them and have a conversation with them yeah yeah I just think give have give them a copy they might not even know you know I

181:53mean I I guarantee they don't but they probably don't know it's I really think it's one of the great works I really do I think it's and it's so in depth it's so in depth that the only way you could do it was to self produce it yeah oh yeah you couldn't get anyone to do that nobody would go you're going to do eight DVDs on what are you out of your mind nobody's going to watch all that I watched it I watched it like three or four times lots of people do I mean people and you have a magical Egypt too right well we're working on except we don't have the funding and actually this is Chance's baby now cuz I'm anytime he wants me I'm there for him but I'm not in any position to to really help with it because I'm so swamped with my own stuff right what would be covered in magical Egypt I don't know we've got the first one semi done but I I don't know what he's got in

182:39mind and he's in Australia so I don't get to see him at all and it's even Skype is is not good for in-depth evening long convers no no it's not so I don't know but I'll bet if you showed it to Netflix and they expressed an interest he'd be interested well I'm going to do that I'm going to do that I'm going to bring them a copy we're going to see what we can do I think it's it's one of those things that I really believe that people should see and I think that if you could get it on Netflix and I I could tweet it and let the world know and try to get people to spread the word I think once people see it they just start like that making of a murderer thing you know that that caught all that traction entirely because it was on Netflix and Word of Mouth mostly I really think that that that magical Egypt is one of those things yeah yeah well what what I would like to do

183:23actually and I hope my pal clay and some other people are going to help me with this I'd like to get some of my other when I'm wearing my other hat my my uh my My Writers my Bohemian Beret instead of my egyptological pit helmet because I've got a I mean a whole lifetime's worth of work much of which has been produced but none of it really um commercially successful and it's just sitting there waiting to get done and Netflix would be the perfect venue for it if I had something to show them um you know because they do production I mean they they're producers now too it's an interesting time I mean that's one of the best things about the internet is that something like that can kind of spring up like uh and become a bigger Network than any of the networks on television yeah that's that's the upside well the networks are about to die in good riddens well it's a silly idea but

184:16it was good back when there was was no other ideas and you had to sit through those commercials and wait for the next segment and then you watch 10 minutes and then commercials popped on again you rolled your eyes wait for the commercials again and that all that stuff's nonsense now you watch a commercial now you're like what is this silly thing well the internet's full of commercials too it is it is but at least uh at least they're usually at the beginning of a video they come in the middle sometimes too and things they're there but anyway anyway magical Egypt is awesome you're awesome appreciate on here glad we got a chance to meet it's a big difference even though Skype is the next best thing to three dimensional meeting it isn't three-dimensional meeting so it's it's fun to be here and thanks for inviting me well thank you and thank you for all of your work

185:04because I think you've done a great service to uh to the world to sort of shine light on this amazing civilization thank you much appreciated all right ladies and gentlemen is it thank you very much John Anthony West go seek out his work can definitely go buy magical Egypt don't pirate it you go buy it it's awesome exactly and and and if you have the money and the if you have the wherewithal and the will get on an Egypt trip because get on an Egypt trip with this man because I'm good enough to get up and down the pyramids but who knows for how long exactly so uh all right strike while the iron's hot n