John Dudley

00:00dum dum dum dum dum yes we're live John Dudley put the phone away and let's get popping no I got I I have some some important subjects that I wanted to vent about so oh did you put them on uh like a little note yeah I got a notepad I'm pretty good about doing homework so I love your podcast so listening through there was crap you talked about I was like oh yeah I got to get on oh you got to bring that up yeah so John Dudley world famous art coach uh he's got a TV show he's got a podcast uh I found out about you because of the TV show first the podcast second which I became obsessed with if you're into archery like I know some of these people that are listening to this podcast they get into archery cuz it it sounds fun like oo maybe I need a new hobby and uh then you go down that crazy Rabbit Hole well when I found you you're you're down the rabbit hole like a few

00:52light years you're gone man freaking Johnny de down in that deep Johnny deep you're gone you're gone down the the the archery Rabbit Hole I had no idea the rabbit hole goes so deep but let's show this video we're going to play this video this is uh before John came up here he did now I just need to explain how difficult it is just to even hit a Target at 100 yards this is at 100 yeah yeah okay 100 yards is a foot length of a football field I want to shut that thing off just shut the uh volume off there um 100 yards the length of a football field and for archery it's just it's so hard to hit something as wide as your wingspan at 100 yards for the average person and so John made this ridiculous shot on U one of the gorilla kettle bells from on it yeah this was uh so we'll play this here this is going to be an unbelievable challenge I've got Joe Rogan's favorite workout tool I've

01:50got an on it kettlebell Primal and Kong is going to have to make a decision whether he's going to let this Arrow pass or not I'm going to try to put an arrow through that 2in handle right there and actually at this distance of a 100 yards and the angle that Arrow has to come in I bet it's even smaller this is going to be an unbelievable challenge definitely going to have to defy the odds my idea is to put them right here on this shelf and I've got a curtain right behind so hopefully it'll stop the arrow but also let it do its thing so that we cap all this on tape right at dark I'm going to put an arrow through a 2in gap in the handle if Kong lets it pass there he is let's check it out it's so ridiculous that that actually went in that little hole at 100 yard did you have to try more than one attempt I this was actually my first shot with everything set up cuz I had to

03:12do a little bit of homework what I did was I knew I couldn't see the hole in the handle good enough to aim at it so I actually sighted my bow in to where I hit 4 and2 in high from Kong's face so I literally aimed right at Kong's shiny face and I had my bow sighted in to hit 4 and 1/2 in high to make it through the Gap that's insane yep yeah my wife's filming right here Sharon was running the iPhone but I had four cameras out so we could get some cool angles and stuff and nailed it I wanted to wait till night so that that lighted knock could give a little bit more while factor for everyone watching this I it's it's such a ridiculous shot but this 100 yard thanks to the on it people too that was awesome getting that thing look at that yeah was pretty crazy right there carbon defant there you go Joe how awesome is that 100 yard it's pretty amazing and you watch that on YouTube it just went

04:13off uh on YouTube on the knock on archery yeah not did you guys put it up too we'll put a link up okay Jamie if you can tweet it and I'll I'll retweet it when we get a chance um that that's insanely hard to do it's uh I mean I never did any archery whatsoever till about 3 years ago I mean maybe maybe I might have done it I think I might have done it in the Boy Scouts every says that you know what's funny is every person that finds out on one they're in disbelief that there's actually like professional archers but then they say oh I tried archery like back in school one time in gym and I loved it and but then everyone says but I hit my arm right they were they like remember that they tried it once and they loved it but they hit their arm that's what they always say yeah that's I always thought had to wear those wrist things like when I would see people that were shooting

05:03bows without those wrist things I'm like they're like riding a motorcycle without a helmet these people are crazy they're loose people well the way some people shoot it is like riding a bike without a helmet you peel some skin off if you do it the wrong way well that's what I've been going into over these last couple of days with you and this one of more more fascinating aspects about this I want to I don't want to call it sport cuz I I think archery is a lot of different things it's a discipline for sure but and when it's done correctly in a lot of ways it's almost like a martial art it's like a learning it's like a weapon art like in martial arts when you see someone do something like if someone's like really good at Judo or something like that like when they execute a throw and it's just perfect position and perfect technique it's beautiful you know there's like a beauty

05:49to it and when you see an an Archer like I was talking to you about that this when I was watching and trying to get it in my head this sort of flow that you have in what you do and it's super similar in a lot of ways and something that I really didn't predict like I guess I just always assume that I kind of know what something is if it seems pretty straightforward like oh yeah you pull this the string back and then you let the arrow fly pretty straightforward like I think that's most people's idea of what archery is but then when you really pay attention to the technical aspects of all the different stuff that's going on and all the different things you think about and how you literally cannot have anything on your mind other than all the technique involved your foot placement your Technique and standing your breathing where how you're drawing it back the

06:42position of your front shoulder the position of your rear elbow how you're pulling where how what do you how do you respond after the arrows released there's so much going on that like when you put it all together like it it has it leaves no room for homework there's no room for relationship ship there's no room for taxes there's no room in there man if you want to make a nice shot like that like I guarantee you if we could have a brain scan of your head the second you release that Arrow at 100 yards to go in that 2-in Gap there would be nothing in there other than what you did it would there would be no other no other cells would be fired up no no that's one thing and actually like yesterday when we were shooting there towards the end of the day you got to the point where you were almost your mind was clear it's almost like for me you know your family came

07:36home like things were winding down you knew that like work was over and we it was like right before dark and like for me I love shooting at first light and At Last Light because it seems like that's when I'm not really worried about someone texting me or calling me I'm not worried about a problem at home and I shoot with a clear mind and I I'm way more efficient at my practice and it is a form of meditation I mean it's like you said it's an art and if you're clouded then you it will reflect that on the target I mean it's like if your arrows are in one spot then you know you have a single focus and it's almost like the more those arrows are spread that's a representation of how many other thoughts and distractions you have going in your mind I mean and I look at it that way when I shoot I'm trying to narrow everything down to just a movement and you look at

08:31good golfers the ones that swing easy and it just literally looks like flow they're such good Strikers and they're so much more efficient when you see people that are trying to be robotic and and almost like hack something then it's like too systematic you know you see someone like that does professional karate or something if they're in a forms competition if they're like real rigid going around it's just not what it's meant to be Ian I mean it's supposed to be a dance it's supposed to be like literally a mental musical that's playing and if your mind is clear then it's it's a form of meditation it really is no question about it and that same state of total complete concentration exists in a bunch of different disciplines and I you know finding it in archery now Rec or I should say recognizing it I definitely haven't hit it but finding that seeing it and recognizing that sort of super

09:33highlevel flow that comes into play when someone's excellent at what they do um I've seen that in pool I've seen that watching professional pool players like um perfect example like you were talking about like striking the ball really hard as a golfer there's a guy named Francisco Bustamante he's one of the best pool players in the world and he's from the Philippines and Francisco Bustamante has the most ridiculous break you would think if you watch his break shot that he weighs 400 lb and has arms like tree trunks you you watch that break it's just blah blah those balls close the triangle if you watch him you just watch the speed of the ball and it's effortless the way he does it is just he has this perfect amount of timing and flow here you can see him do it here this isn't him this is a different guy if you just look up uh Bustamante Francisco Bustamante breaking

10:27that's what it say it it says that there well there's definitely not not him this is a some overweight gentleman what if he gained oh that is him that is him he's just it's a weird he's in a weird pose oh that's what SL oh okay it's just a weird pose I thought when he was bent over I thought that was his whole body yeah he is loading but he's a tiny guy like if you see him physically yeah I mean he it might weigh like well he's a little fat now he's getting older but when he was young he probably weighed like 140 lbs but he was like B Lam oh my goodness those balls go flying everywhere no one's like him yeah yeah dog get after it he's excited I think he just won on the break or something like that sweet I've seen him make six balls on the break like he's playing nine ball he makes six balls on the break he's got three balls to run out he just insanely good but he's just a

11:17devastating player all around and one of the things when you watch him play and a lot of the Filipinos Filipinos are so good there's so many really good Filipino pool players but they have this gentle flow to what they're doing like everything is like like a ballet like effortless the weight of the queue does like all the work and everything looks like it looks like so flowing and like like a dance like a dance well the one thing that's so cool about well the one thing I'm really proud of as an Archer is that I've got to the point where I have a platform to get people involved and that was when I found out that you really liked my podcast which the podcasts are totally geared around around education and learning you know that's what that I got to a platform to where I could help people and now there's people like you that are coming in that never really have considered

12:11that whole world and they come in and I look at people that like you know they go to the YMCA they want to take like taiichi or they want to take yoga they're looking for a stressfree type of Hobby and archery is a great sport for that it's growing so much I mean Hollywood's embracing it obviously with a lot of the movies but they're they're not portraying it as an art form when that movie The what the hell is it called hung the girl the girl Hunger Games yeah when she started becoming more famous or that movie rather became popular archery took off didn't it was a lot of people got involved yeah I mean you look at um you look at the Avengers you look at you know Hunger Games there's there's actually so many even a lot of the sitcoms now you know obviously crossbows are popular because of walking dead but when it comes to like true archery you just see a lot more archers coming in

13:08Lord of the Rings you know legalis was so popular because of you know because of that and it's really such a cool sport I mean it's an Olympic sport and we've we've actually have a phenomenal Olympic team here in the US our men's team is definitely going to be contenders for another medal they were silver medalists last year and so you were saying that compound bows are not in the Olympics it's Recurve Bows yep it's recurve bows and that's it's kind of a tradition and honestly it's a different style of art but it's it's super graceful too and I mean I think it's everyone has something that they like to do some people like the Simplicity of a sport it's like there's people that go and want to only have a longbow or they don't want sights they just want the Zen part of trying to pull back with with no sights but then there's also People Like Us that want to

14:01see how finite and accurate you can become so they like the techie side which is where compound bows come in they're just they're much more efficient and obviously the accuracy as we' seen is is almost mindblowing at times pretty mind-blowing and it's also for a guy like me cuz I'm a a a gadget dork so it combines both things it combines the Zen aspect of complete and total discipline and focus and looking at one task and drowning out the rest of the world but it also has like geeky stuff like different kinds of sites and this is a new cam that they just came out with and these are different kinds of strings and when you do this it makes this better and there so much going on with it oh yeah you can you know if I look back at the bows I started with and I've I've only been shooting professionally since 97 so I mean it's 19 years I guess it seem I'm getting old

14:56now but um that's a long time bows that I use then that are at the house you wonder how in the heck you shot that good with them and actually um two months ago I was at the Olympic headquarters like the Olympic Museum so they have all these awesome Olympic artifacts of like swim trunks people or like you know the javelin um got to see the original recurve both like J bars was actually on display and they constantly change them so if you're visiting the museum you're not seeing the same things all the time but you look at those pieces of equipment the bikes I mean the bikes that people rode in the Olympic Games it's like holy cow how are they that efficient it's almost more impressive because now we've gotten so advanced in our equipment that it's easier to be at the level I think than 20 years ago cuz the equipment just wasn't there you you know I almost

15:55wonder if those people didn't have to put in two or three times the time and be just that much more elegant at what they did because their equipment was almost a handicap back then could they perform the same kind of Feats like could someone shoot an arrow like that like was it a common thing to be able to shoot what you did 100 yards and shooting through that 2-in opening into the kettle bell handle um I'm sure there people that were there's a lot there's actually a lot of people in archery now that are pushing this envelope I mean long long distance shooting is becoming super popular and you know to a lot of the real Target archers that are out there that are listening to this podcast see when we go to a full feta tournament we shoot 30 what does feta stand for um well now it's World archery so like a world archery event if you shot a a full Target Round you would shoot arrows at

16:5330 or 30 m 50 m 70 M and 90 M and I found out from you that 90 me is 99 yard it's one of the easiest metric conversions to do you take the first number and you add it to the second so if you got 40 take the four and add it behind the 40 you got 44 yards if it's 40 m so yeah that's one of the the one metric system that I never forget but um so 99 yards is where we would stand on the line and shoot at you know and I I think I told you that back in 2005 I was really focused on on shooting well for the US team when I was on the compound team and there were several tournaments that I was really focused on I knew that I was going to be shooting um a national championship in in Britain and in Australia I was going to be going I think I had shot one in Poland um had one one or two here in the US but you know that year I think I logged I mean I shot two three 400

17:56arrows a day and 90 M for me the further you go out it's like putting a bigger microscope on things that you're doing wrong you know it's it's just like an art or um if you look at a golfer that's making long putts obviously it's magnifying mistakes in their swing or golfers that are drivers you know people that really are just sitting there trying to be accurate at the long game it magnifies mistakes so I really like shooting at longer distances I know you do too because it magnifies a stake and you can correct it easier and it really helps bring things together but that year I shot well over 30,000 arrows at 99 yards during during training insane yeah yeah I mean and there's professional archers there's archers I guarantee you there's archers right now somewhere that's preparing for a World Cup event or something and there's people that literally have calluses

18:53thicker most weightlifters just from grabbing a hold of that release or you know I remember looking at an an Olympic recurve Shooter's fingers one time um and I remember his his hands his three fingers that he grabs a string with it looked like a frog hand because the tips were so big from pulling blood you know I think because he and I mean these guys you look at the people that are at like the Olympic training centers that are just there they get up they go eat and then they shoot until 5 or six at night and they eat and then they go and do a weight training session I bet you there's people that do a thousand arrows a day so I mean you know you can build up some stamina yeah it's it's really impressive um but in saying that I think with archery it's you know you know that I'm really big into fitness as well I credit my fitness and my story as an athlete prior to being an

19:55Archer as part of what's helped me be successful and there's a big difference between quantity and quality and a lot of people make the mistake I think with any sport of just trying to practice more or train more and even weightlifters you know I see people that I go in the gym and they're like on one exercise and then when I leave the gym in 50 minutes or an hour they're like maybe done two different types of exercise and it's just it's not effici you know I think a lot of people as athletes sometimes miss the boat of quality over over the quantity and and I was always that way there's days where I go practice and I may only make a hundred shots but once I start realizing that I'm breaking down I know to step away right you don't try to push through it yeah and I told you that yesterday too there was a time where I said you know if if we're just out here getting

20:57repetition I guess that's one thing but we really don't need to do that aiming at a Target well you had a really good point too about those bad shots and bad repetitions you got to you got to get those out of your head so it's not just that you made a bad shot now you have to make a bunch of good shots to try to get away with the from the effect of the bad shot it's not as simple as the one bad shot no it's imprinting yeah I mean it's it's an imprint and I think with any type of athletic you know and it's probably that way with Fighters I'm sure too if you get someone that's just really in a rhythm and in a flow if all of a sudden they start making a mistake or doing something bad as a coach you try to get them back into that rhythm again so that that you can weed out that imprint you know and that's tough as an athlete sometimes you know people that

21:48and I'm sure for Fighters you know you look at people that come out and have a disappointing loss it's almost like that's an imprint it is and that's why that statement you're only as good as your last fight is so disturbing to Fighters yeah and and that's one thing one of the most important things that I learned as a competitive Archer and I was I had a temper when I first started as a pro if I made a bad shot you know kind of like when you kind of put one in the pool when you put one in the pool and you were like freaking you were pissed off I that's how I would be on a on a on a tournament you know I would freaking ram my stabilizer into the ground so hard that I would crack it you know well my problem was and I just did it once I did There's it's a really complicated geeky sort of an explanation folks but there's a certain type of release where it's a tension based release and that's

22:45what we're practicing with and difference between pulling a trigger and then allowing the tension but you have to hold the safety while you pull it back otherwise the arrow just Bo it just fly I mean it's not like it's not like it's going to shoot anything it's going really slow but it lobs in a very embarrassing and just very disappointing way just comes off your thing as you're pulling the bow back it goes toink and you go what the I did this I did it three times I did it yesterday and today oh was so super it's super embarrassing but uh so that's uh yeah I was definitely uh annoying myself well when I would make something like that that would really trigger me into a pissed off realm I would let one mistake affect everything else after that and a lot of athletes the really good athletes that I watch in any sport tennis players golfers the key is when

23:43you have a negative moment to not let it affect what hasn't happened yet so um a guy came up to me one time after I made a bad shot and he could tell I was getting hot and he looked at me and he said you know the only arrows you you have control on right now are the ones that are still in that quiver and for me that like CH it completely changed my outcome as a professional Archer and I've I've brought so much of what arry has done to me as an athlete into my life and there's times where you just something really torqus you off and you have to just like look at okay everything I do from here on out is is the only thing I have control on because that's history there's no I haven't figured out a way once that release glowes pling to actually grab that arrow and pull it back and stick it back in the quiver or put it back on the string it's it's like a perfect representation of life you

24:49make a decision if it was you have to reset and say what do I need to do with myself to get back on track in life you know we make bad decisions at times but how do we make a good decision to get back on you know get back online yeah it's it's management of the Mind in a lot of ways yep and it's all one of the things that I also like about archery love about archery is that it's absolute like you you can't pull that Arrow back like it's flying through the air and either it hits the bull's eye or you missed it's it's just it is what it is it doesn't care about where you live it doesn't care who your uncle is it doesn't care how much money you make a year it doesn't care like The Arrow is going to go it's an absolute discipline and I think you coming from professional or coming from Sports rather Sports background you played a lot of football yep um when you play sports especially

25:44insanely competitive Sports you learn where all the edges are to be had you learn where all the edges are to be had as far as technique as far as conditioning as far as all the different things you have to do in order to be successful and to win and everyone knows is that in most sports especially in a physical sport like football there's a lot of work involved there's not a single person who jumps off the bench who doesn't have any training whatsoever and kicks ass in football you just don't you got to learn and you have to learn how to move you have to learn all of the different plays you have to learn technique involved in different aspects of the sport and I think coming from a competitive background in athletics you've kind of translated that understanding of where all the problems are in in archery because there's a lot of people that are like they they don't

26:33have good coaching and so they start off with a lot of really bad habits and then they have to figure out a way to either break those habits or they live with those habits and then they do the best they can with this sort of limited path that they've carved in and they seem to not be able to escape the same thing exists in martial arts one of the hardest things for me when I used to teach was teaching people that already had a bad technique imprint in their brain like they would have one way of throwing a kick or something like that and I would have to go oh Jesus I got to figure out a way to break this guy of this thing because as soon as he gets tired or as soon as he panics the knee goes down the foot goes up he loses all the power the hips don't engage it's it's a like but if I could take a kid like a 5-year-old kid and show them that from the beginning their Instinct would

27:21be to throw it correctly the Instinct even when tired knee comes up hip turns over body extends full power and those things are so hard to unlearn once you get like a bad path it's why it's as I I really do think that archery in a lot of ways is a martial art yeah oh yeah well you look at the the whole Asian culture and I've said time and time again I've coached all over the world and you know that's kind of what I do now I do a lot of coaching that most people don't even know about with teams that just would rather have confidentiality and whether or not they're working with an outside source which is great but when I the probably the best place I ever taught was when I went to India because I actually taught those I had I was supposed to have 16 archers once I got there there was about 140 I mean it was unbelievable anyone they thought could be a potential winner for their team was

28:27there and there was so many kids and you know adults that were there and I remember I took several members of the team that had a bad habit of you know punching the trigger and anticipating the shot which is a big negative in archery and I gave him a device same one I gave you I gave them a release that forces them to not think about actually aiming the front sight of the bow it's a device that makes them focus on the movement of archery pulling through the bow letting the front arm go forward the back arm to come back and I remember I gave him string and that release I took all their bows away and locked them up because I said until you can do this we're not going any further so I took those eight and I had them do that to the side and then I came over and I started trying to work on all these other people and there was like this person needed their bow worked on this

29:24person needed to watch me shoot this people wanted you know to take pictures or video of me shooting then we went to lunch then the whole thing started over again then when it came to dinner time I told them you guys all go ahead I'm going to like pack up my gear well once the whole big crowd left those same eight kids were still over there with strings pulling on that release and almost every one of them were damn near bloody in their hand from just executing and I came over I'm like oh my goodness have you guys been here the whole day yes sir yes sir there was like there's there that culture there's it's just no wonder to me why like martial arts is such a discipline because that culture teaches discipline and hard work within that art better than anything and I think that archery coming out of you know out of Asia I think think um all the like the Korean team are so strong

30:32because of their disciplines and I'm sure with the martial arts it's the exact same thing they're not afraid to take what the coach says and just do it until the coach says no and a lot of people here in any sport are looking for the shortcut people at the gym they want body yeah they want the shake that you know melts fat they want to be able to go in and get the machine that you know does four minute abs or whatever and the reality is you have to have commitment and you have to have discipline in anything in life otherwise if you don't you're just going to be another person bitching about why someone else has something and you don't because you're not willing to put the effort in for it yeah and then on the other hand it's not a good idea to cut your hands with a rope you got take some time off kids yeah yeah slow slow down don't be afraid to raise your hand and say coach can we

31:33take a break here and then I I should point out to a lot of people that um you know there's a lot of people that don't want to get involved in anything like archery that un interested in it because they feel like uh they they don't want to hunt they don't want to be a bow hunter i' I've heard that before I'm not interested in that I'm like if even if you're you don't have to be interested in that like that is that's the furthest end of the extreme Spectrum when it comes to archery you could enjoy archery with just a y yard a yard and a Target I mean you can you don't need to shoot anything other than a Target to and to get like you know yesterday and today we're just shooting targets and very fun super fulfilling like at the end of the day you know especially cuz yesterday made a lot of progress at the end of the day I was like wow you know this is

32:16feels great it's cleansing you've made a dramatic Improvement I mean I'm I'm really pumped with how you are but what I love about archery is hopefully you can't hear that this is dang good by the way when when when Joe does his um commercials which actually it's the only thing on TV I don't fast forward through the commercials because I love how you do them but when he talks about the butter coffee take his advice on it it's good I I've enjoyed it yeah get some good coffee some good grass-fed butter and some MCT oil it blend it all up it was yeah it was awesome I think what's so cool about archery too is it's it's not a sport that is limited by your age and for that matter it's not totally limited by your physical physique well how about that guy that has no arms oh yeah Matt is unbelievable incredible yeah Matt stutzman is I mean it should be Matt studman he's I mean the armless

33:15Archer he's so inspir I mean his kind of his nickname is inspirational Archer and he's definitely just that for someone to be able to to shoot with their legs is amaz and actually Matt we haven't talked about this but Matt and another pair of Archer here from the US named Jeff Fab that shoots with his mouth he was in a motorcycle accident and now he's a par Archer yeah there's Matt stutzman right there and so how does Matt he holds the the bow with his right foot and then his left foot's on the ground and how does he release the bow so well he's he's actually um design Jeff fa's next I think too on to the right but so he's developed a release to where he's actually able to push on it with his chin and he's a he actually activates from back tension now they've designed a release for him where he can hook on and he slowly starts to continue to move back until it triggers the

34:13string to Fire and as he moves back he's still looking through his peep site yep wow it's a small movement you know how small the movement is I mean when I talk about that movement it's very finite it's a matter of an inch or two that I think that's Jeff right there yeah there's Jeff ay so yeah when I did um last year when I had to have my show my shoulder redone I did not want to miss archery season and just really took it as a personal challenge to not put my head down and I learned to shoot it was actually my bow arm was the one I had worked on so I had to learn to shoot with my mouth using my opposite arm in my in my non-dominant eye which was I'm I'm thankful for it people always you know people ask me all the time if I regret this or if I would do that different and screw that I mean you can't the past is the past I I just want to look forward on everything when I

35:14when I messed up my shoulder I was bummed about it but in all fairness I thought it was a really good challenge to look at a sport that I love from a new Direction you know yeah to look at the technique involved you know I think um someone said it I forget who it was um that one of the best ways to get good at something is to do it with your opposite hand oh and that not just doing it like say if like you you're boxing and you're working on your uh your your straight right hand a lot of times when you do your straight left hand it actually improves your straight right hand because in learning how to do it in an awkward way what you're doing is sort of programming into your mind mind the critical aspects of the technique how to throw the hips in when to to plant and then when you go over to your more coordinated side it's just like super tuned in to the critical

36:10aspects of the movement so then when you get you know you throw a left hand then you switch over to your right side you're like blam it just it's even better it's even faster it's even cleaner and I think that that probably makes sense with archery as well I bet a lot of people would probably benefit although it's not a traditional thing to do probably benefit from having both left-handed bow and a right-handed bow and learning how to shoot left-handed well look at how many skateboarders get better when they learn to skate goofy you know if they learn to skate with the opposite foot yeah back back when I was a skater you know you either skated like straight foot or you skated goofy but then people didn't really switch back and forth a lot at that time unless like the freestyle skaters did back then but then when I got away from skating and started you know playing football for a while

36:57and then archery and then all a sudden you know the X Games happen you start seeing guys like Tony Hawk or whatever you realize that the whole Skating World just completely went to like what the freestyle skaters were and just being able to switch either way and still perform the exact same tricks and I think any athlete that's listening and you know so what's funny is sometimes I've seen you say you know hey I'm talking about hunting today but some of you listeners might get pissed but whatever cuz some people just want UFC or some people don't like to hear the you can't ever worry about that yeah but what's super important is that people need to take some of these elements and apply them to their life and what I really believe is when I get better as an athlete is when I recognize whatever my biggest weakness is and that's what I focus on making my strength I call it

37:49selective cycling I work on this with a lot of my students I'll literally take the one thing that they do the worst and that's all I want them to do for almost a month because a lot of psychology has shown that if you have a negative habit it normally takes about 21 days to recreate a positive habit right so you have to be able to take your weakness and mentally be tough enough as an athlete to be willing to make that your strength and I've had several things in my career that were my weakness that are now my strongest aspect field archery was my biggest weakness now it's my biggest strength what is the difference between field archery well it's not on flat ground you know once you start changing angles and once you start having to make shots in Canyons you have to learn wind you have to learn trajectory you have so field archery is you have like a course that you have to

38:50run and it's all outdoors in the woods yep it would be outdoors it would be you know the really difficult field courses are like throughout like Cliffs and mountainous areas to where you know you have shots where they're straight up way over your shoulder where you're aiming on you know 50 degree angles and then you're you know aiming down or somewhere I've even had to aim straight down between my legs um those types of things are extremely technical you know if you had golfers that had to play in really difficult terrain obviously they have to start learning draws and Fades and they have to start learning clubs that play differently in the wind it would it would be the same thing it you it pointed out just like when we shoot at longer distances like I mean you were you were shooting amazing at eight were we at 80 yards yeah on your rubber deer your rubber elk you call it I always

39:47laugh the rubber it's but um you were shooting amazing and then you would have one shot where something wasn't right but it would show up and that's what field archery did to me it really started to open up my weaknesses and for me as an athlete I'm always so competitive that I want to know what I suck at because I think if you're really going to master something regardless of the craft you have to be so well-rounded and I mean the UFC is that way even as a spectator I'm not a I'm not like a fight specialist by any means but I I've always loved watching the UFC and it's funny how the people who won the early UFC versus how rounded you have to be now to win you can't afford to have a weakness so ignoring it isn't doing you any favors yeah it's a different world now completely different world and you also much like we were talking about before in the UFC you have to be able to

40:46pretty much execute from both sides it's very rare that someone only has like a a good right kick you know you have to learn how to kick with the left side too but in Jiu-Jitsu that that exists as well like there's a lot of guys that have a strong side like they only like to pass to the left or they only like to pass to the right they only submit guys off their right arm it's like it's real common to have a side where you're really good at it what really uh one thing you said that the other day when we were sitting there talking and you were talking about setting up moves for ju-jitsu and how evolving it is how it continually evolves and all of a sudden a new move will get invented and you'll be practicing that and then someone just notices like wait there a big weakness right there yeah do this and we've kind of eliminated someone getting that move

41:34done on you and then it's like holy crap well so how do we how do we actually combat that right it's just a continual chess game yeah it really is and the body can move in so many different ways it's one of the more interesting aspects of Jiu-Jitsu is there are so many different ways the body can move so when two people are engaging each other with there's the the possibilities of of attacks and counterattacks are like near infinite it's a it's it's a spectacular example of like an extreme discipline and something that becomes just for a lot of people becomes a massive massive Obsession did you see the Anthony Bourdain thing that he won a jiu-jitsu tournament uhuh Anthony Bourdain starts jiujitsu at 58 years old okay he uh was I think he quit smoking he wasn't smoking anymore because he he stopped smoking when his daughter was born I think but still like still was hitting

42:30the booze you know still wasn't eating healthy he was on statins for his uh blood pressure or cholesterol I guess he just you know just wasn't healthy yeah gets into Jiu-Jitsu because of his wife his wife is a maniac she loves Jiu-Jitsu gets into it and now he's obsessed trains every day often twice a day and he just wanted jiu-jitsu tournament has a blue belt at what is he 59 or something like that incredible 59y old Bourdain took home the gold at his first jiu-jitsu tournament I mean get the out of here to me as someone who loves Jiu-Jitsu I'm just blown away I'm I'm blown away I just love seeing a guy like him who is a Madman at so many different things and also a guy who's an artist and he his art being culinary being a chef I know I learned from watching his show that that's an art form I didn't really consider it before or I watched um No Reservations his old show I watched him

43:32interact with all these cooks and like a light bulb went off I'm like oh cooking's an art these heck yeah I never thought of it that way I thought of it as like oh that guy know how how to cook this guy makes some good this and that guy cooks and good that but I didn't think of it and the same way I look at like maybe a guy who's an amazing sculptor I didn't think about it that way and then I realized it when I watched his show I was like yeah really I never did I was just thought oh this guy's a kick you know this guy knows how to make uh sausages or this guy's really good at lasagna or something you know didn't didn't didn't seem like an art so seeing him a guy who highlighted that there is an art in cooking food then um become obsessed with this art of Jiu-Jitsu and which I think in a lot of ways like we were saying about um AR archery there's parallels I mean people

44:22think of Kendo which is a Japanese sword fighting art that's unquestionably a martial art well then so is AR archery yep and if kend Do's a martial art so is archery 100% because archery involves a weapon involves but it's so much more than that man so much more than that it's some weird crazy moving meditation that I feel like when it goes well like yesterday when we shot really well and we shot like tight groups at 80 yards well after it's over like physically you feel better you feel like charged up you feel elevated you feel better than if you did nothing like there's like if you could take a drug that makes you feel the way you feel when you hit a perfect X at 80 yards like that ah like you would take that drug all day oh yeah if that was a cigarette yeah right freaking high on Bullseye high on bull you didn't get any I've been pounding I've been

45:20pounding that crap all morning man lit up right now A Skin's tingly yeah it's it's a very strange I guess discipline a martial artart a discipline but I think almost labeling these things in any other way than just calling them what they mean that is just it is archery you know when you put them in categories when you categorize things as this is a sport or this is a hobby or this is a it almost trivializes the the benefits the positive benefits of it it's funny that you say that because now I know I could never pull you away because I love as an athlete to step away with perfection and you would shoot a group that was like perfect and I knew that we were close to being done for the day and I'd be like all right let's end on that and you're like no way dude I'm doing another one but then if but then if you make one negative shot in that group you were pissed again which I can understand

46:17too cuz I'm I'm so competitive that way but I also love that feeling that you're talking about it's awesome sometimes to have that and it's important and that's what I was trying to like work with you on is it doesn't get better than what you just did you're on a high let's I want you to like step away thinking about your trip all night so tomorrow you know you visualize it long enough I'm the way I think is tomorrow you're more likely to be able to duplicate I don't like to go I don't ever like to go to bed on a negative right so that's actually what I was trying to do but you know we're not good enough friends where I can be like listen give me your well I don't know I guess I did take some stuff away from you so I I probably could some of the releases that I was using he won't let me use I know but it's in your house well this is very geeky stuff so for

47:18people that are listening to this they they don't understand but because there's so many different aspects of archery there's where you're standing what your Ure is how you're how you're focusing what you're looking at what you're concentrating on because of that there's there's a tendency to anticipate the shot and it becomes sort of overwhelming because you're managing all these different things so what a lot of people try to concentrate now in the world of archery is getting what you call a surprise shot meaning that this is just for the people at home obviously not for you meaning that when you pull back the the thing that you concent trting on is just focusing on the target all of your Technique as far as keeping the bow balanced and level and keeping it on to all that stuff is something you've already worked on all you're working on now is pulling through the

48:10shot so you don't think about executing the shot like ready go and when you think of that ready go that pressing that button you have a tendency or possibility of punching it of hitting it wrong of tweaking and twisting and we talked about that today because it's in a lot of ways it's like a fight and that when a fighter trains for a fight you're training for something that is going to be a moment that's like months away from now so all of this work and effort then comes to fruition in this one moment fighter number one are you ready fighter number two are you ready fight holy here it is it's happening but at least in a fight you're you know you've got a few rounds you can kind of settle in after the first minute or so you can relax and get into the group prove of everything in archery often times that all that training and preparation whether it's for a tournament or even

49:04more critically if you're hunting it comes down to that one moment and that moment sometimes can be completely overwhelming because that moment although your practice has been constant and diligent that moment is entirely alien this moment didn't exist during any of the practice there was never the elevated heart rate there's never the freak out there's never the massive consequences if you make an error everything has to be in place and those those things are what make a discipline so rewarding when you actually pull it off all those things like knowing that there's so many different factors involved and then this alien moment so those factors involved all the discipline factors you have to drill them into a point where they become a part of you they become like ingrained in your genetics they they become a part of your DNA so that in that one insane

50:01heart pounding moment you can execute it flawlessly and the best way to do it which I'm learning from you is by figuring out how to do it with a surprise shot so that way you take out that the anticipation aspect of it yeah it's the less you think about it the more likely it is for things to happen you know you you have to be so focused on the process that the prize happens without your expectation the really interesting part about what I've learned as a competitive Archer is it's the fastest buzz kill of any sport I've ever had and what I mean by that is there's times where you're standing on the line you realize okay Archer number one one Arrow Archer number two one Arrow closest to Center decides a gold medal match you literally let go and you're you know you're sitting there you know pickles your heart rate's beating out your neck you know you're

51:05trying not to I actually had this I've had this feeling go both ways but you let that Arrow go and you you have so much adrenaline that you you can barely manage it and then you're like you shoot and you see the shadow of that Arrow hit out like out of the gold to where you know you lost and it's instantly gone you you have you're not nervous you're not like sweating or shaking you just knew you blew it and it it's like wiped so fast it's really really strange that the release of one product you know of a art form can just you instantly know that you screwed up and you know and I've been that way as a Hunter too where you get nervous and all of a sudden that shot happens and then you almost can't you know for some people they make the shot and then they get like that but sometimes you make that shot and it's amazing how fast it's just gone and it's such a rewarding thing

52:17when you can take you know that ball of just emotion and just say I got this and you freak clamp down on it and then you see that Arrow go into the gold and it's just like it's such a reward like for me that's what you I think for you and your mentality and me and mine you get so much reward for that that for me I never really worried about a I never worry about a trophy or medal or you know for that matter the checks never really mattered either when I was younger I needed them but you know I've just came to the real realization that you know every trophy I have at home is tarnished you know they need cleaning you know they just Wilt away but what imprints I have in my mind of moments like that's what pulls me through as a person and it's positive AA that I can reflect on you know I know that what's satisfying to me and I feel so content with life is these small

53:24little goals and accomplishments that I've had had where I've controlled myself not the situation I was in a gold medal match in Poland and they had the the gold medal match in this square like in the square of the main town you were shooting from the from the beach into the main square of the town and our match was first and I was the first Archer so I stepped up we were in a team round and there was so many people I raised my bow I I pulled back I was going into my shot and as I'm looking through my scope at the Target about four people's heads come like looking in like this because there were people lined all the way down and this is 70 M so everyone's evidently was shuffling to try to get to see the Archer not realizing like okay there's an arrow going over your head so I'm going from like mentally having a site picture that I'm not nervous about to

54:29all a sudden thinking if I shoot someone in the face I don't want to spend the rest of my life in a Poland polish prison and I remember they have someone like cleaning the line getting the people to back up no it was just like they didn't I don't think they really thought that people were going to come in and I remember I drew back and I was so I mean you've seen me shoot in my element it's very smooth so then all of a sudden there was like my front arm was like you know I got into that tremor mode like you know what you have when you when the anxiety sets in and I remember I shot and they're like you know they called 10 and I came off the line and my other my teammate that was with me goes what the hell dude why you shaking so bad he's like what the hell dude you almost missed what's up with you like as we're passing one another and I go you'll see and he freaking

55:19pulls back and he goes what the f Dam I'm like so that next around I'm like get freaking people out of the way like I had people's faces in my scope that's a YouTube video waiting to happen I somebody catching one to the temple leaning into the path that's just so ridiculous you don't want one to the temple and if anybody doesn't if you don't know like when you're looking through a site of a um uh an Archer a bow archery sights are very small so you're you're looking at a very narrow window so for these people to actually be in your sight they had to be extremely close to the path of the arrow it's a one while the arrow was arcing over their melon but it their head Christ cuz they were between me and the target so so crazy though it was very crazy that's so dumb yeah it I was like what is up with this they did what I did at the pool today forget to the safety it's easy

56:16when you're concentrating all the other things it it weirds me out I've been at I've been at places where I'm practicing and you're like shooting and then someone else is at this club and you like go down to pull your arrow and then all of a sudden you're like sitting there like pulling your arrows and it's like and you're like uh yo what's up oh god oh I'm just saying I'm aiming at that other Target it's like okay well yeah you know how many Joe Rogan pool shots I've seen in my in my day I don't want to be on the receiving into that it certainly can happen you know what you've got set up is is really cool that giant long range at your house so you could practice like in your yard like that like there's a video that you put up John set up my bow um I got this bow from Hoy and John set it up perfect and he took these crazy shots and one of them he took was 122 yards yep and um

57:05like to to be able to do that and to have like this big open space like that in your yard has got to be awesome it's way cool yeah actually um when we bought my house my wife Sharon she knew that we wanted to move out to a farm because where I when I before I moved to Iowa so I could get more Deer tags you laugh about that it's hilarious who the moves to a state so they can get more Deer tags you can get an extra deer tag who doesn't I'll guarantee you right now if Cam Haynes could get two elk tags if he cross a state line I'll guarantee you he would do it oh he loves Oregon he travels a lot anyway well he might see I get Three Buck tags actually so I bet you three you a different situation though like uh white tail hunting in Iowa is just so different and plus it's is for folks who aren't aware it it's like a tradition it's a it's an Americana thing like white tail hunting

58:04is probably the biggest hunting Pastime in America more people hunt white tails more people spend more time hunting white tails than anything and it's also like probably some of the best meat you're ever going to eat in your life oh yeah I've been crushing mine I mean yeah so I love that's why I was so surprised when you said you don't you didn't see like cooking as an art I actually when when I go someplace nice I I take pictures of my food because to me I see it that way and actually I cook some backstraps the other night and you know I cook some backstraps I like you know cook some vegetables in like a coconut oil or something and then you know I like sliced through that tenderloin and like kind of folded them all down and then like stacked my little half strap up and kind of leaned them against there and I was just like looking at it like why would people not want to do this like

59:05why would people not want to be able to do this for themselves to make a nice meal yeah to make a nice meal and obviously it's something that is a reward of hard work and dedication that I've put in through the year you know my saying one saying that I made on my TV show during the first few seasons is um I'm in Target Archer to become a better Hunter and I'm a better Hunter because I'm a Target Archer I got into professional archery 100% because I wanted to be more proficient and ethical knowing that I was a bow hunter and I kind of had the it was actually the same type of feeling I was I was only 10 but it or I mean when I started competing I started hunting when I was 10 so there was like six or seven years there where I wasn't comp competing but I remember having one hunt where I felt so much anxiety and I like blew a shot and I just completely missed and I couldn't

60:06explain why and it was at that moment that I'm like you know what if I'm going to do this I need to be able to be ethical at it so it at that point I was kind of looking for a way to become better and I was actually it was right before I was supposed to leave for my first football camps for college I was driving down a road and there was a sign on the road that said um 3D archery shoot and it was just an arrow pointing down and I pulled in I had like my hunting bow in the back of my truck you know kind of drive in and I see all these people like shooting on this practice range and then I see like groups of four going into this course to like shoot and it was all foam animal targets with scoring rings on them and you step up to the line you look at the Target you try to figure out how far it is without having a range finder and then you make a shot and depending on

61:06you know all the scoring is within the ethical Kill Zone of an animal so after I think I think it was 15 targets it was a 40 Target course after 15 targets I didn't have a single Arrow left in my quiver I'd lost all of them and it was like a wakeup call it was the first time that I had ever felt defeated at something it was the first time that I had a very clear wakeup call of maybe you're not good enough to be doing this you know and for me that was a trigger as a competitor I think the standout athletes in any sport are the ones that take those moments very personal and change a Direction to make it their best or either realize I'm either going to be good at this or I need to find something else to be good at you know to focus all your energy to and one thing led to another I went to an archery shop where I saw a lot of guys with like shirts on that said like

62:15the name of a shop so I knew they were like kind of local shooters for representing this store so the next day I was in that store and I said hey I want to get better I know a lot of guys here were shooting and a lot of those guys were in the range and I just started asking questions a lot of people didn't want to help which is why I really want to help the archery world it's my way of giving back cuz there were people that didn't want to help me but then I remember a guy came in and said are my arrows done and the guy behind the counter said let me check in the back and he kind of walked past me and he goes come here kid and cuz I had hung out in that store for about four days just kind of watching and looking around I didn't really have any you know importance so he takes me in the back room and he says you got to build these guys arrows for me because I forgot to do them and I

63:09said I don't know how to build arrows and he goes okay you take this feather you put in this clamp put glue right down this feather like this put the arrow in this jig you push down on it then you turn the wheel go to the next Arrow after you get to the end take the clamp off put another feather in and he literally gave me the thing so I was in there like trying to figure out how to do this you didn't even work there no I was there like like literally stalking people in the range I was like the weird guy in the corner with like the hunting bow that was probably my dad's hand me down I'm like stalking all the shooters and about an hour later I came out with you know this guy's arrows that he probably paid a hundred bucks for and some like Snot no kid that did had never even built them built them for the guy and so he goes all right good job and he goes here now go do these and two weeks

64:00later I remember telling my dad hey I think I'm going to um I'm not going to do that the football thing and he's like what do you mean and I said I I got to offered a job at this archery shop I'm going to do it and my dad's like so you're not going to play college football and get a get a um an education you're going to work in an archery shop he goes what's this archery shop paying I said 410 an hour yeah that was my dad's been so good my both my parents have been so supportive on everything in life but that was the one time where he looked me in the face and just said this is a really stupid decision but hey I mean you know it's I just think it's a great story because it shows that if someone's willing to commit to a dream then as long as you're able to put in the work and stay focused on it there's so many people that make businesses out of Dreams or you know

65:03careers out of sports that you would never even consider well just think of that story now you're traveling all over the world coaching International Teams and archery I mean it's it's a crazy story if you really stop and think about it it's really weird you know I have some very I have some friends that are very successful according to the business world and there's times where I'm with those people and then they're introducing me to like a senator or governor and then they're like well John you know it's like hey this is my personal friend John and I'm you know with the President of University or something and they're like so John what do you do and it's one of these you want to be able to say oh I have an NBA or you know yeah I do um rocket science stuff but it's like uh I'm an Archer yeah I shoot a bow for a living and they're just like really I'm a slingshot

66:03Master yeah exactly but then you start you know you start explaining what you're actually doing and you realize this is a it's a really big world and it's there's such great people there you know I have I liter it's really nice to be able to say I don't have any regrets in life because I'm in an industry that I love I'm doing something that I really really love and there's such good people around it and all you have to do is get up every morning when the alarm goes off mine goes off pretty early and then just put in the work and you know I just think it's so cool to know that there's opportunity like that different a path that maybe perhaps other people hadn't considered oh yeah yeah and just you know it's such a great country to live in too here in the States because you can take something that no one really might not believe in but yourself and if

67:04you apply the work to it you can make it happen and in traveling through all the different parts of the world that I've traveled I've gone to places where you just you know you really wish you could give some of those people a chance because you can tell that they have such heart and such desire but they don't have opportunity that's sad like to me that's that's really sad that there's not opportunity everywhere and then you come here and you see someone that has potential or opportunity but they're lazy and they won't put in the work yeah they don't have the desperation they don't have the desire they don't have the drive they don't they don't you know I think a lot of times for some people when they're young it's not enforced early on that when you work hard at something it's really rewarding when it's over and it's difficult to work hard at something it's difficult to get

67:59your ass out of bed it's difficult to force yourself to get up off the couch it's difficult to but once you do it it's always good it always feels good and even if you do something and it doesn't work out well like uh even if you you're practicing archering the shots don't go well it's still you're involved in the discipline and it's giving you something to concentrate on and that'll translate that energy and momentum will translate to the rest of your life if you're working to improve at something whether it's archery or Jiu-Jitsu or anything when you're working to improve improve on it I firmly believe that that motivation and that momentum of improvement applies to the rest of your life and it's one of the things that people love about any particular discipline is the the aspects of it and the qualities of it that sort of transfer onto your everyday life you

68:48know it's weird because until you and I communicated some on the phone when I worked for an archery company and I was just a sales guy making calls I never got to see faces all I ever heard was voices so voices for me are always triggers cuz for 10 years I was just making calls when you and I first talked on the phone and I like heard your voice directly like from my device I actually realized I haven't even told you this but I when I work out or when I shoot and a lot of times when I just working in my building I've comprised like about 5 hours of a MP3 that's nothing but motivational sayings that I've heard someone say whether it's and I that's all I play It's My Ambient sound and you were on there twice about just almost like what you just talked about just a positive it it was just a positive rant that you had about all people have to do is make a

70:01step in a direction and you might you know you might look in the mirror one time and you don't like what's there but you know you have the opportunity to turn around and go a different way and one thing that I really try to drive to people because there's times you talk to someone and you know that they're down in the dumps you know and you one thing I tell people is you know motivation gets you going commitment keeps you going you know it's it's no different than the New Year's resolution I freaking hate that I hate if there's any time uh I don't want to go to the gym it's two weeks after New Year's because it's like this swarm of people and all to me there's people in there were like you know what good for them you know they're they're not in shape good for them to come here but then it's so disappointing when it's like 2 days they're gone W that's so common too yep

71:05yep and you know if you're if you're at that stage and you're at the point where you're like you know what I want to change myself physically it's funny how many people won't even it's funny how many people are going to the gym to work out but they'll Circle the gym parking lot like 10 times so they want they want the first row to open up Park as far away from the front door as you can and warm up by walking in skip yeah skip to the Lop well I think a lot of people need a life coach I think this is what I'm the conclusion one of the conclusions that I'm coming to in life is that um people need to either find a way to motivate themselves through all the different stuff that's available online I mean there's a million different websites and Instagram pages and lots of YouTube videos that show some motivation and they can help you um but we human beings

72:05learn from each other and I think most of the cultures in the past not trying to like glorify the past and say they had it nailed and we don't but most of them were in titered knit groups and they emulated the behavior and the patterns of the successful members of that group the leaders of that tribe that's where traditions and uh came from that's where skills were passed on and that's where ethics and that's where certain philosophies were passed down from generation to generation these were the most beneficial to the community as a whole to the individual to the the culture whatever what whatever it is this world that we're living in today we're almost in a lot of ways like you were saying people with so much opportunity but too lazy we're almost in a lot of ways just lacking in uh a pattern a correct pattern and a coach or or a mentor or a person who is

73:06ahead of you but honest like ahead of you as far as like maybe been alive longer or maybe had more experiences but very honest about the difference between you and them because a lot of people think that you you see some like we were talking about today this is a ridiculous analogy but when um I was on MTV we were talking about Downtown Julie Brown yeah because I was singing on the line and I remember thinking while you were saying that like you you go Downtown Julie Brown was probably on MTV back when you were on MTV and I was like yeah but I was a peon like she wouldn't know who I was I was on one of you know x amount of comedians on the MTV half hour Comedy Hour like I couldn't probably couldn't even talk to her say hi to her and then I remember thinking like I put myself in that state of mind that I had back when I was 23 or whatever I was when I was on

73:58that show and I felt like insignificant and like whoa that's Downtown Julie Brown and then I've realized like now that that's nonsense like now I know that's nonsense but in my head thinking about that time I felt like I did when I was 23 that like see it you said it that was your first reply you're like yeah I was just a peon then and then all of a sudden I think once you thought about first few seconds you're like you know what F that well it's so well it's so ridiculous it's so ridiculous but I did think that way back then I think a lot of other people think that way now you know and whether it's uh someone who's an aspiring Archer that looks at your accomplishments and then looks at you back when you were this stalker kid hanging around a bow shop in comparison to how they are and I think that's that's a big that's a big help to people to hear a story like that and to know

74:51that now you travel all over the world and you coach International Teams and to to see someone admit that I think is like very important to see someone discuss that I think it's very important to a lot of us because we don't really most people don't have mentors and most people aren't even involved in like a discipline that tests them in that manner we're involved a lot of people are involved in education right you go through high school you go to college you get a degree you're studying you're practicing but how much of that what you're doing has the aspects of the obsession with a discipline like archery or like Jiu-Jitsu or think some on those lines you're not getting the same intensity and focus you're reluctant to do the work you're doing it because you have to because you got to get a degree because you got to get a job because you don't want to be a loser and so you're

75:39pursuing these things with a lack of passion and then you enter into the workforce hopefully you're doing what you love most of the time people are not most of the time people are doing what they think is a good job that they can get by with and so they're committed to this path of not being excited not being obsessed and then not challenging themselves and not Rising above and not Gathering up some of the possible lessons that you can and it it could be anything it could be anything if you want to make knives if you love making jackets if you like painting it could it doesn't there's no one particular thing that it should be for you you just have to find out whatever starts that spark in you for you it was archery for me it was standup ComEd you know or martial arts you know it could be it could really be anything but I think we need things like that if people don't have

76:32things like that if they just work and then they go home and they watch TV and they go work and they go home and they watch TV you're not you're not living life at level 10 it's just you're not going to hit it you're never going to feel that and I'm not saying you're going to be at level 10 every day but there's going to be some moments like when you were talking about you know being on the line you know two archers this is the for one shot for the gold medal and you're like that that feeling those those feelings are integral to being a human being the feelings of being challenged and of learning what you're capable of and what you're not capable of through those challenges absolutely and the thing is too you have to be able when you've made that decision the next thing that you should come to terms with is say you know what I'm going to push myself further than I've ever pushed

77:24myself myself and I know dang good and well there is going to be a block there's going to be resistance I heard in a podcast from you long ago you talked about the book um the war of art I bought it stepen prfi I bought it so you know it talks about resistance and actually you know with you learning this new release for your archery I told you before you even made your first shot there is going to be a point where you're not going to like this and you need need to know right now that we're going to push through it so a lot of times when people make that determination and that decision in life of you know what I'm going to go to the gym I'm going to get ready you need to also think you know what there's going to be I'm going to have a voice in my head that's going to tell me this is too hard and I'm going to have a point of resistance but I'm telling myself right

78:17now when I get that that's my opportunity to go further than I've ever have in the past I know right now that when I get to that I am pushing through it if you're only focused on one particular goal and not seeing the obvious distractions or things that are going to that you know are going to be in that path and mentally build build up yourself to know when I get to that resistance I'm driving through you know I listen to that podcast with steo and he talked about he knew he was ready to beat his habits and when he was in there and they're like telling him that he should be going he's like no I want like he probably knew deep down inside that if he left he was that was it was going to be an opportunity for him to fail so he had already made up his mind that he was going through that and so many people in life just don't push that one time and then they never really see how far they

79:24can can go you know I heard like um one time I heard Les Brown say um you know would you rather go through life um aiming too high and miss or aiming too low and hit I mean I would rather aim high and fall short and still be further ahead than aiming too low and hitting exactly a low goal you know I think you have to be willing to fail and get good at it I lost way more tournaments than I've ever won and some of the people that like question why I'm at where I'm at in archery they're like well he never won that much you know what I'm probably lost more than anybody that's good but I I dang sure know that it made me a better person and when I lost I was at the tournament the next week making sure that I worked on whatever it was that caused me to lose you know I think I remember remember a guy one time saying you know you haven't really figured out how to win yet but and that's critical

80:33for an athlete well it's critical that that moment that happens in in a competition where you're worried about the event you're worried about the outcome and that worry can overwhelm your abilities yep yeah absolutely and when you get to that point you have to be willing to dig deep down and say you know what this is what I've worked for I knew this was coming I you know if it if there wasn't nervousness and the possibility of defeat or Victory then there probably wouldn't be any sense of inner accomplishment to it you've literally done everything you can to get to that moment that's a defining moment so which way are you going to go you know then you have a decision to make and for me my victories were so much sweeter because I had failed a lot before that and it got to the point where I remember being in a match one time and I had taken like several second

81:36thirds leading up to that and I remember getting there and I just I closed my eyes on that last arrow and I just I'm like I'm freaking sick of blowing it screw that I'm not doing it again I'm going to make a good shot Rocky movie yeah like T yeah keep going and then so I just closed my eyes and and made the shot and then when I made it the victory seemed so much sweeter because I had pushed through adversity to get there you know I think that's that's what I love about archery is that you know one day you're so good and then the next day you know you see flaws and you see mistakes well it's a long Rabbit Hole too that's the the weirdest thing about archery you wouldn't think it's such a long Rabbit Hole there's so much to learn and so many different places to go and there's so many people that you're you watch TV I've I've taken to watch I I watch hunting shows much to the shagr of my

82:35family I think it's hilarious but some of them are so bad there's s there's such bad production like if you want to learn bad television like say if you're a person out there that's aspiring to do a TV show there's some there's some hunting shows out there that look like they were made by blind people that were drunk and the animals like they they they shoot especially the archery shows they miss more than they hit them I mean if someone from like if someone wanted to make a an argument against the ethical use of archery for hunting all they need to do watch some of those shows but it's just I think it's you know it's a difficult thing to do and some people kind of half asset and some of those people that do half asset they're on television well and that brings up a really good point because I know a lot of people that probably are listening that either know myself or know that

83:31you're a hunting Advocate and a conservationist like myself we owe it at to ourselves as an art you know as a Hunting Community to realize that there is a big opposition pushing back and we have a responsibility to represent ourselves ethically and also appreciate other people people's feelings and you know appreciate that there are people that might not like it and you really have an opportunity to either do something that's going to really piss them off or if you're going to maybe do something to where it'll at least let them keep an open mind now well the best way to do that I think is have conversations about it oh yeah I mean I can't tell you how many Facebook messages and Twitter messages I've gotten from people that have told me that they had a particular view a negative view about hunting until they listen to like maybe a podcast with Steve Rella or Cameron Haynes or Jim

84:29shaki and they realize like oh this is not what I think it is not only is it not what I think it is you must do something to control these animal populations and the one thing I've said this before but I'm going to say it again to anybody that thinks there's no reason to ever kill wild animals I have two words for you feral pigs you can't you better do something cuz if you don't do something they will overwhelm the Earth well what about people man people are overwhelming the Earth too man yeah I like people you can have sex with them you can talk to them you can go to the movies with them they make cars I'm a big fan of people so except people that make parking lots yeah they they're making some narrow parking lots in California list okay somewhere in the somewhere in the last 10 years whoever was working for like American and United Airlines that made economy plus and then

85:23took the big dump on the regular economy seats F someone finally fired those people and then they started designing parking lots cuz freaking you can't park your junk and anything anymore they never have an obvious way to like get to the strip mall that's right next door they make you like exit the freaking Pac-Man exit where like you have to go around all the ghosts and to like finally get to the one way to get out and then turn and go down to get into the next one well they definitely are trying to shove too many spots in place like uh I was somewhere uh recently oh Santa Barbara where it's real nice but there's not that many people and one of the things that I noticed when I was there I was like look how big the parking spots are they're nice and wide because they're not overwhelmed by the same amount of people there's only like a 100,000 people in all of Santa Barbara

86:12it's like an easier way to to get around down there yeah I like that yeah that's yeah man there's too many goddamn people I don't want a jam we're moving you ready to move Jamie's thumbs up from Jamie what's that out we're moving Santa Barbara it let's do that you need do you need a person to like you need a full-time range manager that they need to build a range that's the next step if I get deeper and deeper with this I'm going to open up an archery shop I think so for sure I think uh an archery school would be the way to go honestly I really think that there are a lot of different martial arts schools and I've been involved in a bunch of them and I think that uh teaching martial arts is is gigantic but one of the things that's a problem with archery and most particular with bow hunting is the learning curve is extremely Steep and it's not obvious at

86:59all as to where to start the learning curve to start archery is just go to an archery store go to a shop but I mean I've had experience with shops that didn't know what they were doing and I went there and I got bad advice from them and I I saw people that really didn't exactly know what they were doing and they were telling me Oh you don't need that oh you don't need this and there's so many people out there that probably would be interested in in archery and I know there's a lot of people that are interested in hunting as well they just don't know where to start and I think having like classes in a like a shop is probably a really good idea and probably something I'm going to get into in the future well I want to see that yeah no I would coming to your grand opening your grand open all right man you're in but I would have to most certainly have people that were there

87:48that were really good that could teach classes and teach people how to do it you know like we were showing you showing me the video of your son hunting alligators and I said it right as you were saying I was like look at his form like your kid is like his perfect form like a world champion archer like the way he's got his his posture the way he released and when you know we we we were watching that I was thinking well here's a kid that's learned from the beginning how to do it correctly so when you look at him as opposed to that picture that you sent me of the Archer that's on television that has a uh an arrow that he's p pulling back his string is deep tucked into his face where for sure when you're pulling your string back and it's digging into your face the the pressure of your face on that string is going to change the path of the arrow you're never supposed to dig it into your face

88:38like this guy has it then you look down his arrow is not even attached to the string it's like hanging off and he doesn't even know it it is the most and this guy's on television and that picture was used for an ad yeah the the picture was on an ad which means they took the picture somebody looked at it and they were so careless that they want yep good enough keep going we got it nailed it and they took that and they put it on television or they put it in a magazine or what have you but when you see someone who started from the beginning like your son with perfect form how old was he in that like 10 yeah he started when he was nine so in that picture with that video with the alligator when you see that as opposed to someone who's been doing it wrong their whole life you realize the import import of original technique like having it like your original lessons the first

89:29lessons you get imprinting correctly oh yeah yeah and that's a big part of what I'm doing can I plug the yeah yeah well your your show which is called knock on TV it's on uh sport not Sportman's Channel out on Sportsman's Channel and they're both by owned by the same people now right yeah yeah the Outdoor Channel and the Sportsman Channel are both owned by the same people and then you know the YouTube site knock on archery there's a lot lot of if you go through there and if you're not a hunter then move past that because there's a lot of how-to stuff and that's a direction that I'm really going to be going the whole focus on this brand um knock on which I think I I think I have a hat on yeah um you know it's it was a brand intended for people that aren't really necessarily wanting to say I'm a Hunter but I'm an Archer and so much of what this show is geared around and it

90:23took a long time for me to convince the network for me to dedicate you know right now I have three segments that are how to be better with your form in the dead center segment then the field Recon segment is how to be better in the field as an Hunter you know some type of a technique and then I have the third segment called knocked and ready to rock which last year was literally how to buy a bow and completely set up the bat start to finish throughout the whole there's a video of that it's over an hour long it's on YouTube which is a very difficult timec consuming and involved process yep and then this year the knock and ready to rock segment is all about like learning to build your own arrows but as I move forward through the seasons and through the you know through the YouTube channel I'm going to continue to try to work on building all these fundamentals to become a good shooter

91:16and Harry and my wife they both started out with no experience at all and it's funny how if if you show the basic fundamentals and you're taught right from the very beginning how easy you can get to perfect form it's when you go into it with like you know I always say women and kids are way easier to teach than guys because there's not the Macho Factor you know guys are like dude I know how to grab here give me that I'll show you how to do it well they also worry more about being a loser yep whereas people who are not worried about man I'm uh you I'm if I this up damn dude I'm a loser and this guy's a winner like there's a lot of people that don't like learning things because they don't want to up you know and I think when you you teach a a woman or a a young person they have less ego they don't think of themselves as being the yet you know I mean women don't

92:11just they just don't have as many ego problems as men do in that regard well there's two there's two type you know I've I've looked a lot into sports psychology and I I one the first time I talked to you one of the things where I was really hoping you could help me with and if anyone's listening out there that's like a sports psychologist I actually I have a I have a big add problem I'm very but it also has been a huge part of my success as an Archer because I Zone things out there's times where I've been in competitions people come up to me and say hey sorry I bumped you with the camera or whatever it's like when because I like I don't like you're so tunnel vision on stuff so unless you see heads in those tunnels yeah the heads kind of was a distraction that was my Aderall but yeah i' I've really wondered you know is is AD D or you know that is that like an asset to

93:08get in the zone faster but yeah we talked about that and I want my my issue is what is ADD you know I'm I'm not exactly sure that everyone who has ADD is really has a disorder I think a lot of right I think a lot of is a style of thinking or a way of thinking you know right now like my dad's a psychologist and it's amazing to me how many people will you know I've Got Friends that'll like go to the shrink for a 30 minute session and they're like oh yeah I got some Aderall dude I got add really bad yeah when I got when I got diagnosed with mine I went for three different days and almost did like a psychological evaluation I mean it was like questioning questioning and questioning and I remember like reading through this thing that that a that a true psychologist did to diagnose what I had I remember one of the lines said it was like one of the beginning

94:04lines it's like John has always been a fairly normal boy he never had a problem soiling his Linens or something like that it was like that sounds like weird when someone became a serial killer John has always been a normal boy until we found the one hand sticking out of the dirt in the backyard we never suspected anything that's kind of what it was like but but is AD and is ADD recognized 100% like is it universally recognized like there is an issue with ADD I would say so they argue that jie they argue that it's more the case against add how about that Google that let's give it a shot they argue that there's more there's more people coming you know that are saying they have ADD and I think because doctors are so quick to prescribe nowadays but what what does it mean it means attention deficit Disorder so what does exactly that mean well like for me

94:57it sometimes people are talking to maybe when I'm so zoned out on something else I never hear it you know there's just constant distraction there's constant distraction if I'm tuned into you then you know a lot of times like you know I'll be focused on something and my wife like has to snap at me like a dog see but that to me is not attention deficit disorder that's not attention deficit at all that's extreme attention on one thing yeah and just a unwillingness to engage with distractions but then there's times what's weird about it is then there's times where you're trying to focus on something and it's like every stimuli comes into play right but what of those things that you're trying to focus on is it ever anything that you're really interested in or is it just some you have to do like fix a pipe or you know well certainly there's times where people are talking to you

95:50and you really don't want to listen to them that's I have a a feeling that's what attension deficit disorder is people are bored as or that is a lot of the time well every you know there's this wide range of the way people think and the way people address situations like you can even see it in your children like I have um my middle child is very outgoing and very loud and silly and she'll talk to anybody but my youngest child if she doesn't know you she ain't saying you can say hi to her and she's like whatever dude she'll hide behind me I ain't talking to this guy like she just has her own style of engaging with people and they both also have their own very distinct um likes and dislikes as far as like the kind of TV shows they like or the kind of toys they like or the kind of art that they do and I just think that that same variety applies to things that people

96:46are interested in and not interested in in life and we take these kids man and this is a big part of the problem with education there's a lot of different jobs out there and the path for a guy who wants to be a professional Archer versus the path for a guy who wants to be an audio engineer these are very different paths and they involve very different amounts of data different different kinds of data different stimuli and we take people and especially when they're young we make them pay attention to they don't give a about and I don't think it's good for them and I think we could like when I was in high school they always said oh he doesn't pay attention he's got no put something in front of me that I care about and that's all I pay attention to so it's not that I'm a nerell but you you make me feel like I am make me feel like I'm a loser because I don't give a about math or or Spanish

97:37history sorry it's not ringing in my 13-year old head I'm thinking about tits right now I have time for Spanish history I don't give a but you might talk to me about Pirates and all of a sudden for whatever reason that spark gets lit and now I'm interested and now I'm obsessed with pirates and I want to read books about Pirates I want to talk about Pirates there's all sorts of different things that people get excited about and interested in but the problem I think or one of the problems with formalized education and our some for some strange reason our need to diagnose certain styles of thinking and certain styles of of of approaching life as problematic as add or he's got you know he's got ADHD oh he's just he can't stop he's in a classroom they're teaching nonsense he's sitting on a plastic chair he wants to run through the wall it's everything I could

98:28do I have a neighbor and sometimes this guy Corners me okay and he'll tell me some stupid about his son's basketball game or some other and I literally want to run up a tree I just want to and I don't have ADD I'm not I'm not I don't know of ADHD I'm bored man and you're kidnapping me with this stupid goddamn conversation and I'm like yeah hey look at the time got to go so I told him you know if you're going to get some time on that that bench and that's how I felt when I was in school I felt a lot of that in school and I think that that's a lot of what's going on we're all interested in different and formalized education in a lot of circles and a lot of schools is just too limited for some of the kids in class I remember Harry his first football team I'm thinking he was like nine or 10 and one of the kids shows up with like a big can of Monster and he's

99:19like drinking it oh Jesus and the and we were trying to control the kid and I went over to the mom and I said like you know and it was every day how old was this kid he was 10 oh my God yeah yeah and I remember going over and the mom said the mom goes yeah we just have such a problem control and it the thing is it was 8 in the morning for a football game and she goes we just he just never listens I mean the doctor says he is ADD and I'm like you just gave him a green monster at 8 in the morning he's 10 and he had like a double can of monster I'm talking the the big ones and how how much do you think he weighed uh 100 lb Jesus Christ that's like could be wrong but that's more than two adults siiz servings could be wrong but I think I know the problem yeah it might be your kids on crank I mean that's crank that's that's extreme doses of caffeine and sugar there sugar and those things and

100:20you don't even know what else really yeah and you know what man they got to stop selling you some and saying it's more than one serving you you can't do that anymore you got to stop doing that if it's in one package and it's like a drink that's a serving stop saying it's two servings yeah unless it's like a a box of like something you know that you're going to cook if it's a box that's multiple servings right don't tell me this bottle of water is too freaking serving well that's fine you could say it you could say that does it is it kid but that's fine because there's no there's no negative consequences in drinking a bottle of water it's universally agreed that an 8 O bottle water or it's not going to hurt anybody but one of those Monster energy drinks or my uh trainer had uh a protein bar the other day it was like a small one too man it was only like maybe three

101:13inches long it was a small protein bar and uh he goes oh I got to get my protein bar I go your candy bar I'm with them I go do you're eating candy he goes no man I go I how many grams of sugar in there than that and he goes nine I go really I go how many servings in each bar he goes no way I go check yeah and he goes it's two I go that's 18 grams of sugar in that little tiny thing that's a candy bar yeah absolutely I coach that with teams actually because when I competed the one thing that I think was that I found really really helpful is to be able to travel and keep yourself in your same daily routine with your rest and your diet and more importantly your garbage intake because people will go to a tournament and then they'll like pop in and they'll grab like you know a power bar you know like the chocolate covered power bar and then they go to a tournament and they're like having a

102:08snack and then all a sudden like two target Sor are like I don't know what's up I'm kind of like bouncing all over the place and I'm thinking you just had 40 grams of sugar and they're like when and I go well you just ate that um Marathon bar you know 19 grams of sugar per serving yeah double it you know you just like totally had a fullblown insulin drop you know and you do have one too you know I've been on this crazy diet now for two months and I I stepped off it the other day I had a cheese burger and a chocolate shake woo it wasn't worth it it wasn't worth it but it was it was worth it was worth something it was worth something while I was eating it it was glorious it was a wonderful cheeseburger with blue cheese and bacon it was very good and the chocolate shake it was pretty goddamn good and the chocolate shake it was a chocolate malt in fact pretty godamn

102:59good but good Lord because I haven't been eating that way the crash after it was over it was devastating like I could barely stay awake an hour later cuz my insulin level just my whole body was just like what did you do after months two months of eating clean you just took a in your mouth and I I recognized that that had probably be been a normal thing for me for most of my life if I had eaten um a cheeseburger and a shake within an hour afterwards I just was crashed I was just done but that's most people the way they eat all the time they just get used to that terrible feeling when I when I give seminars you know a lot of times you have a lunch break and I pay attention to the people when they hit the lunch break I pay attention to like what some people are eating because you can tell a lot by a person by what they're throwing if you've got an option of something good

104:00or something crap there's some people that just like go right for the crap then there's some people that go for the good stuff as soon as like your sessions starts back up and I'm sure you've done this where you give like you know speeches or seminars after meals there's always like four people that are like out mhm and they can't help it right cuz they ate a bunch of garbage and they had this huge insulin dump and you know they've their body's like trying to fight off all that and then they crash and a lot of times I'll like wake people up and I'll say okay I was waiting for that to happen because now is what I want to talk about the importance of nutrition during performance because the reason several people in here can't stay awake right now is because of what they did during their lunch break a lot of a lot of Events sports related events that are like all day events they have

104:59breaks archery always had a break at noon I never wanted to be hungry at the break I tried to continually pick and hydrate throughout the whole event just like I do at home during the day so that I wasn't starving you see competitors that are leading the pack and they run to the freaking concession stand and they want to like pound two or three burgers because they know that they're not going to get to eat till 5:00 and then all of a sudden their scores just start to Peter out and they start making mistakes and then all of a sudden towards the end they come back again and they're saying like yeah I just had that freaking those several ends I just struggled and it's like how do you think yeah well at the time I wasn't like telling all my competitors but I'm like I saw that coming well until you try to live clean until you try to eat clean and you don't eat cheeseburgers shakes

105:53you don't understand how much of an impact it really has CU I think people associate how they feel with just normaly they think that well this is just what happens you know at the end of the day I get tired man I need naps when I started drawing this Primal diet the marxis diet and I started brought my body into a state of ketosis yep was the first time ever that in between meals I didn't have that crash where I didn't feel terrible where like I could go 6 seven hours and not feel bad at all because your body when it hits that state is starting to burn off the fat and so your body has a supply of fat so it just starts converting the fat in your body to energy it's amazing and it's amazing that so few people eat and live like this yeah that was um that was really interesting because the one thing I asked you was I said what's really the difference between that and the Atkins

106:46right more fats right and that was to me it made sense then you know where the Atkins there's a lot more focus on the protein you know I get people that are uneducated on eating clean you know we look at what we you and I just ate for lunch I mean we like knocked back an avocado like nothing some people are afraid of an avocado because they say it's fattening I mean talk about not knowing what's up yeah they don't understand dietary fats and the importance of certain amounts of of healthy fats um of getting the amount of oils and fats that your body needs healthy oils super important and avocado oil and avocados in general one of the most healthy fats you can consume super super good for you you know and getting the right amount of nutrients in your body has just such a massive effect on how the whole goddamn thing works and again I go back to the the mentor thing

107:42and the life coach thing because until you have talked to someone that you trust that's that's done it and is there you know until you know some guy who's a competitive you know Marathon or something like that and he says listen you know if you do this your body will work better you got to trust me you got to trust me and try to clean up your diet and try to you know just if most people just cut out just one thing at a time they would see a big difference I actually have a thing that I call having um I've got a ton of success stories of hunters that were motivated by posts that I made with like food or you know they just see a post that I do and they're like I really I'm just tired of where I'm at as you know Billy Bob the bow hunter or you know I'm tired of where where I'm at in archery I've never I've been in it 10 years and I've never made progress what do I need to do you

108:35know I'll get some photos of them and a lot of times I notice that they're out of shape and I'm like listen if you're shooting on a line and you look down and you can't see your feet because you know a big part of my shot routine is is the first step is really your feet you know your stance I mean like imagine martial arts you're you know you're trying to talk someone about their stance they can't even see their feet well it's like okay well we need to address another problem as well you know you might not want to hear this but we need to address this problem and for me when I started down that path because I had about three years of my life where I you know it's funny how when it comes to like the path of an arrow or the path of Life all it takes is the smallest movement to get you going a certain direction and then all a sudden before you know it you're like so

109:24far off the course and you're like how the hell did I get here yeah and and I had a point in my career where I was that way I was like you know I was like I remember I had to I put on like a pair of 38 underwear and I was like what the hell you know I used to wear like 30 38 pants now I'm in a 38 freaking and then I look at my legs cuz you know and I've got a pretty good story about Big Bird but I always like I got big bird legs you know and I'm thinking that's how round my waist is as long as that freaking leg that's how big around I am so what I started doing was just having and every time I ordered my normal meal at a restaurant if it comes out and there's a burger I took half the bun and I just like and then half the fries I freaking slid them off and I gave them to the lady and said can you take that and I would literally eat half the carbs that was on my plate I just haved

110:20everything as soon as it came out so I was in my normal routine in life if Sharon and I went to Applebees or whatever and I ordered my normal little meal if it was a carb or junk whatever they gave me as a portion I haved it and I mean just that and then getting rid of like soda and all of a sudden it was just like zoom in a matter of months you've just completely like change your directional path and and cut down the amount of calories substantially and once you get to that point You're motivated by what you're seeing and then it's like I want to have that again like normally I'm used to having this I'm going to have that again and you know there's times where I might feel like bread like I told you that for the most part I don't like you know I feel really good when I'm not eating starch or carbs I feel way better that way however certain carbs are I think really

111:19critical for times where you know there's times where I'm needing to right or I'm needing to speak and I kind of just feel fuzzy in the head and for me it sometimes I think it's like your cognitive is like craving some brain food we should try some ketones too I'm going to get you some exogenous ketones for I've been digging trying your your dietary routine it's it's good exogenous ketones have a big effect on mental function it's very very healthy for you too it's all it's not not junk not stimulants you know just just healthy foods you know one of the things one of the way that I got to know Cameron Haynes is um because uh in being on a few hunts and going into the mountains and experiencing what it's like just a hike at high altitude just really underestimated the amount of stress that it takes on your body uh how how difficult it is to do and so then I

112:11started researching Fitness and uh Fitness and hunting like I'm like there's got to be someone out there that's like really into it and then I found cam who's just a fit in his nut does ultramarathons and all that Jazz and that's how Cam and I became friends is by looking at his his sort of style of getting ready for the mountains like pretty much all of what he does whether it's weight training whether it's just running running mountains it's preparing him to be a better Hunter oh yeah and I don't think many people that view hunting consider that they think of hunting as being a fat guy who's drinking beer waiting for a deer to pass by so he could shoot it in the dick you know I mean that's that's what that's that's how a lot of people look at hunting they look at as a bunch of cruel or that dentist guy who goes over to Africa and shoots a lion and it up that's how a lot of

112:59people look at hunting and that's it's it's one of the reasons why hunting has a bad rap especially in terms of its benefit in as uh a tool for conservation oh yeah people say well it's that's that's the only reason why people call it a a conservation tool because it gives them an excuse to kill animals most of the money most of the money to preserve wetland to preserve wildlife habitat most of that money is a direct result of hunting most absolutely totally that's a fact it's an undeniable fact so all these people out there that are calling themselves conservationists that never donate and then they'll say something mean and rude about hunting and even eat a cheeseburger after they say it like there's a lot of crazy intellectual dishonesty out there when it comes to this subject and and also in terms of what we should or shouldn't do in terms of being the stewards of the

113:51earth like we were talking about like wild pigs if you don't think that we should do something to control the population of wild pigs it's cuz you've never been around wild pigs yep they have two three lits a year they'll have three or four babies every lit litter and they keep going and you got more than that how many do they get what is like pigs I'm guessing seven to 10 in a litter yeah and how many litters a year at least two right they can do two yeah I think it's uh what is it every 3 months they can Chuck them out well they can Chuck one out in 6 months after being born which is insane oh yeah yeah it's they're I mean it's it's amazing how one or two pigs turns into an absolute problem really fast and even even at your house you know people there's people that give me slack if I you know I posted that video of that coyote I shot and then you know about

114:42the wolf thing but people have a problem with that and it's like dude we were in your yard and your wife comes out and there's like two Co two coyotes in the yard like scoping out your chicken house and then when she took the kids to school she ends up telling us yeah there's a coyote running down the road with a freaking rooster hanging out of its mouth yeah they're common I mean they're like you have to you have to control some of that and I know you have to control Predator populations because nothing else does and white tals I'm telling you um Frank Zayn he was a three-time Mr Olympia Frank used to do he still does he still does but Frank and Arnold used to do archery as kind of an RNR are you know from their bodybuilding that was kind of their their Zen their stress relief was shooting and um when I went to the Arnold and competed uh Frank and and Frank and

115:35Arnold ended up coming in to have like a an old comp like a competition like from the old days so they came into the Hall to like each of them shoot well what Arnold didn't know was Frank was so competitive that Frank actually talked to the coordinator of the event and he called her and said who are there any really good archers coming that can coach so she asked around and ended up connecting Frank to me so when Frank and I talked I was like a big fan of him because I was a fitness guy for my stress relief and he wanted coaching because he goes when Arnold and I shoot together I don't want him to think that I've practiced but I want to freaking beat him so I actually like worked with him a little bit and he did end up you know he ended up shooting and then Frank and I became friends and he's you know he's an animal ER he's from um he's down from San Franc South of San Francisco I

116:37think and he never really talked negative about me when he knew that I was a hunter and stuff but I could tell it wasn't necessarily something that he favored he eats meat well absolutely but he he wasn't against it he wasn't like dead set against it I think he just wasn't interested in it right so I pick him up at the airport and we're driving back and he said so do you like hunt deer all the time and I said yeah I hunt him all the time and he's like he's like well how kind of how did you you how do you feel about it and I said you have to do it and he's just like really and he never said anything negative but I remember we were three miles from my house and a freaking deer comes across the road and we're like in my little Hyundai Accent and I freaking smoke this thing and he's like he's just like holy like he's like you know he's never seen like a freaking animal smash the

117:33car and I'm and he's just like that was a freaking deer we just hit a deer and I said yeah dude imagine if 850,000 people in the state of Wisconsin weren't out hunting a year 850,000 is that how many hunt yeah between bow h gun Hunters you can look it up I was in Wisconsin for opening season uh not last year but the year before last and The Morning Light is like a war just started it's crazy you hear it was like remember when we used to watch like shock and awe like when the shock and awe happened that's what it sounds like well we talked about Michigan on the podcast before that in last year or every year 50,000 car accidents involving deer a year just in Michigan alone and so people that think well there's no other way to take care of that this is what people have to understand unless you want to bring in wolves and guess what you don't want to bring in wolves you

118:28don't want wolves in your neighborhood me you don't want to look that in the face yeah well you did you know I've talked that story is crazy I I was telling a friend of mine about it the uh the story of you you were in Alberta and you shot an elk and these wolves circled the elk how how many wolves were there well at first there was just the one the one came in and you know the one came in on us and I and and that's one I do want to say off the beginning one thing that I always do as a hunter is I always buy a predator tag if it's available if I know that I can get a that I can buy a tag for coyotes or Wolves I always have one in my pocket because you do see you know they're out there and they're out there way more now and this and this is an exact reason why you gotta do it because literally we had an elk down and next thing you know we're out there kind of you know getting

119:25it ready to like you know to cut it up and stuff and get it out of there and all of a sudden this big wolf comes through you know comes in and I had spotted it and we weren't really being noisy so I ended up shooting that wolf and it kind of went off and you know with a bow there's no noise so what we didn't realize was there was a pack there and that that was actually it was an alpha female is because of the size of it I mean you saw the size of it it's as big as me and it actually went off and then we kind of thought well that was freaking freaky well then about 20 minutes later all of a sudden we see another one and we see another one and we're kind of like holy crap so we start moving into this draw and one of them was like making like a noise almost like it was injured or something you was like whimpering so we're like what is a deal so we we were on High Ground with the

120:22elk and then we started moving down into this Ravine cuz we saw the the Wolves down in there and next thing you know we get down in there and I start looking around and there's like hair on the trees there's like I mean it looked like that movie Into The Gray the gray the gray that that's exactly what it looked like the Liam movie there was like freaking hairy turds everywhere it was just there was like beds there was hair rubbed on the trees and I start looking around there's like holes dug in and I'm like I literally look at my two buddies that were there with me and I said we're right in the freaking Den like you know and I think we had that elk was not too far you know our elk wasn't too far from so when you shot an elk that they probably thought of as theirs oh they definitely thought of it was theirs yeah they they definitely thought that was

121:13theirs so then once we're down there all a sudden we hear this howl we're like down there we hear this howl and it was def defitely an alpha because an Alphas the howl it literally turns your blood instantly cold if you're right in on a true wolf how it's I mean it's like so freaking low and deep and it's just like chills your blood well you realize it's not a game well yeah then I realize I'm like we're in the freaking den and you know I'm kind of looking down I'm like okay well I shot an elk then I shot that I've got two arrows left so and you know both my guy kind of had you know once we said oh there's wolves they like grabbed a gun we kind of went down in there to see what was up well now this happens the next thing after that Alpha sounded off it was like and I mean 12 I think it was 12 sounded off all the way around us we're in a we're we're literally down anyone

122:14who's been in Alberta you know that the Farmland is level and then it falls into the river system so we're literally they have The High Ground there's a dozen wolves and we're in the middle and we're like what the crap so I just I'm like get your back to a tree so we kind of all spin around and we're sitting there and next thing you know here comes two dogs on a fullblown I'm talking like fullblown like this like fre coming and I mean it turned into chaos there was like bullets flying I mean there's freaking arrows skipping off junk and we ended up shooting both of those w wolves dead and there's a few gun fires going off well I'm down to like one Arrow left and I told the guy I said how many bullets you got and he goes well I didn't you know I just grabbed the gun two couple bullets like I didn't know you're this was all going down so we're kind of like we need to

123:11get out of here so we started backing up and next thing you know they the alpha sounded off again and they all reported this time there's only two or two like less so next thing I know I'm like kind of we're trying to back out so you say wait a minute hold on a second you say they reported there so there's they know that two are dead so all of them are howling I'm certain that the first howl was the alpha male pretty much saying in is everyone in position because then they're all like yes yes all the way around then all a sudden the two come all Breaks Loose then we're like the alpha sounds again but he's in a different location he was actually to my left like right here and really close and I mean it's thick in there you've been there you know how thick it gets so then they sound awful now this time there's two less so I'm kind of looking because I know

124:15this wolf that sounded was and I know it's the alpha so I like grab my bow and I start kind of creeping over over there and as soon as I get to where I can see he's like freaking standing right there and how far away 30 yards which a wolf can cover Jamie pull up that picture from um Joe's Instagram like it was about a week ago you found those pictures of those Wolves yeah I forget who the photographer was but he's got some amazing photographs of wolves or yeah it was it was like not the most recent one on that was on that dead moose but it was like that was from National Geographic that was actually a bison that was from yesterday that's right yesterday or the day before look at that okay that right there that is exactly the face that I saw and the but he was head on he wasn't broadside but that face where he was literally looking at me like that and I mean you're in a

125:13fight ORF flight like I'm in totally in a figh or flight I had one Arrow left on my string I freaking grabbed my bow I literally I like I I just I kind of looked at him I knew at that moment it was like he was coming yeah that's it's like freaking Deja Vu that's V the Twitter the um Instagram page Jamie go back up a little bit is cjmor photography and if you go to that guy's Instagram page he's got amazing photographs just and he's out there with them there was another one that I had and this just right before that Jamie the before that wolf picture there was another wolf picture that one look at that one man he's got snow all over his face and his teeth are bared that's a cool yeah that's a cool picture like to me that's pretty cool wolves are amazing they're amazing and the one thing people underestimate about hunters is our respect for Animals I love them why did

126:07you kill it I freaking I totally respect him I love him but I can tell you that other picture right there when you have that looking at you in the face I mean I knew it was like freaking do or die and I I literally looked at that thing and I set out loud I said I'm going to shoot you in the effing face because I like how you don't swear yeah sorry it's cute and my boy might listen and I remember I drew back I like I literally Drew back and I anchored and I came into my Peep and as soon which means for people don't know there's like a little circle that you look at through the string where lining up with the sight so I was literally lining up the shot lining up the shot and as soon as I kind of brought my shot down to where that wolf was there was nothing there he bolted no I think he just like yeah like ninja well he if they're that wise and that big and that old they've got to know

127:05what a hunter is they they had to have known that you killed the elk and they had to have known that you killed those other two wolves that chased you that went after you guys and tried to get the elk I think he came in to to think okay we've you called a fight we responded now he's like sizing up okay I've lost here's what I've lost I want to know what I'm going against he kind of came in and he freaking looked at us all and then that was it good thing they can't count if they knew he only had two arrows left two arrows and two bullets like how many bullets that guy pick up he only picked up three it was bone chilling and I mean I have you and I both have friends that you you Grizzlies cats I mean cats are notorious for stalking Hunters too because I mean they are the ultimate Hunter um but Grizzlies and wolves I mean they're you have to be on guard that you know there's places

128:07now where you know Grizzlies are strongly becoming such a a problem when it comes to you know they have to be controlled they're just starting to get to be too many for especially for the food source yeah well there's people that worry about them being wiped out and I I read this article about it recently and it was just so filled with misunderstanding or misinformation we were talking about wiping out Grizzlies that if they did open up back to Grizzlies Grizzlies back to hunting again they would be wiped out people don't understand how it works there's allotment a certain amount of tags that get distributed because Wildlife biologists deem that there's too many of them and that it's problematic for all the other animals that live in the area you have to understand like when they try when they put tag limits on white tailed deer or they put tag limits on

128:55wolves they do it because they've deemed that there's an issue and there's obviously people want to hunt deer but there's also an issue like we were talking about the state of Pennsylvania there's some areas I don't know if it's still the case but there were some areas in Pennsylvania where they brought in Hunters year round No Tag limits they were like just please come on down and shoot and it was on uh Michael wadell uh his show oh yeah T-Bone was there they shot like three or four deer in a day and it was in the middle of summer they just went down there and shot deer because there just so many of them and they were shooting him in like a residential area they were in a tree stand in like this dude's yard and it's overrun with deers I think I I met a guy that was literally begging me to come he said there's a deer season in the residential areas I think in New

129:45Jersey mhm and he said there's like so many deer in people's backyards and the timber is so he just said it's like there's just so many that they're issuing a lot of urban tags and they hunting tags yeah and they have to and they have did you see the bears fighting in Far walkway New Jersey did you see that video uhuh you want to see it yeah bring up that that video two no Bonafide 7 foot 400 plus pound Bears going to war in a residential Community knocking over mailboxes and garbage cans rolling out into the street Street fur flying biting each other look at the size of these but are they they're cute did anyone try to pet them or anything yeah they should have just made friends but look at these guys going at it these are big Bears two big boes the size of these guys and so what kind of move is that what was what was that a judo throw it was shitty

130:42Jiu-Jitsu that's like a look at him he's reaching for a back leg dude it's like M trying to an he's trying to ankle pick do you see it like for a back leg well this goes on for a long time too and the guy who's filming it is filming it from his car I guess he's got his hand out the window so they go crashing through the bushes they go tumbling outto the street they take out some mailboxes I mean there's the mailbox get these these are big man they're big ass Bears they are those are really big and they they keep going back see this one guy wants the garbage and that's what it is so funny if a lady just like came out to go shopping well that easily could happen that's how people die oh yeah this is lady got killed in Florida last year by one of these yeah they're they're serious they mean I mean bear bears what a lot of people don't realize too I every year I go up you

131:35know you always catch you catch slack for being a bear hunter but I go up to British Columbia every year and bear hunt and during and it's all spot and stock there it's all fair Chase um but during the course of a six day hunt I remember one year I saw 82 Bears on a six day hunt that's insane I mean some of the Bears you might see twice but there was so many bears and it's like you know what you have to manage that it's healthy for them too otherwise this happens I mean you want to watch this in your yard is it well this is what could happen and what's interesting is Jamie and I we were laughing because we found this poster this billboard that said they're all Cecil and it's a a bear and a lion hugging each other and it said stop the New Jersey bear hunt like there are people out there that are emotionally wreck they are they are children they're they're an emotional

132:36wreck they're a child who doesn't understand that nature is a a ruthless vicious beautiful Majestic thing and Wildlife biologists are the ones who know the best you you you these crazy emo people that get so wrapped up in this idea that these things are these animals are like people they have this picture of this bear and this lion hugging each other and the bear has tears and the lion has tears look at this they're hugging each other it says they are ban the bear hunt they are all Cecil save New Jersey bears.com you guys are out of your mind wow these if Bears didn't exist they didn't exist and they were in a movie they would be a monster it' be some Beast living in the woods that eats eats baby deer right out of the the vagina of the the deer when they they pull them out they literally catch a deer that's giving birth to a fawn and they pull them out

133:32of each other they eat Cubs on a regular basis there's so much cannibalism in the bear Community not Community really it could be I don't think it is well they equal rights tell me that story that you were telling me yesterday about the grizzly bear that got into the the shed or got into the uh cabin oh yeah yeah yeah just just the sheer power I actually have a my my like Wilderness father his name's Bert he's up up there where I hunt in BC he has stories of the Wilderness he'd be the ultimate character for you to have on he's like a real life Grizzly Adams he's got stories but there was a bear that kept destroying the camps in the cabins they ended up they ended up like just kind of calling the the bear Big Earl or something and they would come to the camps he would come in and they would have like a huge big door you know and they would nail in you know 9 10inch

134:30spikes through the door frame in three spots down the sides and then through the top they nail you know nail 10-in spikes pound them through the logs of a log home to hold the door frame in well they came to camp and they figured well this is going to keep him out cuz he was blowing through all the windows every year he'd blow through the window windows so they boarded the windows up and they had this door so evidently he got mad they could see where he was really mad about how they boarded the door the windows up so he literally grabbed the door and the whole door and well the whole frame with the door was like freaking laying off to the side of the cabin with 10in spikes bent on 90° angles and there was one claw there he had evidently reached in with two Claws and freaking hooked the backs side of that door frame and ripped a freaking door out of a log home and pulled one of

135:29his own claws out and pulled his claw out that's how they knew they got the bear cuz they ended up getting a permit to get the bear and he had nine claws wow so he freaking threw that to the side went in the cabin he licked the freaking oven clean but he could still smell that there's like grease somewhere inside there that he like wanted to get to so the whole freaking the whole stove was smashed about this high off the ground so a couple inches off a couple inches off the ground he literally just got on it and squished that freaking a full-blown stove just like we would a popc can under our foot to like squirt some extra grease out the side of that big Oreo cookie that he thought it was oh my God and licked it clean well it gets better so there was curtains over the sink in the cabin and the curtains were all gone and and um the other thing too I think

136:32there was like there was two big five gallon things of like cooking oil that were in the camp so Bert told me that there was like one claw Mark in the cooking oil and then the freaking things like a Capri Sun he had freaking popped a hole in these five gallon things of cooking oil and freaking squirted them dry like a like an old Capri Sun threw those to the side well the curtains were gone too because Bert thinks because of cooking like the grease and crap that got on the curtains he like freaking they were gone he ate them yeah well at the time they didn't know they just you know his wife Mary Jane was like you know where what happened to the curtains he's like I have no idea but he had lived in there so I mean he had like piled the couch up and I mean he like lived in that cabin bear the bear did a full-blown 10 foot freaking Grizzly Mountain Grizzly so then they went down

137:30to the next Camp which was 20 miles away and I didn't tell you this part so they get in there and it's just an absolute freaking wreck it looks like a lifesize mouse home just crap everywhere so Mary Jean's like got a snow shovel and she's like scooping all this freaking off the ground and there was all these like material dingleberries in and she's like what are those dingleberry things and Berke goes that's all the balls off the curtains from Grizz Camp the freaking bear had like ate the curtains in the other Camp once he destroyed it he kept walking down the road 20 miles to the next freaking cabin destroyed that one and freaking 20 miles yeah oh yeah so he was the he was the king of the mountain yeah they have a huge range but yeah he like you know freaking slung dingleberry juice and 10 gallons of freaking oil all across the next Camp just to prove a point imagine what kind

138:32of diarrhea a bear gets after 10 gallons of oil you just drink oil and eat curtains it's probably about the same kind I get after like six chicken McNuggets It's hard out there for a bear a hard world it is it's just a crazy animal it's it's such a majestic I mean it's we're Super Lucky they're alive we're super lucky that they're around and that's the difference between I think um people who are like really hardcore animal rights activists and people who are Wildlife biologists and conservationists like both agree that bears are amazing and that's where I think that these people are they have a misconception they think that Hunters want to kill animals and they're they're vicious and they're mean and cruel and they have little dicks and uh some of them do I'm sure sure some mine's small yeah good for you good for you admitting that well like I said was it small but

139:26you're a giant guy you're like six5 it could be that could be it maybe it's just small compared to everything else I hope so I hope so too for you I I mean first part you got to admit your problem if you're going to move on right it's how you get better at archery it's how you get better at dealing with your dick but this but both but my point was that like both love bears oh yeah they just they just don't want them to be a problem so when you're looking at what this bear did to that cabin you can say well the cabin's in his neighborhood nothing's his neighborhood how about that I just said it that it's all if people live out there and the bear comes in their house it's not that the bear came into his own house it's a person's house and if you don't think that way then you're you're a problem you're a problem the Bears are Bears all right and if you don't

140:17differentiate the difference between uh the the value of a person and controlling populations of bear well you're a ridiculous person you you you're not looking at this thing correctly no one saying the bear should be wiped out but when you talk about an animal that can flatten a stove flatten a stove and pull a door out of the frame with 9 foot long spikes surrounding I mean 9 in 9 in 9 foot how crazy kind of nail kind of nails nails as big as the bear 9 in Long spikes you're talking about insane animal that if you don't control their populations they're going to decimate everything they're going to they're going to the only thing that's saving them is them them eating Cubs that's the only thing that controls the population of them if they're not if they're no hun yeah the only thing controlling the population is the food chain and you know I told you this the

141:08other day I I feel like as a hunter I I love what I've got to witness as a hunter because I feel like I've spent I've spent way more time enjoying the creations of the wild because I've been out there really out there yeah I mean like how how else would you have gotten a chance to see wolves in that environment that you saw them I mean that's oh yeah a confrontational environment with Wolves I mean yeah I wouldn't prefer to be in the middle of a freaking wolf attack to see him but you see things like I told you the time where like you know where the time were a freaking Bull Moose like probably about the size of you know the one that you've got over there you know literally watch this freaking Grizzly square off to this bull moose and hit it the grizzly literally just hit the freaking top back part of a full-blown Mose and just broke it and it's like dinner time snapped its back yeah

142:06snapped it I mean just the sheer power yeah saw where was this up in BC wow I mean you you look at that how far away was it from you it was a ways off I mean it was like a binocular watch but still there's things like that there's things like you know you talked about how um the rivets up in Alberta you know where they have the Bear Camp you you know you saw like a boar maybe they were telling you the story no I saw a boar in a a South fighting okay going at it yeah well I've seen and I I told you this and I actually I shot the boar but I spotted a big bear in a field and I was hunting and it was spot and stock and as I'm starting to stock all of a sudden a s comes out and it starts freaking like posturing to the to the mail and then all heck broke loose just like that that's what it was like and I mean I'm within a 100 yards of it I mean it's ferociously loud and then after

143:09they like break up the boar goes running to this huge you've seen the timber up there Timber's gigantic like a couple stories high he freaking jumps on this tree and starts going and I mean and I'm talking like full speed full speed be I mean it's like Inc it's an incredible Chase and fight he freaking hits his tree and he's freaking going up it like bark is just ripping out and the the black female is going right behind him and at the time I still didn't realize what's up until I till he gets almost to the top and I see two colored Cubs up there and he's fre I mean like branches are coming off like nothing is stopping this dude he's freaking going and right before he gets to the Cubs the freaking female launches and grabs the ham Hawk and just lets go of the tree and just freaking lets brings the both of them down and lets the weight freaking bring them down and just you hear you know I

144:11mean it like boom and then all heck Breaks Loose they go up into the Timber and it's just like you know a crazy fight yeah were in a similar situation where there was a a mother with her Cubs and then the the boar came in looking to kill and eat the Cubs yep oh yeah yeah and we talked about there's argument to why I haven't seen the evidence on you know you feel like it's just was Rella said that there's recent evidence that shows that these bears are looking to eat these things like almost immediately when they come out of hybernation because of ease of diet yeah cuz they're just food I I personally think cuz they always tend to be more aggressive on the Cubs from what I've experienced the the further into may you get right the closer you get to rut the more likely you know I kind of think those bores might have bred one or two SS they're horny I mean so horny and then they

145:10they're wanting another one and they know that's the only thing that's going to trigger to for them to come back in but I you know after that fight broke up and the S you know she ended up standing guard she kind of called her Cubs down and they hauled well that big boar ended up coming out and he was you know it was like a s foot chocolate and that's the one I got you know so you know some people might be like oh he was trying to kill the babies and then you know next thing you know I got it so I kind of feel like I did I was you save babies you're conservationist I was definitely a conservationist in that that people also don't realize that you eat bears too people have been eating Bears forever and they taste good y you know they think that you only eat deer and elk and everything else is trophy hunting you know yeah it's it's amazing to me the the just the beauties that

146:07I've seen I've been I've been I love sitting in a white tail stand and I spend a lot of time in a white tail stand just sitting quiet and you know for me it's it's like meditation because it is so quiet at times there's like sometimes I've heard like birds and noises where I'm like I've literally never ever heard like what is that like I've never heard that and I one of the coolest things that I've experienced is I've been in the timber during the fall where there's just colors like like a painting just colors you know you know how it is in the Midwest and there's days when like the first fall snap really happens when I believe trees just decide to let go did have you ever watched any of the Harry Potter movies you ever see that that tree that just like freaking cleans itself off and then all a sudden you like just decides well I've been in the timber where it was like the trees were

147:10almost communicating and everyone just said let go and literally the like someone just moved a fresh canvas just all the colors of fall just let go and you literally watch the whole color of fall go to the ground and it's bare who can say they've seen that pretty rare it is amazing to see these cycles of nature to see them in person and I think that's one of the things that a lot of people are missing by living in cities there's a lot of really cool that you could see out in the woods there's so much so much of it is just like inherently fast or like it appeals to us in some sort of a primal way do you remember that squirrel I sent you the other day yeah I mean squir the hwk got yeah that was crazy I mean I was out for a little walk and I came across a really nice buck an awesome Buck literally dead and eaten by coyotes and it was a deer that I know was you know

148:15I'd seen earlier in the season it was perfectly healthy and next thing I know a month later here it is like dead a just a decayed carcass eaten what do you think happened you think the coyotes captured it or you think he got tired from the rut it's hard to say I think you know I think with any type of animal especially when the males have such a limited time to breed they really exert themselves I mean it's like it's like looking I've seen bucks that literally look like like that you that fighter that fought Kimbo or whatever you know I mean 5000 yeah literally seen them I've seen them walking and they're like a a freaking fully skinned zombie just because they've just been running they came too much yeah Yep they're done you've looked like that a few times I heard you get you get you get tired man yeah and I think when they get that run down it's no different than me when I'm

149:14traveling a lot especially when I'm skipping time zones and I really have a hard time getting into a sleep pattern and a recovery pattern you just get sick you get the flu you know you get the flu you get some freaking stupid little bug that's on an airplane from some guy like three seats over that's coughing you know I think you just wear your immune system down and You're vulnerable and then W you know winter comes in and it's it's a freaking you know it's tough on some they don't eat for days sometimes oh yeah days I remember get after it I saw a buck one time he was just just I mean I'd see him like as far as I could see with the binoculars over here and then i' you know 30 minutes later I'd see him as far as I could see with binoculars like go through this creek bottom and this creek bottom and I was actually sitting on this like pond dam and about 11: in the morning here he

150:07comes he's just like freaking he's just walking with this zombie walk like he's trying to find a scent trail of a dough that's in estris and he's just been breeding for weeks and I remember he's just freaking coming in and he literally just comes running and he hits the pond and he's sitting in the pond like with just his head sitting out and he's like and then he comes up out and he's just like he goes like shakes and he's gone again it's just like holy crap this poor dude is just like running this like marathon of the rut and well there's so much competition too in a place like Iowa that's part of what ramps them all up there's so many other deer there yeah yeah I mean and it's you know cool to watch so many die that way well I found that but that buck that day and then two minutes later I'm walking through the forest like oh here's a cute little squirrel you know I see the squirrel

151:15like and he like kind of like he's like looking at me on the side of this tree like like is this person going to hurt me and all of a sudden like freaking boom this like red tail hawk just freaking pounds this thing and I'm like looking around like what the heck and then the Hawk looks at me and starts to fly and then drops a squirrel and I and that's the I went over and here's this girl with like two Talon marks one through its eye one through its mouth and one like up did you put that online did you put that picture on no I can I can send it to Jamie though if you you should put it on your Instagram page cuz it's a crazy picture yeah it's a weird thing to see yeah it's you know Nature's nature is interesting but it's you know I'm a conservationist I'm a I'm a huge supporter to the Boon and Crockett Club I've you know I'm I've uh you know really tried to become you know

152:09I've I've done what it takes to to become a professional member now of the Boon and Crocket club and you know I'm really focused on trying to give more back um on the conservation side because there's so many important things that these organizations do for wildlife as much as people want to say they you know the the I've I've I've just never seen an an anti-hunting Community come anywhere where I'm at and put in time establishing habitat and actually doing things that grow the population and and you know I plant food and I probably leave 5,000 bucks a year worth of food in my dirt to like help grow deer and like help my deer population don't don't you think though that there's a lot of people that have opinions about uh about animals and about Wildlife that really spend very little time with animals and in Wildlife they have this very convenient idea like

153:16like when I I told a friend of mine the number that we discussed in the podcast earlier about uh Michigan having 50,000 car accidents a year and he was like you're lying and I'm like dude Google it and he looked at it and he just sat he like literally looked at his phone and sat like plopped down holy I go you're not there if you're there you would know like it's O it's over it's overwhelming his opinion or his point of view was that these Hunters are just these people that are just that like to shoot animals like they do need to do this like they need to do this and you might not think it but you you there's no way you have a survey of the whole world or the whole country you just don't and if you did I bet you'd have a different opinion have you seen some of the numbers like what All State Insurance posts about how many vehicle um deaths and like dollars and vehicle

154:09collisions there are just with white tailed deer with one insurance company let's find out I have it on my laptop if you want me to grab it well Jamie can pull it up I'm sure it's on Google it is just Google how many car accidents involve deer Nationwide yep I bet it's if if Michigan has 50,000 a year mindblowing the even the number of deaths would is well in cam haynes's Hometown some guy just died some guy hit a deer and then the guy in front of them died or the guy behind him the guy hit a deer went flying through the air 175 to 200 fatalities every year and 10,000 injuries there's approximately 1 .5 million deer related car accidents annually I'm going to say that again there are 1.5 million deer related car accidents annually you didn't know that did you nope over1 billion in vehicle damage and 175 to 200 fatalities as well as 10,000 injuries oh my God and 200 deaths it's a in

155:182012 it 200 deaths $4 billion a year yep Christ exactly a lot of people a lot of people don't know that the continent is large and you know big what let me ask you this it's funny people people whine and cry about how much insurance goes up how much do you think it would go up if we didn't help that yeah well also not that's that how about health insurance because it ticks and lime lme disease oh yeah and just your injuries more people going in for hitting one yeah absolutely my dad my dad actually he he always wanted to have his teeth perfect and I remember he wore braces for a long time to get his his teeth fixed and like no sooner that he had them done and was wearing a retainer and my dad's like he's got a truck at home like a big truck but he never drives it cuz he always he like drove a little bitty High and he freaking hit a deer he hit a buck like a month after getting his like

156:26finally the dentist saying you don't have to wear your retainer he hit a buck the horns stuck through his windshield and the horns stopped on his steering wheel and the body came in and hit him in the face oh my God and he had to like get he literally has fake teeth in the front wow yeah so Jesus Christ yeah I I had no idea 1.5 million I told you yeah that's crazy crazy and what that's a way better statistic than the 50,000 in Michigan yeah that's nothing I mean I mean well a lot a lot it's a lot but in the in the whole scheme of things you know my wife my wife's from England um and she had never hunted her family never hunt I mean they're just they have no idea about that stuff it's you know they they have no relation to hunting right so when she came over she was you know she knew I hunted and she was open-minded to it because I I showed her numbers like

157:33this I said okay I understand you don't understand it so let's talk about some of this stuff do you realize this do you know that at our house if you drive around you're going to see a deer from your car like almost anytime you're driving around our area after dark or wait until you see how many dead deer on the side of the road during the first three weeks of November driving down the highway in Iowa you know what I mean so she kept an open mind and she realized really quick we couldn't grow a garden you know in Wisconsin they were like eating us all the time I mean they were everywhere and she's just like you know what I get it I never saw this many I didn't see this much stuff in in England we didn't have it that's why we weren't hunting there it's not because people aren't necessarily Hunters it wasn't in some areas it isn't a needed conservation it is here that's the

158:33reality it is well imagine if you could see all 1.5 million car accidents in know in like a scene like one after the other bang bang bang bang because you got to think there's 365 days a year there's 24 days in a 24 hours in a day so if you could look at all the footage that's accumulated every year in one giant Loop one highlight reel of car accidents watch you couldn't watch it in a year Well you you couldn't well you would watch two people die or 200 people die too but just the sheer volume would kind of wake people up if you could watch the sheer volume if they put together a movie that was 3 hours long that was just all the car accidents in the last six months with deer people would go oh my God we're at War we're at War and they're attacking cars they're literally suicide bombing cars they're jumping out in the street and taking out drivers well for over three hours you

159:31would see someone die every minute yeah in that compilation yeah you just see boom boom boom boom smash hoof to the face antlers to the neck it's over and over and over again you'd have a lot more candidates for that LSD uh trial for I mean there'd be some serious tra I the MDMA yeah the MDMA trial that yeah that would flip people over the end listen we got to get the out of here it's 4:00 oh yeah you shoo we just we just bang through three hours how about that buddy thank you man J thanks for coming down here and thank you very much for all the coaching man it's been amazing I've learned so much from you and anybody that's into archery I encourage you go to uh knock on archery on YouTube and um knv knock on TV and um knock on TV on TW Twitter I put that already up on my Twitter page and there's the television show that is on the Sportsman's Channel John Dudley

160:25ladies and gentlemen thanks everybody try archery you'll like it all right we'll be back tomorrow with the great D iera see you