JRE MMA Show #14 with Matt Brown

00:01four three two one boom and we're live what's up brother how are you very very good thanks for doing this man I'm very excited to have you here I'm honored to be here man I was just saying about I said actually outside the people that have been on the show yeah I think about it sometimes too freaks me out Sam Harris James Hetfield man oh yeah I was thing about all the people man was like how do I compete with these guys just be Matt Brown I'm talking about man I mean I could beat all their asses in certain situations that's all that counts the situations that I thrive in exactly so uh you were retired and now you're not now you're just signed to fight Carlos Condit you got it damn that's a good fight I like that yeah I think Carlos needed to fight back to that fight with Neil Magny he looked like he was suffering through some ring rust yeah I've talked to a lot of people about

01:00that cuz that's the first thing that always comes up right is how he came back and looked in that fight and I've trained with me a lot man I'll tell you Neil can shut a game down right away yeah you know yeah we can't take away from him Carlos didn't seem to show any sense of urgency either though so you know I think it's both sides but I think he's also gonna be looking for redemption with me yeah thank you so - yeah he wanted to come back right away actually they actually asked me to fight his boy been like six weeks notice what's the longest you've ever taken off after I fought cowboy got knocked the out and took a year off and fly Diego so what is it like coming back after a year it felt natural to me personally to you yeah people right yeah someone was talking to me about this aired a ring rust and I was like you know everybody's different man every

01:57single person is going to react a little differently and I think also when you have someone you know John Danaher was talking about the different types of fighters right that I think he just group three different types of fighters like a violence guy a tactical guy and something else well I think it's gonna I think there's more types of fighters than what he went through but there's not think it's gonna affect every single type of person differently you know and I felt like I thought for instance like I fought him much more tactical fight against llego it wasn't I mean you could you could easily go in with Diego and just go to war with him right and he'll Melendez style exactly he's totally down for that that's what Diego is you know he will wake right up and go for that right yeah I was like man I'm better than him let's just be tactical and I think that was part of why it

02:42helped now that now I think someone that goes in with a more violent style which I've done many times in my life I think that's a bit more complicated because there's a lot more timing in reaction in that whereas the strategy you have a very clear path to victory you know exactly what you got to do is just you're just going in there and just you know connecting the dots when you get in there and staying on the plan exactly yeah yeah now when you get a guy like Diego though that temptation has got to be always there right because he's so willing well if if it's necessary as you love that kind of fighting yes one of the reasons why you're so loved mmm like there's never been a matte brown fight ever that's boring there's a lot of guys that have because of styles because of whatever they've had fights that weren't very crowd-pleasing mmm-hmm but your style has always been

03:36do or die seek and destroy that's one of the reasons why people love you yeah well I mean that's just goes back to my mentality of why I'm fighting to start with right it's not really about just winning I think that's sort of a Western culture thing sort of an American thing like I kind of go back to the original pride and it's like look just fight man you know this is a fun thing this is a badass thing we're doing this is an amazing thing go in there and fight test yourself the Bushido spirit things like that and not it doesn't have to be just win at all costs you know this is you know to me it waters down the sport I mean that's not what combat is about some is it you know it's not me well I mean that's what makes it interesting is that there are different styles there's people that have safety-first styles or they just fighting to win and then there's other people like yourself

04:31that just whatever's inside you that comes out you know I we said it's like there's certain dudes like because of your history because of I mean you had an overdose where you literally died and there's the same with court Magee he had the same situation abdomen I always said talk to him about it dudes that have gone to the other side are terrifying inside the cage there's like this there's a certain thing I don't know if it's just coincidentally that bolt do you guys have that mindset or let's forget about even core but you have this mindset and I've always said I wonder if there's a correlation between such extreme lows in your life where you bottomed down so hard literally your body it shut down and you were ready to you ready to pass on the doctor saved you and you've got a mindset going into that cage that's just it's just another notch more intense than most people

05:29certainly and that that's a you know to be honest that something I've sort struggled with a lot too because it wasn't actually that specific moment the overdose that kind of affected me the way did it was more a long-term life of well I would say I've just been an angry person honestly like just since I grew up so it was all about channeling that anger a lot of fighters like that right I think so I think it's one of the beauties of martial arts that helps you channel that yeah I mean we all have to find an outlet I I didn't discover martial arts until what twenty to twenty three to twenty one twenty two something like that and you know said before my outlet was drugs and alcohol you know that was my way to say everybody right and you know just went too far but like I said you know winner is expressed in the cage that's more of a long-term thing growing up an angry person and

06:36then you know I always give a lot of credit to Jamey Jasta Hatebreed you know that's what I'll walk out through nowadays it's a dream come true to have a walk out song by them and that was like the first time that I was able to find a positive outlet for that energy you know I didn't know what what heavy metal was and growing up you know I mean I grew up in a small farm town and I didn't know what that was but the heavy metal gave me an outlet and Hatebreed was the first one that gave me a positive outlet before it was negative Pantera Slayer like stuff like this it's all negativity you know so this rage is is coming out in a negative sense and gets expressed through drugs alcohol hanging with the wrong people things like that and then there's a turning point where I'm like men this can be a positive thing and I can use this energy directed towards something positive what

07:35were you angry about growing up ah good question man that goes deep man because you know I grew up in a very very very small town 200 people population I didn't see a skyscraper until I was I mean like up in person like would drove by it in Dayton Ohio which is in a big town in itself until I was like over 18 years old you know so I was I always felt like there was so much more out there for me and I was kind of expecting up in a machine shop my dad was a machinist so I was doing that from like five years old I was sweeping the floor and I was like I was like man this is not what I'm meant to be like I'm supposed to be something great but uh but everybody around me is I know this is what you do you live in this little town and you do you follow the rules you're gonna be a machinist or a farmer or you know whatever and you know that pissed me off you know and I

08:36never really found my niche and so I was home-schooled actually for I think two years in junior high so I think that was sort of actually this start because I went back to school and when I went back to school I was now the outsider I didn't have any friends and then going up all the sudden I'm in high school and I have no friends I have no I I can't get laid for I think that's what causes and eager and a lot of people in the world right oh yeah and depression yeah yeah yeah yeah and at the exact same time I'm starting to experiment with drugs and alcohol so you put the two together you know I was supposed to be the prodigal son you know I mean like I was very intelligent I was you know I like I was doing things by time I was 15 years old and the machine shop that that guy's you know might have been working for my father for 10 15 years couldn't do you know I mean so I was sort of this

09:37prodigal son I was good at athletics and everything had no problem with all that stuff so I think it was just sort of a backlash you know and then I let that anger get the best of me so now when you were doing drugs and alcohol what were the drugs like what was the drug that caused you to overdose heroin an injection hit damn that's deep when you're injecting it you're all in baby yeah and you know I didn't actually do it a whole lot it's kind of the funny thing a lot people thought that I was addicted to heroin and I was a doubt I think that was probably a fifth time that I did it maybe six I'm like I didn't count but you know that was sort of my fine that was my step into the dark side mmm you know in a blessing and a curse man you know it immediately hoes like oh okay that's what can happen right right step back and you know I was very naive very man I was a fool really

10:36like because what I did I remember leaving the hospital I was like okay well I'm never doing heroin again but let's go do some coke right so I just a dummy man I think that's 21 22 one of those I mean there's like 15 years ago there's a lot I was actually kind of thinking about like so again you know on this podcast I was like a you know is probably going to come up on it it's a pretty intense story outside to him I can't remember all the details it was like a long time ago but anyway yes I was like 21 22 and it wasn't too much long later you know I live with this girl and you know she was a drug addict too and she had a couple kids and it was like it was like alright well now I got a place to live let's get up mmm you know it is I never did a heroin again after that obviously I think I did oxys though percocet stuff I guess she's basically the same thing yes which I mean I didn't

11:49realize it at the time but really my drug of choice was meth back in that day that was what I really liked and that was actually what I was addicted to at one point and I ended up going to jail and that was what got me out of addiction I didn't realize I was addicted until I was in jail so what made you realize it when you were in jail I just thought you know just couldn't stop thinking about it and just won it and just I mean I didn't get have like like like cold sweats or anything I don't think that happens with uppers but I mean I was just you know like like but couldn't stop thinking about him as I did that like just a lot of that anger was coming out I was just like God like what the like I wanted to fight everybody I was like somebody give me something you know and Wow yeah it's just really terrible experience but probably lasted three four days not even

12:45maybe not even that and then you came out of it yeah I mean I was just like able to accept my fate and and deal with it what does it feel like to be on mouth you take adderall I'd never taken that role now pretty similar to our alright yeah it's like adderall I mean that's the the closest I would say I mean you're high but you don't have I mean euphoria more than anything just to excuse me just an extreme sense of euphoria just everything is beautiful but then men soon as you start to lose out a little bit you just itch for it's so bad man so bad that you just want it again you don't want to sleep how your teeth to be grind in your psyche like you just tensing up all your muscles I God well I gotta get more of that you know now what you working out at all back then no no well that's it well not working out like it should be so again I was angry a lot of times like I'd be at

13:52a party that this was a common thing I'd be like a party or just doing drugs whatever and I just started getting look at everybody like I don't like none of you and I would just walk outside and I would go for a run I'd run five six miles come back and give me another line or whatever Wow yeah run and then come back - yeah yeah and then sometimes I would fight people you know that was common very very common if you call that working out and we like this particular time in my life I was living in a little town called Jamestown Ohio and I had this buddy he was friend his cousin well his cousin was a fighter and this was kind of my first foray into mixed martial arts her first experience watching it and everything and they would train in the grass in the backyard you know we were I remember watching Ken Shamrock DVDs are VHS is back then leg locks we'd go on

14:55the living room floor like just be shit-faced drunk and I'm lucky I didn't tear an ACL or anything we're like all this is what he's doing is yeah he'll hooks and I mean I remember all the techniques but I remember it was like you know pankration stuff right and we just be laying there and it was always a thought of thinking I do this awesome and I could beat take a bit you know and we would joke about it maybe we would say I remember specifically sit in there like I dude like you know we're gonna get you a fight in you know the local Joe Schmo show and then you know we're gonna get you up and you're gonna go to a pride and then you're gonna go to the UFC I was like cool the hell yeah let's do it and that was you know it was like a joke kind of but now like that was what was in my head that's so that's what we were gonna do introduction to martial arts yeah so

15:47what was your first real formal training like what what Jim did you first so I fought before I trained Kip the yeah yeah so so I should visit this guy that was a he was supposed to go fight West Sims and his name was Fat Joe is what we called him he was supposed to go fight Watson's fat Sims Wes Sims that day and I said yeah let's go man I want to go with you I want to see this up close right so we go there and I'm doing a bunch of coke on the way and you know to me it's just gonna be a party like I'm just watching my dude fight I get there and uh you know there's he signs up on the table and I was like I do what is that how you you know that's all you got to do is like yeah he so you just paid 30 bucks and you come fight I said maybe I should do that and then the guy and I'm looking inside and I see the you know people sit around smoking cigars like

16:43you see on a movie people smoke cigars you see bets being made and stuff and and the guy who's men you want to fight the champion like nobody wants to fight him and I was like yeah man I'll fight him you kidding me so I lit win a cross street there's a sporting goods store across the street or down the street or something went and bought a mouthpiece come back there's a restaurant across street boiled the mouthpiece at the restaurant used that microwave comeback and then and then we're at the fighters meeting so the fighters meeting back then was a lot different so there wasn't way in it was like you and you you guys look about the same size you guys doing kickboxing okay you guys fight right so that's how the way it worked out and I'm sitting there and they're like okay you're the champion you're fighting him and I was like oh all right this right and you know so I'm stationed this guy

17:32taught me how to do a jab he's like me as I call you're doing a beat this guy just jab him he's how you see this just notice jab I was like okay I'm gonna do that and went out there and I beat the guy so he actually quit yeah he actually quit you know so he was a tough man champion as what he was and I actually do a jab punched him in the face and he went to shoot on me I did you know a playground guillotine choke and he just quit I don't think I actually had the choke in I don't highly doubt you know tap he tapped out saying that his calf cramped up I have no idea like what really happened I mean I I certainly didn't know a guillotine choke it even know the name of it so anyway later that night as I did like you fighting over long you will fight again yeah whatever man and there's over this guy you know he's going pro and his next boxing match your kickboxer let's

18:27fight him I said alright I'll him up this dude beat the out of it so that was actually the first the nice thing about that was it actually made me realize how tough I am that was the saving grace I mean he just you know just pieced me up just one punch after another you know I'm just eating punch after punch and then yeah that was it I said man I got to do this and then so my second fight I you know I didn't think I still yet needed to train my second fight I met a guy at a gym so you know I did go to this gym as a Japanese Jiu Jitsu gym and he goes and he goes aim and you want to fight in like two weeks and muy Thai hell yeah right so for two weeks you know I hit the bag probably for five minutes a time whatever or something I go to the fight and man this is the worst part so I get in there first thing you got does comes in shoots on me takes me down we're in

19:26big gloves shin pads on us takes me down I'll get up look at the hell what's the he's taking me down we can't do this more time all right music fight you know comes it takes me down again what the man so I was like okay so we're wrestling right so I come out and getting sort of a wrestling stance drop my hands kicked me in my head so uh we'll come find out later say ciao no I Scott Schiele show what I used to work with him a lot san shou for people don't know was kickboxing with takedowns yep like corner don't worry Smith back in the day when Maurice was doing that once okay yeah in Burbank I think it was it was weird it was confusing it's like okay I mean it's interesting I guess I mean it's probably a good skill set to learn learn how to do takedowns and throws with with kickboxing but then you just let the guy up which is just weird you didn't get it huh he was weird yeah yeah

20:23I mean it still goes on they say and I say yeah I think it's amazing sport I love it it's amazing and it's only a lot of times there's a lot like throws in Muay Thai because you know there's a lot of trips and throws in Muay Thai they said you get points for that the throws yeah yeah up to five yeah another variation yeah yeah I think it's like their feet go above their head it's five points so when did you get serious so you did this right because I mean he beat the out of me like I remember walking out of there and people were looking at me like damn how'd you survive a bro I mean like people were actually asking me how like dude how did you survive that and I had to go to work that night I was like working third shift everybody's looking at me at where did you got like two black eyes they if anyway that was when I said to myself you know I want to try this and you know

21:19I think you know this is a something I really enjoy and I want to go for it so I met this guy his name was Eli Ayres and he was fighting in king of the cage once toughest guys ever met and then I got Braden workman and they were training for it was a big show there in Columbus guy came in the name is Joe but I think like Lawler fought on it like a bunch of Miletich guys Tim Sylvia you know the name if I said I can't remember but anyway yeah and then you know then I really got this kicked out on me when I got in the gym you know then I realized like you know what a real beating was and yeah it just went from there man because I I just said I never looked back and I thought men you know want to change my life you know I'm you know I wasn't never actually a the type of person that fit in with the drug user scene right like that wasn't me it was just a again expression of anger

22:17and these things that you know in my childhood just kind of you know came out the wrong way right so it wasn't really like I fit in there um so at this point like I'm I'm really not fitting in anywhere and this was a quote that I remember or I said I stopped trying to find yourself and start to define yourself and and I felt like the whole time I was trying to find myself and I said you know I'm gonna define who the I am I'm gonna say this is what I am this will I do I'm a fighter it let's go it's do or die I've been to jail band dad I've been you know I've slept in in the snow you know I mean like I've been homeless I've done every low thing you can do like what's the worst that could happen you're knocked out there's nothing so you know I decided it you know this is my path and I'm gonna carve the path I'm not gonna search for a path I'm gonna make the path and I'm not gonna look

23:13back and I'm going to the top of that mountain and and that's something I still talk about today when I talk to people is about I didn't have any idea how I was gonna do it but I knew why I was gonna do it and I knew that I was gonna do it and I think in my own personal struggles and I think in a lot of people's struggles they kind of get caught up in the how you know how am I going to do this how am I gonna win this fight whatever and I think when you know and understand your why I think the how becomes a lot more clear clear yeah more clear and easier I mean it doesn't matter anymore you could it's better to do it 100% wrong than 50 percent right I think there's a balance to doing things and it's highlighted by what you're just what you've just said there's a balance and it's a lot of what we were talking about earlier about Joel Jamison versus Lois Simmons versus like someone was

24:01like super technical versus someone who's just a mad dog and just wants you to just go out and do it and don't be a mmm-hmm your your mindset that allowed you to take that fight with no training and then take another fight after that with no training and then take another fight out that would notate it just this mindset of it let's just do this mmm there's a balance between that and then you realizing okay I got to really learn how to do this if I'm gonna really be a fighter I'm gonna really be a really defined myself and I really go out and make a mark I got to learn what the I'm doing exactly there's both things there but that's that balance like you need both things you know I mean this is you have to have a certain amount of it in you you know you have to have a certain amount for a sport I mean is it he call an MMA a sport it always seemed to me to be

24:55it's too it's too defining it's or to uh it's it's too limited it's not fighting is more than a sport it's an expression of what you're capable of absolutely it's you're who you are as a human and that's where one distinction I've made over the years is the difference between martial skills and martial arts everything everybody always calls everything and copses it into a martial art and when we go to the gym and we're training arm bars do 100 arm bars that's not art that's not your expression of your body in a combat scenario that's that's a martial skill now when we go in competition now we're expressing our art right and I think this is an important distinction to be made I think it's something that I get so tired of here and you know I trained martial arts and you know I trained martial skills and then I express my art that's a very interesting way of putting

25:51it how many years after you initially started seriously training were you on the Ultimate Fighter 4 or 5 I remember when you won the Ultimate Fighter and they stole your chew somebody with you so everybody remembers it I remember that because I remember like there's some dudes that there's some guys that play tough guy there's some guys that put on a show and puff up their chest and say some that they might not necessarily mean and then there's some guys that say some and you go uh-oh this dude's serious they with your kid with youichi i remember watching that go this serious like matt brown's not a joker and then when you fought Matt Arroyo that was a another example of it I'm like this skill-wise Mike matter royal is a very talented guy and still is good jiu-jitsu guy good fighter but there was something that was a battle of minds angry your mind I don't

26:50know if you knew that I fought him before that too yeah I do yeah but the first time I fought and this is why it was such a no-brainer to say to fight I fought him the first time on 24 hours notice so I wasn't even I wasn't training early I was training a girl and she was going to Florida it's a fight and when I got there we're driving to the weigh-ins and the promoter I heard him talking on the phone and he goes and I heard him say you know how we don't have an opponent for him so I said hey you know what do you need an opponent for and he's like well this guy matter royale you know 170 and I said dude I'll fight like how much will you pay me like I have 400 500 bucks I was like dude I pay my rent yeah I'll do it and yes and I said you know I can't make weight because I got like one hour and you know he said it's cool and fought him on 24 hours notice and beat him so he wanted

27:43Redemption for that yeah there was that fight was in it you one of the things about like watching you fight as someone who's seen a lot of people fight there's there's moments in exchanges where after the exchange a guy will try to take a break or a girl try to catch his breath or move pace negatory break yeah there's little breaks and then there's guys who recognize those breaks and push in you're a guy who pushes in absolutely when there's a break you're like oh no I there's no breaks here there's no breaks here and you just get on dudes and it makes things very intense ya know that's the thing about all your fights they're very intense you know there's a there's a certain level of violence that you bring into the Octagon that someone has to be prepared for you know and there's some guys that are prepared for it and makes for amazing fights like your fight with

28:33Robbie Lawler holy was that a crazy fight yeah you know and then there's guys they just can't keep the pace they just can't keep that then keeping you off of them yeah and I think what my goal as a martial artist as a fighter a marshal you know whatever you would call combat guy you know I'd get my skills up to the point where is your mind where it matches the mind yeah crazy yeah I mean a lot of guys struggle the other way yeah and I think one of the the things that I talk about a lot that you see I don't think that I was necessarily born this way this is where I think a lot of people get confused I mean I was certainly born with an inclination towards fighting I wouldn't be where I'm at without that but you know I work a lot on my mind I do a lot of stuff I've always been obsessed with martial arts and in combat as a whole and I hear other people say they're obsessed like

29:39Conor even made it really famous when he started saying it right I think my obsession goes far far beyond what anybody's even even close to I don't think they're their definition of obsession even even its comparable to mine at all I mean I'm far more obsessed I've read probably I got a library of sports psychology books of strength conditioning books of martial arts books all this stuff I mean it's literally on my mind 25 say but one of the things I really focus on is the the sports psychology part and I think that is why it's expressed that way in the fight and you hear a lot of people they'll say you have you heard like men you know my mind is already strong like I ain't scared when I walk in there or stupid like that and yeah and I always say you know do you think Michael Jordan stopped paxton layups do you think Jordan burrows stopped Paxson double legs do

30:32you think that Arnold Schwarzenegger stopped doing bicep curls because it's good doesn't mean that you moved upon yeah it can be improved upon and you don't stop so and I think the mind is one of those things that can always be better like we're not tapping into I mean what are we timing like 10% of our brains it's all best yeah that's yeah that's you know they used to think that these to think that that's something they say but the reality is your brain has a bunch of different quadrants for all sorts of different functions okay so when you know you're utilizing a certain portion of your brain that's the portion your brain that's responsible for those actions okay yeah it's not either way our minds are certainly far more unlimited and far more potential than we're tapping into I think your mind is a lot like your body and it performs and it does what you

31:23asked of it and if you just are a lazy it doesn't do anything but sit around and watch TV and you don't ever challenge your mind I think your mind is weak in an atrophies absolutely yeah now when you say that you you have all these books and you say that you work on your mind like do you have a daily practice that you do do you meditate I meditate you know daily is sort of a I hate saying I do it daily because you know I skip days and and I'm gonna have three kids which you know how that goes yeah yeah it's very but at the same time I try to use everything as an opportunity to practice on my mind to write how you do anything is how you do everything right right and so I think you know we can use opportunities all the time and but yes I do meditate I do tons of visualization I have my stratification coach I work with now he's he's also got a degree in sports psychology so we

32:23integrate a lot of that in the training itself for instance like doing we do these 200 yard Sprint's on the forced treadmill and they're just miserable that I mean by time you're done you just don't have anything left it's a complete drain and then as soon as you're done like if staying at attention right I have to stay in you know like a military attention straight up and down and not let the the concept of your body shutting down affect your ability to maintain a posture right and that's just a mental thing 100% right is it solely mental that's just one example we do a million things like that but yeah I do I do tons and tons of visualization which is a consistent marker of high performers a consistent thing that high performers do I think this is a well-known I have a mental coach specifically that kind of holds me accountable for a lot of the things you know mean him we talk a lot

33:20back and forth about the different the different ways to create habits I think that's probably the number one things creating habits right you know but you know you holds me accountable for everything and I think that's probably the biggest key is just being held accountable for every action that you do have you ever used a sensory deprivation tank absolutely my my coach has one beautiful yeah I love it then I go in about 45 to an hour do you work on in there do you think about techniques you know I don't really I used that as a time so I've I tried to practice this for meditation that I you know I can't remember the name of it this dude kishna Maru you've heard of him Krishna Mario I don't know why it's not coming to my head right now but he was one of Bruce Lee's guys he's an Indian meditation guy and everything and his form of meditation was to completely

34:17clear your mind which is I guess like is actually impossible right like you there's no way to just have no thought at all but that's sort of what I try to strive for is go literally no mind at all what I do is think about only my breath that's it I can trade on my breathing in and out and there's a bunch of the that gets in there but eventually I can kind of overpower it and just think only about breathing in no that's what I am so that's what I do to get to that state mhm right to get to a state where I can release everything mm-hmm but at that point once up mum relaxed then I go for the no mind which again is impossible but my personal system of visualization or relaxation as I see the thoughts as clouds and that my mind is a sky or space so you know my mind becomes this gigantic entity and the thoughts are just clouds that pass by but again when I start thinking about things like that

35:17you're not in the know mind if you start thinking about your breath you're not in the know mind and I want to get as close to that as possible because in a fight in a combat situation I want no mind right that's the that's the way that Musashi talks about right yeah and that's that's Musashi right there oh yeah yeah this was a ring to play on Musashi have you read the book Musashi yeah yeah I read that you put it on your yeah I read that and I read the book of five rings when I was 16 change nice nice that's the one that Louie will if you work for Louie of his staff use force to read it yeah you haven't read it dude once you'd leave you could see it in all things I remember reading that when I was 16 and I was like I get it I was like you when you when you can get great at something you can get great at anything it's the same thing whether it's playing the piano or writing books

36:11or fighting or anything it's the same thing it's all about figuring it out understanding the way and that's the book the art of learning have you read this one no Josh Waitzkin you know here's oh yeah the chess prodigy there's a black belt under marcelo garcia yeah yeah beautiful amazing book that's sort of a similar type thing he's a wizard man have heard him on Tim Ferriss podcasts whoever smart gods right heard of him from yeah genius and just so good at understanding how to learn things and teach things I think that mentality that chess player mentality cos chess is such a complex cognitive demanding game you know there's so much thinking and planning and so many steps ahead that you have to be in so many moves you have to have catalogued in your head and and he goes into beyond just the technical part to when he talks about how he kind of lost his love for and yeah it's a

37:08great book man yeah well he's a really fascinating character yeah I love when a guy like that gets obsessed with martial arts because it changes the way people look at something like jujitsu because people on the outside in particular they look at jujitsu is like oh it's just a bunch of meatheads choking each other and then they see a guy like that and they go oh wait a minute Josh Waitzkin he's a black Bell huh and that's gotta be one of the great things about jujitsu is the amazing people that do it yeah yeah I mean you come out here to LA I mean I see these people doing jujitsu I talk to them like hey what do you do you know I'm a movie a top guy or whatever I'm executive I'm I'm a CEO like wait what what are you doing in here Guy Ritchie garbage he's a black belt who's in the podcast I was like why you're a black belt under Henzell right holy nice yeah that's the legit man let's go

38:05that ass goddamn black belt in their hens Oh Gracie they don't give those away Maynard James Keenan yep yep oh he's a buddy of mine yeah I mean I know I'm a little bit of a bar jiu-jitsu and he's got a fake hip hip replacement from stompin on stage you know he's only stompin on stage and he choke someone out on stage yeah he hip toss some dude took his back and got him in a rear naked choke on stage and kept singing and the dude was going like he wasn't hurting the guy you know the guy was a fan it was the whole thing was kind of crazy like mostly on YouTube fine the guy comes up to the guy runs up to him on stage Manor has the microphone in his hand manners another dude he's he's one of the smartest dudes I'm so smart stupid smart to the point where he's kind of he's cut he gets weird around people this is so goddamn smart everybody else is like a baby so

38:56here he's on stage he had a big screen and some dude some dude jumps onto the stage and rushes him where's it at Jamie how long is this video got to get to when the dude runs on stage there okay get it go before cuz he hip toss he's i singing this whole time look the guy runs up to he's like yeah I made her hug him boom takes his pack okay and he keeps singing and then he goes over onto his back and pulls the guy backwards and then keeps singing while he's in fullback mount with the yes that is beautiful he kept singing the song it's guys like an hilarious man is it God man yeah he's and he's always training he comes out here he trains down the bacons place yeah trees is Dave Camarillo Gracie goes everywhere yeah I'm talking with them a little bit out there we were drilling a couple weeks ago over at Henry's and yeah I brought in MusclePharm we did some training

40:00there and most people to get their hip replaced like that's a wrap right and he's like I gotta get my black belt Wow Mark Coleman had his hip replaced since he ain't even training yeah they talk about a sort of um right I think he may have had both out my the one when where they call it had a problem yeah yeah that in fact it had to get redone redone man imagine that they cut off the top of your leg they put a fake hip in there they put a bolt that goes through the center of the bone all the way down through the bone imagine have the redo that they got to pull it out Majid is doing it was I've only had one surgery in my life I've only went under Bob went under twice now son um actually said twice yeah the first one I had tore the ligament right here oh I remember that yeah you were you were talking about that that was with you for a long time right yeah probably

40:52about a year I fought like that but you couldn't totally make a fist right yeah it was like this kinda sounds like froggen people you know call still like that yeah he McCall's broke his hand so much that his right hand one of his knuckles like his pinky or is a pointer finger and it never curls past that yeah well this wasn't broken the bones were all intact but the ligament there was completely torn so what they have to do I just went in there to the decision there and just reattach the ligament and I came back probably four months later five months later maybe that's when they were telling me you'll be fine and everything and you know it took probably a year before it was actually okay Wow it's just Chris Weidman is going through some like that right now he his thumb up in the Kelvin Gastelum fight and then had to get a ligament from his wrist hmm taken out and

41:45attached to his thumb because his thumb it was torn and he still can't fully train still can't grip or fully punch yeah he's waiting your mind they didn't have to none of that but they they said once they opened it up there was a lot more stuff in there they had to take out and a lot more that was ripped that they didn't even realize was there you know how it is with Korres in my eyes yeah well with fighters like so many guys have wrong they don't even know like did you ever seen Jacques arrays when they had his elbows cleaned out he had elbow surgery and they found chunks of bone and cartilage in his elbow like a like like a shot glass filled with like there was loading around inside of his elbow just from hitting people with elbows and get an arm barred not tapping and popping happen and tearing loose and all that is just mangled yeah cuz he broke his

42:38arm when he's hodja hodja it into his belt and kept going it's badass I mean that was a horrible arm break to like to me wrestling is the hardest sport in the world and I love race I love watching it I love being a part of it yeah but that doesn't happen in wrestling right very often I mean I guess there's probably some I know Mike pasilla went to the finals with a torn PEC Wow yeah so one thanks a lot takes a lot I guess it does happen wrestling I shouldn't say that yeah that's a different that situation was just he was up on points and he just needed to survive for one that's right yep yeah won the match remember when John Jones fought Vitor Vitor completely hyper-extended his arm that was right I don't know if it broke but it was up for a long time I mean it was bent like this the other way just completely bent backwards like I was convinced he was gonna tap I was

43:36like he's got a tap I thought it was too if he taught like let it go a little yeah looked like he let it go it was weird yeah I remember that yeah and like I think of if he finishes that crazy the world changes yeah the whole world of light heavyweight changes yeah Vito's life changes yeah everything changes Vitor becomes a champ yeah the whole thing changes John Jones not the greatest ever yeah which you know is that up in the air whatever but I think he's the greatest ever performance-wise we were talking about performance wise earlier before the podcast started in verses like we're talking about Cain Velasquez performance wise like the actual results versus what you think about their ability you know I think Ken when he was at the time I never saw anybody like Cain when he was in his prime 240 pounds unfuckin godly cardio we just never stopped coming at you technique

44:32take it remember my thing my whole thing with it though is as soon as you test positive once I take you out of the greatest pure it's just against the rules I'm not even against steroids like take steroids you know like if it's your endocrinologist tells you to take steroids go do it good good for you but in our sport unfortunately it's against the rules so there's only a certain amount of people doing it so if you're doing it you're cheating right and but do you think John was taking steroids I don't know I don't but it you I don't think he was but to be honest it doesn't matter to me I mean you know I've said this for a long time I think it should be a lifetime ban first offense we hear it yeah and there's gonna be martyrs there would be guys like I don't think Tim means was taking steroids that he wasn't he certainly did not look like it he wasn't that far okay

45:20so found the supplement that he was taken there was a totally legal supplement guy you get a bunch of so views but companies are these companies rather they get it from China and they they have these bins and like we had a problem with that with the alpha brain when we first thought not steroids but vitamins that were in alpha brain that weren't suppose that were supposed to be there we have all our stuff independently tested and when we had it independently tested it turned out that the mixers that when they were putting all the different ingredients in they would be putting in these vats and they'd use these vats for other and how to completely cleaned it out and this is a problem with companies that sell steroids and also sell things like creatine like this is the this is the big story about Jon Jones this is the big rumor this is what they're worth

46:03they think is that he was doing coke that had creatine in and yeah it was cut with creatine that creatine probably had trace elements of steroids the reason why that makes sense is because he tested negative right before that test and then tested positive and then tested negative again a short time after that this is a steroid that takes several months to get out of your system but it got out of his system very quickly which would indicate it was a very very small trace amount not an amount that you would take if you were actually using it to try to you know to get a performance enhancing benefit that's what I think it makes sense to me and so it makes it it's key to it's fair enough and I'm certainly there's cases so under in my world where okay first offense lifetime ban I think a lot of guys would be a lot more careful with things I kept for one and I

46:55think you know there would be a due process so you know say he proved that or like ten means you know proved it you know he comes right back right and I also think unfortunately there would be people that would probably you have no bad intention and would have the you know end up testing positive and having a lifetime ban and there would be martyrs basically I can't I can't sign off on martyrs man too many dudes have dreams you know sure what about you like what if you accidentally took some creatine and some personally I'm extremely diligent I do my you know right I do my due diligence man I got I work with muscle Pharm for years now and like I know that and they have great stuff yeah they made my stuff I know that it's good stuff and that's my primary supplement source I mean I'm I don't go do coke if you tell me like alright if you do those things and something bad happens to you

47:53that's your fault you know I mean if if for instance he was doing coke and he you know not knock on john jones either i mean it's it's a i'm not living his life i mean he's in a difficult situation as a young kid you know with god I mean I can only imagine the amount of people approaching him for crazy things and trying to talk him into all this so I have some sympathy for his situation but you know you make their choice you have to pay the consequences for the choice I agreed that you should pay the consequences for the choice I just don't agree that the price should be so high you know like what when you think about a guy like Anderson Silva like Anderson Silva just tested positive again again do you think that that takes him out of the consideration for the greatest of all time in my mind a hundred percent see I do want it because he's old forty so we again we

48:44can feel whatever we want to feel right I mean I feel like he probably wasn't doing it the whole time but he might have been yeah but do I know he'll know I don't know ever see his trainer oh yeah yeah Erik Silva when I fought him 5% body fat at 60 years old like I said a picture updated of the guy to Dana and I go this is Anderson's trainer lol holy straighter guys so Jack Dana certainly seen him around you straight lots of guys is that that's not that's a different guy man less he's younger no no it's he's right there I love it with the picture to the left yeah the left is the one yeah that's the picture I say I mean this ABS stick out like black biceps each one of his abs looks like a bodybuilders bicep just glued to it there's like you can get big at 60 you could be pretty built at 60 you can't be that built this is like point zero one percent of the population

50:05that can do that man they all live in Africa yeah like super genes yeah they're all like Francis and condos releves you know at that age you know the body starts to diminish there's just no if ands or buts about it do you know that he's that old for sure yeah that guy's old yeah he's in his 60s yeah he's a I think he's a X Jim right this is that is Joker I know he trained Erik Silva who was at Xtreme he was in his corner and mm-hmm I'm glad I'm fighting a little guy not him yeah boy you want to talk about a post you sada guy yeah he's he's one of him and veto but veto obviously was a testosterone replacement therapy but him uh I think Johnny hitters was probably the most obvious performance wise for sure you got you got to wonder about Hendricks like how much of it was burnout how much of it was possibly he was taking something you got to say it possibly because never tested positive

51:02for anything but yeah but dude he was launching people across you know I was the last fight before you saw her when I fought him you know I felt a strength I seen his body I mean yeah I felt it firsthand this is a completely different world yeah yeah well especially completely different compared to now yes look the same yeah he doesn't fight the same it's like a certainly part of that has to be motivation too I mean he's just there's no way he's under the same mental aspiration that he had before he's just so looks at it differently could be also because his hormones are all up yeah absolutely this big speculation if he was on something then he's off his hormones crash yeah there's no way they can't that's just hang there and that affects your mind right a hundred percent no I never take it but I mean I see people that go on and off of it and they're

51:53like depressed and yeah look at mentor remember when Vitor came back I mean there's so many pictures of Vitor when he fought like Michael Bisping and then you see Vitor after you sada and he just he's got that old man bod and he goes in there and his body's kind of like loose and it just your body's not producing hormones anymore he was on that when he was 19 well yeah yes yeah yeah Randy he was 240 pounds and his neck started up here his neck started about two inches above his ears and just went down straight to his shoulder he's so fast there's a ridiculously for yeah yeah especially when he fought tank was ridiculously fast yeah because I wonder for zinnias just saying like if it gives you slowed down when you stop taking that stuff right like your muscles actually you know you're fast twitch muscles go away or something like that you know body crashes right when you're that jacked up

52:52on steroids your whole body first of all you your balls are just like on vacation I mean I know you get stronger but what about you know speed though that's a different that's and a lot of speed is from a neurological right there's a lot of you know the nervous system so I wonder you know about the effects on how did you see the study and egapp and just came out with which way he just posted their day about epigenetic memory of muscles yes so this is I think a big problem with the steroids because I say I do steroids when I'm 19 now my muscles get jacked and now my muscles remember how to get that jacked again may even though I'm off steroids for 10 years and then I come back at 30 and and redo it that's a very good point that's a very good point and a very real point yeah you your body has muscle memory and especially if you do it when you're young and then your body has an adequate

53:42amount of time to rebuild and you start developing a natural hormone level it also increases your tendon strength it increases ligament strength I mean it just your body changes it changes the density of your muscles of your bones it just doesn't there's a lot of that I mean and then there's another argument for women and women that have taken steroids it's even more intense argument because you're putting supernatural levels of testosterone in a woman's body they develop all this new muscle tissue that never would have been there without it and a certain amount of that sticks around and you know you might not even able to develop that kind of strength without it yeah yeah yeah that's what that was the first thing I thought of when I seen that study yeah that was where I was I you know there's there's always a lot more to it than meets the eye yeah a hundred percent yeah and you

54:31know with the kind of cheating that they've been doing in Russia you know did you see that movie Icarus no it's on Netflix right yeah I'm actually talking about what I see it it's crazy I just watch so little TV I just miss everything yeah every every day someone did you see this on Netflix now I planned on it it's on my queue you don't mess up my list it'll make you it'll make you curious and mad at the same time yeah is that a state-sponsored state-sponsored doping program Russia had pretty well known yeah but this was proven doing it the guy who was doing it was in this documentary and he was helping this guy Brian Fogle do a bike race what Brian Fogle did was he did a bike race with nothing and then he wanted to get juiced up and see what the difference is with the next year do the same race but do it on everything and so he contacted this Russian guy who is the head of

55:24anti-doping in Russia well this guy along the way from doping up Brian Fogle they all got busted and when they got busted not Brian Fogle the Olympics in in Russia the they had the Sochi Olympics they found out that people at Tampa tampered with samples and a bunch of started coming out about it and then it became this gigantic scandal he fled Russia came to the United States and testified and told everything that he did they opened up these supposedly unopenable sample jars and replaced the bad urine with clean urine they had frozen urine and then they had a hole in the wall with her passing urine and replacing the old stuff was a specific to us a certain specific sport Oh every sport across the board and they had a record number of gold medals that year everybody's juiced to the tits everybody's piss and clean that's the tough thing about everybody goes into

56:19the Russian training methods and how they're superior and everything you know I mean there's some great Russian training methods for sure I mean Russia's invented the kettlebells Russians have super technical wrestling instruction and there's some without a doubt some great Russian training method but it's also because sports means so much to them like they were there also state-sponsored scientist rather than you know in America where it's you know fear a professor or something you just do what you want to do for your you know for your athletes or whatever well we have to realize that their best athletes are all amateurs yeah they don't have professional sports boxing yeah but that's it I mean and they don't have well they have MMA to Fedor obviously right but they don't have like NFL NBA Major League Baseball hockey right they don't have like this much true

57:11professional venue like we do over here a lot of their greatest athletes go into amateur Olympics and so they're juicing these people up for Soviet Glory they're doing it for the glory of the country and this is sponsored by the state and they outline in this documentary from Putin all the way down people working for Putin who this guy is Gregory guy who was the guy was in charge of all the state-sponsored doping it's madness and it makes you wonder you know I mean nobody wants to say like phaidor in pride was the right I mean he was the love I loved him an animal it makes you wonder makes you wonder like what's going on over there loved it very yeah I was one of the best I think a crow cop a door man that was like for me was probably like the the most intense I had to stay up for yeah and I just remembered waiting watching him walk out just eyes it wasn't like at 3 o'clock right yeah

58:11liber it was really late at night I mean there's snowing and yeah I don't know why I remember that but I'm not going anywhere man I'm steamed you're watching this the eyes bulging out just you know I didn't care man yeah phaidor versus Nogueira is so rare than lights are like that anymore I mean there's certainly some yeah I come up here and there but man those to me where the glory days man yeah wait because it cuz well we waited how long to see the fight yeah you know it's like three four months there's no fights in between right you know there's like one UFC fight or something and we're psyched dude this is the fight this is the Superbowl that everybody's been waiting the whole season there's too many fights now I don't know I like it I'm not sure there's a lot of fights yeah I also think that some of them get overlooked absolutely absolutely and like I wish that there's a side of me

59:04that wishes it was the way it was back in the day and there's a side of me that's I I do this is what we all wanted from the beginning right you know we wanted fights every weekend but again unfortunately it does take away from that gigantic fight yeah you know those are harder to make these days that's right yeah I think that's why they're doing the champ versus champ thing they're trying to make those big fights again yeah I think so too but if you only have those fights every three or four months there's no way you're gonna have enough fights for all the athletes in the UFC absolutely that's yeah big part of the issues yes 500 fighters on roster plus I think there's more now actually the only thing I could I mean I'm not I'm not one to say how to do it but I kind of wish there was like you know the UFC fight night and then the pay-per-view and you know they have all

59:47these different things but they don't seem to I think they may be moving towards aware that there's sort of a you know the smaller fights work up like you do like a UFC Fight Night three or four times build an audience now we put your on pay-per-view for the big fight you get what I'm saying something something like this I not necessarily like a feeder but you know within the organization a feeder yeah I know what you mean yeah yeah I'm more structured I mean I love the big events that they have every year at the 4th of July event the new year's event at the Madison Square Garden event they have a year where they just stack it and just have yeah just a ton of big time fights but you know like I liked Eric Anders lyoto machida last week too you know I mean I like I like that to where it's maybe a fight that not a lot of people are watching maybe less people

60:33are watching but it's an interesting fight so yeah I didn't get to watch it I said I don't have cable anymore so don't yeah don't even have cable like we use Netflix my wife does but do you have do you understand the UFC app I do have the UCF was it on there yeah well that wasn't but it probably will be how long after it will be this one do they wait before from Fox Sports one till it's on the I don't even know I mean that's the thing those I guess I sit there and watch that if I'm watching anything it's always fights on there or YouTube I just watch more tight fights all day that's like my favorite thing to yeah yeah did you see Sanchez latest the question yeah where I pulled up his shorts right after do I love them Sanchez so interesting to me because he's different than any other Thai fighter and his movements not so light on his feet and constantly

61:26switching stances and he's just as a Floyd Mayweather of more tire yeah man yeah that's a guy I'm gonna try to get out here for you know like what I'm doing with most farmers some things I could try to help them build a team and everything and he's one of the guys I want to get out for our seminar and kind of be you know let him know I want to meet that guy yeah I really want to get him because it's not just the you know the way that he fights in the ring but the way that he trains me yeah I mean he trains hard hard you know you watch these videos of me you're like dude and it's so easy for him that's the only part right like he'll do like 30 kicks in a row yeah I do too how did you just do that and you're like smile yeah well he doesn't kick like is loose yeah Harrison yeah he's a hundred and fifty percent and he just keeps going just keeps going his eyes man I don't

62:25know if there's something you can even train I mean he's like the I'd say more like the low Machiko of yeah uh Mort I write his eyes man he just sees ya like that question mark kick and he just no there he is yeah and you look at his body man and he ain't scary impressive guy like you look at blue cow Moo cows jacked you know giant ab muscles just ripped sanch I just looks like a guy works out a little bit he just people up man and he's so slick with his movement like even when he's hitting the pads who hits pads like this where he's never seen never stops moving his feet so relaxed so relaxed and so fluid what's interesting to me is the feet just never stops moving his feet and that's just I don't understand why more people don't emulate his style because he's obviously a traditionally trained Thai fighter but has adapted everything to a much more dynamic and fluid method

63:21man it's like you know when I watched Sancho and loma chicken i watch this out of these guys right and so i got watch Liam Harrison right or John Wayne Parra Raymond Decker's you know these is great more Thai guys right and they inspire me I'm like I want to it and then I watch Sanjaya watch the loma chica I'm like why do I do this right right it's the next level I do I should why I even go into the gym I can't look at this flap flap well that's what I talked about right there he's so fluid and relaxed he's really and tired I mean look at his face he doesn't even I mean he could do this all day all day and I mean he could do in his kitchen while he's cooking you know 36 yeah I mean it's really incredible he's something special that's the most the most facial expression I've ever seen home right there yeah it's probably 50 rounds I mean the guy's constantly training

64:21constantly gym and one of the things that I like about the way that I spar too is that they play like they're tapping each other they're just working on their timing and their movement and they're not hurting each other they're saving it for fights yeah well they fight every week yeah yeah my coach doing price he's over there right now and yeah I mean they just they fight all every week I follow him on Instagram yeah he's an amazing person man just one of the best guys who'll ever meet your life man unlike one of the things he said recently he's like yeah I'm wearing the same what great t-shirt and the same shorts because I'm not here for a fashion I'm here to Train I'm in Thailand yeah here to get my work in yeah and he goes over to Holland with Rainn Simpson and another guy hope to get over here too he was showing on one of his Instagram posts he was like these

65:12are my five-star accommodations yeah white plastic bucket this is how a shower you know they're doing the real deal yeah hi fighter yep yep he's so that's where he actually goes up to I don't think he still goes up there but he used to go up to us on which is the northern part of Thailand and originally they didn't let foreigners up there he would go to Sigma Chi he was the first foreigner that they let in there and that was his dream he wanted to live like a Thai fighter Wow like a savage and that's where I'm lucky to have a friend like him because he brings the Thai style back to me and that's why I've never had to go to Thailand like he goes over he'll only come back for my camps he's had tons of people offer and he won't come back for no one else that's awesome Ben so when I was telling story about going you know started his Japanese jiu-jitsu place the first gym I went

66:01into he was there and you know we both started together and he wanted well he would he'd already started actually he was out in Virginia and then just moved to Columbus but he won we both wanted to do more Thai and I was like dude there's no money in what I you do that so he went to more Thai and I went with him a of course he went with him made for a little while dude I wish there was money in more time I love it lion fight I would love watching it and I preferred that even over regular kickboxing I like that oh yeah yeah I'd say why they limit it yeah why limit it I just I mean I think they limited it for k1 because I thought it would create more action with less clinching but it's garbage it is right it still enjoy watching Bellator kickboxing I love it because they just have some wild ass fights but a lot of those guys that are the top of the food chain guys are Muay Thai guys

66:52yeah I mean Kevin Ross is in Bellator I mean this guy elbow the every John Wayne yeah joe Schelling yeah yeah these are elbow guys yeah yeah and man I've always thought that if they marketed more tired like they do the kickboxing I think it would blow up a lot better but when you take more Thai like lion fights in there they're playing the snake charmer music and they got the Mong Kong's and they're dancing around Weick ruin and and everybody's like dude I don't want to see this garbage we'll see some blood yeah it's hard for people to appreciate the tradition but I don't you know I I respect their tradition you know what someone who's they said that what's beautiful about the Mong Kong and the Wai Kru is that you get relaxed it's like you're out there dancing and then you can put on your best performance because you're in front of all those people and you kind

67:39of loosen up and then doing that that's one of the baddest versa I love it I think it's awesome and I'll watch it all day long but I don't think the casual American fan is ever going to be attracted to that I wonder you know I wonder if they could be talked into it it just seems like what happened with MMA was like lightning in a bottle that Forrest Griffin Stephan Bonnar fight on TV on Spike TV nobody knew what the it was at the time you're watching MMA for the first time you see that crazy these guys just throwing down wild haymakers head kicks and take thousand haha and then exhausted I mean these guys just drain themselves out I think those guys made the UFC I think in that one fight it's one of those weird moments lightning in a bottle you know at one point in time they estimate there was as many as 10 million people watching that fight for and it started with just a

68:28couple of million like the event started with just these guys are going crazy and that one fight being so good I think made MMA I think it just was the launching point and then after that people got into it and then they started saying holy this is awesome and then all the other fights and then it became the thing that it is today but I think that lightning in a bottle moment it's hard to recreate and with muy Thai it just never happened there's no there's no lightning in a bottle moment and I don't know how you would recreate that today it seems like all the stars were aligned right because now today reality TV shows are kind of they're so saturated there's so many of them back then there wasn't as many so to have the Ultimate Fighter we got these guys in a house and they're all competing and they're gonna fight for this six-figure contract on television it was a big deal

69:21it was a big show to watch but now this like everybody's watching people selling cars and pawn shops and they're living in the woods and people making moonshine it's like man there's so many reality shows it's almost oversaturated to the point where if you had a Muay Thai show it's like okay here's another crazy thing people are doing oh this guy's contender that mortai contender that's right they did right did that even air here I wash it did it air in America yeah I don't know how I watched it maybe on YouTube or something but cuz the content was a boxing show right yeah but they had the contender which also was it could call the contender Asia I would say I don't remember I remember John Wayne par was on it yachts and cly right yeah that's yeah I don't remember there's another bad yachts and cly holy he just came back did he well he retired for a little bit rage' spotted I

70:13think last weekend maybe man yeah yeah it's just to me it's one of the great unsung combat sports and you know all these people that are watching boxing and I love boxing but you know if HBO just really wanted to get down and dirty come on HBO show me some more Thai oh that would be so amazing they have San Choi on yeah engine or maybe ESPN you know yeah instead of having these commentators these narrators it are just sand and you know every time they talk about it in May I almost vomit I mean it's just ridiculous and then you know instead of these garbage shows they have they have golf but you know like it right I mean some of the they have IKEA darts scene darts on ESPN but you can't show a boxing match come on well you know what man I think there's a problem with commentary with sports that leaks into MMA and I don't think it belongs there and I've fought against it from the

71:15beginning and that's the the insult commentary there's a kind of like calling people bums and calling people losers and you know get out of the game Snoop Dogg that piece of you know call him out what's with Carter Oh Larry called a that's not cool fight that was a mess I think he was I don't I don't care yeah you know you be put it on public he could have you know apologized to lead it whatever you know yeah if I go the UFC P I I might just punch him if I see him in whoa I'm cool with that well girls I'm just saying that really offends me man because you know what man Conor you know people all have their opinions about him I respect the out of that guy I love what he's done I love love his schtick I think he's a he's a true sportsman I mean I like he comes into the limelight for a little while and then he goes back and I think he goes back and he works his ass off yeah I

72:18really think he does he definitely does yeah he wouldn't where's that if he didn't right yeah you know but everybody judges him by you know what he he does out here well listen what he did was make a hundred million dollars fighting against the greatest boxer of all time for us it did wash no boxing match ended well it was and won a couple of rounds which is crazy you know that's Christ I mean I think Floyd I think I think the vast majority of people could of good fighters could win around so against Floyd just because Floyd I don't know if I say gives him away but you know he's gonna feel you he's you know I mean he's that's the way he fights you see he's not everybody like that yeah and he rarely wins the first few rounds agreed yeah but but it's not taking away nothing from Conor he didn't want to get clipped by that left uppercut that wasn't your right

73:08yeah um I just think what I'm talking about is like the commentators and a lot of the journalists and you see less of it today because I say Vinay Smith yeah that kind of style there's a style and this is their stick their stick is mocking people and creating controversy and I that's why I say I don't think MMA is a sport I think it's more intense it's you're emptying out out there you know when when you see a fight you know and it's a crazy ass war like Robbie Lawler Hafele dos Anjos where it's just five rounds of chaos to to diminish either one of these guys as a man as a human being based on their performance to mock them or belittle them I just don't think it has any place in that I think that's it's a way more intense and way more personal experience for those guys it's not it's not playing baseball it's not it's not Bill Buckner dropping a ball it's not that's not what

74:08it is man it's way more intense if you got a guy who's a lazy football player doesn't run fast enough you want to mock him that's whatever you go ahead and do that I don't care it doesn't bother me but you want to make fun of a guy who's literally putting his health on the line you know in an occupation where you're competing against a trained killer and you guys are gonna throw bones at each other for five minute rounds you gotta have some respect you have to have respect or you shouldn't be talking about it you should have some understanding of it you should know what the you're watching and you should have some respect and if you want to say that a guy should retire if you want to say that a guy is probably seen as better days that's fine but have some respect is this a different thing man it is not a regular sport I agree and I think I would say

74:53also the they have no right to be saying things that they've never done right yeah I mean you you you just can't you don't have to compete right like you do jiu-jitsu and more time and they you get such a more in-depth knowledge about what they're truly going through right and what's happening by just experiencing it a little bit right there's that and there's also I think if you've never really been punched in the face and you're you're talking about guys getting punched in the face like you really don't even understand the experience or if you never even worse I mean you've been never been punched in the face and there's nothing you can do about it like you bit right you bit I mean the worst I ever had I went down to Cuba for a little while and trained with the Olympic boxing team don't do this 2012 either yeah I think it was how did this come about so it was even legal to

75:52go down there back 10 would you go on a raft I think I'm past the limitations it's actually illegal to spend money there so I didn't spend any money there but I went there and I guess it's not illegal to actually go there so we went through Mexico City go to Mexico City than you buy a flight in Mexico City and go there my one of my coaches I've worked with for a long time on and off his Cuban and he grew up there and he we went there together he's part of the he used to coach the wrestling team so I went there and trained with the wrestlers for six eight weeks and we'd go over to the boxing team every now and then well I went with one guy he was a two-time gold medalist southern and I've never seen Boston like at in my life I mean I've never felt anything and there's nothing I could do nothing I mean I tried every trick in the book I tried every athletic

76:46move I'd hands up hands down here's the side whatever there's nothing I mean I've never seen boss and I mean two-time gold medalist I'm he was an amazing amazing boss I can't remember his name or anything but and you know just never experienced anything like it was the same with the wrestlers I mean I went with some guys that I got to go with Meehan Lopez his heavyweight of course Greco I don't know if you know he is with greatest Greco next to Carolyn rival and Carolyn and the greatest ever you know go with this guy Ivan fund or who had been asking last week he was a guy who I think I think he was the guy that asked we couldn't get past for the Olympics I know that fund or beat him but he checked him so you know bash currency you know it may as amazing as he is I mean that's how much better funderwear is yeah to explain tectum for people's 15 was it 15 points um I don't know what

77:41is an international actually I think it's I thought it was like nine or ten but whatever you gotta go somewhere yeah I mean he worked him over you know so I got to work with these just amazing guys but the boxing you know we were talking about and I mean I've literally knit to to experience so like this guy is punching you and there's nothing you can do yeah nothing you don't have it we're in a little ring and I mean you don't have a choice so you can get out of the ring or you can get punched again that's your only choice just getting boxed up boxed up and I mean and he's moving you know likes and I relaxed and chilled and he's like what do you want you know yeah you'll do something or what I'm not talking to me like that but but doing it with his emotions yeah yeah yeah it's terrible but yeah what an amazing place oh man you know I feel really bad for those people the what an

78:35experienced man just a different world you feel like he's going back in the 50s where'd you eat over there how do you eat so we stayed with Ivan fun Dora and his wife we actually cooked for us every day but there's restaurants and stuff - I missed like $1 to whom we went to this one place just about every day that was a they'd serve a big bowl of spaghetti like this big around and this bear just a gigantic bowl for like a dollar Wow had chicken on top they don't they don't have to have red meat I guess it's only for the wealthy or for the top people I don't know if it's illegal or something but but why to witness the LaVon Lopez's we stayed with originally so to witness the way they live is really fascinating because so in their wrestling dorms they have it's like six stories high we had to walk to the bottom to get a 5-gallon bucket of water to take a bath

79:24they had no running water upstairs take a bath that's how you brush your teeth that's how you do everything the guys on the top floor are the first level first team the varsity team so to speak you know the first level guys they get four meals a day and they get air conditioning in the room they got right below them the second team they got three meals a day and no air conditioning so these guys are literally fighting for their food and for a you know for the next level and I mean I've seen fights break out I seen guys trying to hurt each other in the wrestling room I mean it's intense day-in day-out man they have some incredible genetics over there - that's right you got like Yoel Romero that looks like he was made in a lab somewhere like some scientists just spliced together all the perfect attributes and just to be clear like don't quote me on that guys kind of hi

80:16heard through you know like translation you know maybe if I got something wrong with some you know a bunch of Cubans trying to beat me up for we're gonna get wrong anything but what is amazing placement and those guys are there fighting for their food men and I seen I've seen one kid he was a cousin of LaVon Lopez with lavon's a bronze medalist and probably should have been gold medalist you know I don't want to the Olympics have a lot of kind of behind the scenes stuff that people don't know about yeah I'm not sure if I'm really Liberty to speak out about in public you know cuz it's rumors right know this facts like what there's certainly facts well I said I'm not sure that I can really talk about it public I wouldn't want to hurt any I see many of those guys but you know his cousin came from a pen yard El Rio which we went out there one day and that was there's a

81:04good story so we've got the peanut areas like two hours from Havana and we took a donkey cart to a farm in the middle of nowhere we'd go back probably five six acre farm we walked back through this horse field walking over and everything and in there say I'll show you all these pictures and as soon as fascinating and there's a forest and soon as you walked through the forest now it's a casino in the middle of a force so I guess all shits illegal there's fights chicken fights in the function of the woods which is illegal in Cuba so I guess the due dates are illegal yeah so I got to you know experience illegal chicken fights in an illegal country and but yeah we took the the donkey cart out there and yeah we got stopped by the cops actually so I'm sitting there like this is about to be really bad so I told my wife that so anyway yes so weird pin yard area that's

81:59where lavon's cousin lived he actually saved his money which I mean I think they get like everybody gets like the same amount like the doctor and the chef or like the waiter waiter whatever they all get like the same money right the thing it's 30 bucks a month so he saved all this money their entire home smaller than this room right here four people living in there probably I would say about the size of these tables combined anyway says I was trying to get his cousin saved his money for like a whole year just so he could come train with the national team he came out there didn't only had money to get there so LaVon was sharing his meals with him and so now he's only eating two meals a day instead of the three or four so maybe three meals Stella for something like that but yeah very very fascinating just watching that you know you would just forget what we have and how blessed our

82:52lives are and humbling humbling man I mean these guys are just savages men just hard hard workers and getting the job done just getting nothing for it you know some of the guys at the top like me hon Lopez he gets some things like fund or for instance he got internet access like that that was like a blessing for him to have internet access because he had done so much for the country in the Olympics that's great I think he was a bronze medalist so they they hooked him up with the Internet yeah hooked up with internet' and I still email him every now and then like he'll send me pictures as a family and stuff and and you can say it's something like you know fund or at Cuba government net or something like that you know it's like a so he goes through the government so the government tracks every email coming in and out so yes so he would even tell me like before

83:43I left you know like don't even with this or this don't talk about this and yeah I think it's maybe latched up a little bit but I'm not sure man so yeah I can tell you a lot of stories about it was really a very eye-opening experience like like I want to take my kids there sometime like just to see that look you want what if you grew up here yeah no right now be happy yeah what you got yeah yeah I mean there's kids so one of the pictures I could show you would be the the wrestling room in Pina Del Rio I think you owe Romero came from there actually Meehan came from there Levon came from there and their wrestling room is actually probably as big as this room and it's a dirt floor with the mats are you know so if you imagine a mat getting dissolved in water and all the little pieces mm-hmm just spread out so they they sweep up all those pieces put them in a

84:38it's about as big as this table here that I sweep it all together and stack it up and that's their mat so they just practice you know basically take down stuff and that's why they're so hard to take down they learn from a young age you get taken down and sucks Wow yeah I'll show you a picture of it I mean it's really fascinating Wow how long were you over there for six to eight weeks I can't remember so oh that's a long time yeah we stayed for a long time and we did basically the whole training camp over there for which fight jordan mean wow and that was so that's when i first started working with that guy and you know the first thing he said was like you need better wrestling it's good to keep a holy i said alright let's go wow I saw I wrestled with those guys every day my wrestling came up tremendously oh yeah I mean there's no way sink or swim and then I said I got

85:28to work with the boxing team and the boxing team I mean the wrestling is one thing but I seen a lot of junior boxing team guys I seen one kid get kicked off the boxing team like they take their boxing very very serious over there right that's our national sport one kid got kicked off a team because he wasn't keeping up and they were doing they had to get up at like 5:00 a.m. do like an 8 mile run or something and they put you know water bottles like this and they fill it up with sand and that's their dumbbells and the kid didn't have any shoes but he couldn't keep up and they were doing hill sprints and he kept falling behind they're like you're off the team whoa so they would do like 5 a.m. and then they'd go to school and then they do afternoon workout and then they'd go back to school and then they do an evening workout and they live in these dorms and that's literally all they do

86:11that's their entire life they want to get out they you know or live a better life you know they'd be a champion or dime holy yeah and again you know I was looking all this or learning all this new translation so you know I could have some things not exactly right but you know I was I was living there with them for a little while have you wanted to go to Thailand absolutely yeah yeah yeah I do too yeah you know my thing is uh so when I did that my kids were very young and it wasn't so bad to leave them with their mom for a little while now I have you know I have three kids specifically my daughter it's just hard to leave right and to fly to Thailand if you never been there no no I say it's a fly that you know is expensive and um you know I I don't want to I just can't leave my family but this place is you go and bring them like that's supposed to be nice right it is

87:05yeah again the flights you know is what's expensive what you get there too it's cheap right but the flight I mean a thousand dollars per person you know I'm looking at $5,000 right just to fly there yeah yeah I want to but that's my nice thing about having doing yeah right right right now are you living in Colorado still or you here yeah so I live in Colorado right now and then I'm coming back and forth a lot come tell me yeah doing a lot of work with the mussel farm because mussel farms opening up their main headquarters now in Burbank is that what you're gonna be yep so they decide to move here well the CEO lives here for one thing and I think they're gonna attract a lot more athletes here and I think that they're gonna be able to do a much bigger thing and really what they're doing is a restructure in the entire business they're kind of moving away from just simply being

87:53you know whether the change like from MusclePharm to MP for instance so it's not just for the bodybuilder type crowd and excuse me for the meatheads and the you know and without you know I mean oh certainly still be catering to the that crowd but now they want to open it up more as a lifestyle brand expand it and they'll be doing a lot more stuff with a lot more athletes which I think they'll be able to do out here better than in Denver but now as a guy who's trained at sea level and you lived at Denver what how much of a benefit is it to be at that 5,500 feet pros and cons what's the con well the number one con is that you can't your max capacity is lower so you can't work as hard and can't work as hard all right but now how'd you get adapted though you know I've been a little torn with that because I tell you when I do my mass capacity training I don't think I've been able to reach the

88:51same levels that I have was at sea level I've heard other people say that they are able to my PRS you know in terms of lifts have been comparable but of course I was at Westside before so it's not right you know I mean you just not I tell you what you walk into Westside like you hit a PR right here it like you don't it doesn't matter it's just a there's an energy in there there's an aura it's an intense place yeah you've been there I mean you probably hit a PR but if you workout again there's pros and cons I mean obvious pro is red blood cell count and I think your lung capacity goes up yeah the idea they say is to sleep at altitude but to Train exactly this so that you can push your max capacity at sea level and then recover yeah so if like if you're in California you would live in Big Bear but then you would train down and like San Bernardino or something exactly yeah

89:46yeah and I don't know I don't even know California well enough to know that how that works well Big Bear is pretty close so you get there in two hours yeah you could drive there it's funny that have people out here say that's close like to me two hours of long-ass way well yeah no it's close it's here two hours I take you that long to get to Irvine in traffic that's what everybody says if I got a in Irvine like if I'm doing the improv and it's an eight o'clock show I leave here at four I'm not I leave here at 4 p.m. and I'm stuck in traffic for two and a half hours no this is the podcast yeah podcasts audiobooks you know anything anything just keep your mind off that those red lights in front of you all right Clemence Ohio like you you go around the outer belt in like an hour yeah yeah you guys have terrible traffic it's like you're stuck in traffic for ten minutes

90:38yes that's exactly yeah yeah yeah I mean pretty bad now actually all that weed yeah all the weed man people just I was like what the is going on here with all this traffic this is we apparently I guess it's actually been growing for years like anyway but then when you go ski and that's a worse man you come back from a ski resort mm-hmm Sunday four or five o'clock dude it's like I just did it the other week and it took me three and a half hours for a one and a half hour drive that's crazy yeah yeah well Denver's just it's an amazing city because you're in you're in this cool city that's a real City a legit City and then right outside is the Rocky Mountains it's right there right there you drive an hour and you're in the Rocky Mountains I mean wilderness Jack elk screaming and bears running around so the city has that an hour outside the city you're in the mountains it is sunny - yeah you

91:35get all four seasons which I like and the people are cool as yeah people are cool this is one of the few places I would live outside of California oh I used to live area yeah I lived in Boulder yeah I'm not sure I would go Boulder but while I was in the mountains above Boulder Highway that was like 3,000 feet above Boulder I was 8,500 feet it's pretty interesting nice do you feel a difference man going up the stairs your time it's crazy did you adapt to it for three months my wife called ready yeah yeah my wife got pregnant and it's rough up there for women if they haven't adapted it's rough in Denver but then you go 3,000 feet up Denver it's real rough yeah go up there all the time yeah if you're a woman and you get pregnant up there it's like having the flu it's real bad and they have a really high instance of low birth weight and premature birth I did not

92:22know that yeah Denver does as well Denver has one of the highest rates in the country of premature births I did not know that that's fascinating you know yeah I was up at my friend's house out by édouard scoot a little bit past Vail there today and like you were talking about the elk and the Bears and stuff whoa I mean at nighttime he said usually you shine a flashlight out and you see the eyes of the mountain lions yes he's got dogs and stuff and they're just sitting there waiting he's got a fence now but he's like you just see their eyes there was one a story that I tweeted out today in California where some mountain lion was banging on this screen door or this glass door trying to get at this dog in California yeah they got pictures of this cat you don't want to mess with those guys yeah one of them ate my dog a Bears one thing already yeah I want to meet my dog in Gold Hill this

93:15mountain lion man right outside these people's house trying to get at that little dog yeah they took pictures of it yeah and it's killed a bunch of pets in the neighborhood apparently they have a real problem in California because they don't hunt them so they're not scared of people at all and and that's the problem with California right there against everything mm-hmm that I'm for you guys we it's ignorance based they have an idea of what a mount lion is and that these are these majestic creatures and they shouldn't be hunted and what they would like to do is eliminate all hunting and let nature sort it out on their own but yet they have grocery stores everywhere they were they have food that's murdered animals that are factory farmed it's the stupidest ever you're not gonna turn the whole state into vegetarians so this idea that you're not you're gonna eliminate hunting is so stupid

94:04it's like you would rather pee they're trying to do that trying to eliminate honey or the people that are the most radical wildlife activists would like to eventually eliminate hunting and have all these animals sorted out with themselves in a natural way but they're never gonna eliminate people eating meat 97% of the people in this country meet that so that's a real number so this idea that you're gonna somehow or another change those 97% based on the desires of the 3% which fluctuate back and forth by the way the 3% there's a lot of those 3% to fall off and they eventually for health reasons go back to eating meat or eat some animal products these fish animals are awesome I love the fact they're real I love that they're out there but if you think that it's ok to have tons of mountain lions I have a buddy who works at to hone ranch they got a trail camera over there over a pond

94:53they got photos of 16 different mountain lions visiting this pond yeah what this is all because in the 1990s they outlawed hunting them hmm it doesn't make they didn't do it for any rationale because a mountain lion as an apex predator it's an apex predator and that you can eat them and they're delicious they taste like pork yeah yeah my friend Steve shot one recently he said it was one of the most delicious meals he's ever had in his life to try it yeah they have delicious fat that you you cook them and cook it just like pork I never would have thought that I never thought family right yeah it's weird eating a cat but apparently they're delicious probably had before yeah well unknowingly but they're just to control the population to keep them yeah it's a good luck finding a deer in California just so you feel that like when you walk into the grocery store and you see the meat

95:42aisle like you to see animals sit in the you know I'm a because you see I mean the meat aisle is gigantic as big as this wall yeah and like when I see it I just see a bunch of animals oh yeah man like none of these were treated right raised right killed right and now they're packaged like there's some glorious amazing food well it's just soup it's too sanitized and sterilized it's weird and especially someone who's killed animals and quartered them up in the field and carried them away and cut him up and put him and wrapped them and vacuum seal them and put them in my freezer and then thawed him out and ate them like I've been there through the whole process so I look at the whole thing totally different now yeah the butcher section just I did that when I was like 10 years old yeah so you've been doing it forever yeah well I haven't hunted since I was like a

96:27teenager but but you have and you know it so yeah I just think maybe we used to raise chickens and like my dad would go kill a chicken for dinner like I was like my job sometimes so yeah same thing yeah especially when you know like you raised the animal too right you become kind of you know have some compassion for it yeah yeah I realize that chickens in particular I mean even way more so with cattle and pays like you realized pigs are very smart you know they're they're intelligent and look at the dog yeah yeah I mean I feel like I know that technically they're that smart right but the there's something different about dogs right yeah for whatever reason yeah there's something different about maybe maybe just my bias from what I've been taught from from the society or whatever yeah culturally right yeah yeah we have animals that we like better yeah yeah

97:18certainly yeah I mean I felt terrible like killing some of the pigs yeah I'd imagine yeah and then you eat them and you know person I mean I always thought the grocery store sausage and bacon tasted way better but I was like man that was sort of my excuses like man's done tasted good I'm not sure if I want to eat it but in my head I'm thinking like man I really feel bad for this guy I don't want to eat them yeah no I know what you mean man it's we have a weird disconnect with food in this country in particular and especially in this day and age when you have a majority the people eating meat and the majority people never seen the animal die and then get chopped up and turned into meat and then eat it it's there's always gonna be this weird disconnect and not you change that though boy I don't know I don't know if you can I just think it's one of the weird it's

98:05it's i don't think i think this society is an amazing thing well we've accomplished where you don't have to ever worried about food you can just go down the store right down the street here and get a steak and cook it and instantaneously you don't have to kill it you know i'm to dress it you know to do all these steps have been avoided you just give him a piece of paper that piece of paper gets you a steak it's just it's amazing you know you could go to a store down the corner over here and you can get gasoline some had to go to the Middle East pull oil out of the ground refine it put it in tanker trucks drive it across the country pump it into a hole in the ground you slice wipe a piece of plastic through this reader depleted you punch in your area code or your zip code whatever the it is was it your zip code even you put the nozzle in your tank you fill your tank up with gas this

99:00car that's designed by engineers in a way you would never be able to figure out on your own and you get to turn the key and drive this thing around but there's so many steps that have been taken to make our lives way more convenient you ain't have to do all that anymore you you know this thing in your hand you just push a button and some do show up for your door with food dude with a car and drives you anywhere you want to go yeah yeah he shows he shows up with the animal that's been slaughtered and cooked and cooked and sterilized and ba got worried about if it's healthy or not when I was in Cuba they had like I said the red meat is you know I don't know if it's illegal or just very hard to come by or whatever but so we went to sort of black market stand and I mean I got a picture of it I mean it's a table bigger than this table of just red meat sitting out there's

99:52flies on it and but people are just like there yes I want some you know it's all the different cuts and everything not yet cut up just terribly right right Wow yeah we're lucky as man and this is the easiest time ever to be alive yeah really is yeah at least in America yeah at least in America maybe not in some places no I think that's why it's good to visit other places man just to just to get a look around and see what it's like that's one of my the reasons I want to go to Thailand like I want to go there and train but only so much I mean there's like I think that so much of the the Thai skill training is already in America that it's not gonna you might get some details or whatever over there but they're they're also so traditional and so far behind us in terms of you know at least in strength conditioning and in proper ways of training and things I guess that I don't know how

100:43beneficial that is but I want to go over there and see how they live and eat spiders and you know these insects and most people are ultra poor over there and you know but you know they're all they're really Buddhists right and then I guess they kind of you know they drop their kids off at the freakin Thai camp and just leave like yeah you know it's very strange to us yeah yeah I find it fascinating yeah I do too I find it incredibly fascinating you know I talked to John Wayne Park quite a bit about his experiences over there he went over there when he was really young and lived over there and lived in Thai camps live like a Thai mmm credible stories you know and so it's just a very unique culture it just it helps you appreciate where you live and puts things into perspective mmm yeah and there and uh what's a Japan you've been there I'm sure yeah been in

101:34Japan fascinating fascinated out me being in a foreign land there's also like on another planet people standing in line to the subway Dan on the subway train yeah yeah I was there before it we did like a military tour and I was I think a Todd Duffee was there and was a CB Dollaway maybe but yeah you could see Todd from over top of the crowd like a mile away right yeah hilarious yeah it's interesting how polite they are over there so play yeah yeah it's like there's so much order in disciplines it's just completely fascinating I remember him on the subway trainer this standing in line yeah I just want to walk to this photo hi guys you probably could've done and then we did another one in Iraq or Middle East Iraq was one of the places or did we I can remember but the Middle East and then those people will they will shove you right out of the way mm-hmm right like you know you funneling in

102:34through the airport or something right there the rudest people ever when it comes to you know standing in line yeah you don't talk about right mm-hmm yeah it's ridiculous I mean it you know you say something to him I don't speak English well I don't I don't speak you're how many different countries have you fought in only only two yeah have fought in the UK is it a big transition going over there like the weight cuts got to be harder and the the right food when I fought over there the way kill wasn't a bad finding the right food was terrible he said you've been on a ketogenic diet we were talking before the Milan cats for the last what three years about three years yeah it was after I Father Johnny Hendrix actually and I suffered a concussion and that was what originally got me on to the idea of viewing ketogenic diet and then I fought Robbie Lawler next and why

103:34did the concussion get you on the idea of having well it's good for TBI and concussion I mean that's the theory at least I don't think they have a lot of proof that I know they had that doesn't research on mice but not necessarily hoomans but they know when you changed your diet in what sense like initially was there a struggle oh yeah the first couple weeks is terrible that keto flu thing yeah I had it really bad but I didn't do it after the hitters fight but I started reading about it then and then when I fought Lawler I missed wait I think I have found or something that was the only time I've ever missed weight in my life I did everything exactly like I'd done a hundred times before me and my coach Tom berry oh Westside barbell we had everything planned out we had a notebook of you know this is what we eat this day this day today and this day and this

104:19moment and everything's planned out we did everything exactly the same ended up you know still missing weight and that was when I realized my metabolism had changed so I started looking more and more into different types of diets so I've always been my own guinea pig that's sort of a blessing and a curse for my well that's why you know want to be a coach because I've I think I'll make it ten times better coach than I was a fighter because I have experiment on myself I that's why I have all these books and everything and the problem with that right is it you know you get a bad info too or you misinterpreted misunderstanding and maybe it's for regular people and I'm a high level athlete etc etc so anyway I used it for one for the concussion and to sort of a metabolic shift into more fats and I have a Mis way since so did you feel any benefit of switching to ketogenic diet

105:13in terms of performance you know I actually felt a lack of benefit actually so some of the max capacity lowered immediately so my PRS went down over to come back up yeah they came back up yeah so how long when did they go down like how right away like within yeah within the first week or two I mean there's a few months to really truly adapt yeah exactly yeah and what I've done now over time is I've adapted the diet - you know allotted I do a lot of different things now so I'm not as ketogenic as I once was where it was all keyed okey dokey now I don't even pay attention to my ketone so I take that ketone ester like we took earlier I take that a lot which I love and you probably feel it right yeah like it's amazing it tastes like sucking on gods okay it does yeah yeah it's too terrible but I use that and then I use a you know regular keto salt supplements mm-hmm but

106:10that one you know for performance actually brings my performance up higher then then I would usually go take that ketone Esther before you train yeah so how long before you train so I take it with some glucose usually about 20 minutes before train and you use those glucose packets yeah who makes those packets just whatever at the grocery store power more or whatever you know it doesn't matter sugar yeah you just had to make sure you have some sugar because of the hypoglycemic effects I don't drop your blood sugar because that's so potent it's very very potent like our ketones are probably in the three like I should have my blood meter maybe check but probably in the three to five millimole range right now but yeah so you know I do that and then but now I've adjusted it where I'm not as concerned with staying in ketosis because the main concern with that is I want to get the

106:58benefits for the brain and you know the TBI and things like that now it's a when I get closer to a fight it's more about performance right so I'll add in some I use like a you can't starch I use like sweet potato so you know certain starches that don't really affect your ketone levels quite as much so that can bring my performance up a lot better well I think there's a real issue with high level athletes with the amount of work output that you put in that you probably need more carbohydrates in the regular person that's on a ketogenic diet Ben I again on my own guinea pig right now experiment with that and I've been man I've been kind of torn with that right so one of the things that that are a lot of people kind of promulgate is that our sport is very anaerobic and it's really not it's a lot more aerobic and your aerobic capacity will go up on keto your robic your my ability to recover

107:55specifically without even with no carbs my blood glucose could be a 70s and 80s and not have carbs for weeks at a time and my ability to recover goes up tremendously like we're talking about tendonitis my tendonitis goes away my injuries my joints just feel better I feel better all the way around my brain feels better and a lot of things like that but the the but when you do need to kick in that mass capacity and aerobic part of things that's where you know things suffer a little suffer yeah and that's where you have to add in the carbs and and but again you know the the amount of training that I do I mean I can add in a lot of carbs and I can still get away with it and say and I can even stay in ketosis if if I want to but I think a lot of people will make the mistake that I made originally again is my own guinea pig and and I really focused on the blood ketone levels

108:47rather than the performance and I wanted to be able to perform with high ketogenic levels or you know high ketone levels in my blood and it's not really necessary right like this should be solely performance based yeah but it did it did help me cut weight though I thought it was fascinating with been Greenfeld was saying we were talking about it before the podcast about how he would carb up and then take ketone supplements so he had the benefit of having a lot of carbohydrates in his system but also having a lot of ketones in his system and he said he felt like a animal yeah and that's yeah pretty similar to by how we feel right now and that's totally doable yeah yeah I mean that's not and I tell you like when I take it it does amazing things for me men I've saw I've heard stories of people when they take this ester that they'll pull out moves like they haven't done in ten years

109:38like they recalls these moves I've done things where I when I do it I feel like I'm five six years younger I mean it's done some fascinating things just taking that drink just taking the ester with some some get diggin out of trash pulling it out here yeah ketone aid yeah ketone aid ketone ester yeah it looks like you're a scientist like this bad type okay the thing with it it's extremely expensive and they're working on getting the it's it's like burnt rubber they're working on getting the not other cost down are they staying and how much of these things I'm not sure but I think it's like $30 a gram and that's like 40 grams I think that's incredible I could be off on that I'm not sure but that's quite pricey I I heard that the UK cycling team used it they paid like $6,000 for you know however much just a small amount and they used it for the when they won the

110:39Tour de France actually that's what I heard I don't not sure it is but I believe it I mean this does amazing things for you but yeah so the the keto I mean again it can be used if used properly I think he can do a lot of benefits I would recommend to all combat athletes NFL players over you know they've taken concussions taking hits to the brain or that are over a certain age where your metabolism changes I mean that's where my biggest benefit was and even a TJ was talking - hey TJ Dillashaw I was talking with him about his coach I had him switch over because he was burning primarily carbohydrates especially now TJ's gonna try to make 125 yeah and I don't know if he was talking to me about long before that was ever talked about so mm-hmm but you know he did some tests on him and found that he's burning all carbohydrate all the time which can be an issue yeah in long training sessions

111:33specifically so he switched it up a bit yeah and I don't think he's going full keto but I think he's doing something similar to like what I'm doing where the he's doing keto with you know some carbohydrates still and he's using the so basically like the only carbohydrates that we need as an athlete is for the workout right we don't need them after that you know maybe for recovery which is again I think it's debatable but you know carbohydrate is not a necessary substance even live you know you could live your entire life without you know carbohydrate and be perfectly fine yeah there's a lot of guys that are doing this carnivore diet now I've heard of this yeah Marc Bell told me he's never felt better he's doing that now yeah yeah he's not a steak this is de called a no sausage or bacon he's bacon too but it's mostly meat he's eaten mostly meat mostly me so with no

112:24vegetables a little bit every now and then but most of what he's eating is just meats yeah I feel completely different when I load up my vegetables even a day or two I mean I don't know do you feel this and I feel better yeah I'm a big family thing I just I love drinking it too you know I loved getting like real rich green leafy vegetable juice mmm and I drink a lot of kale shakes well I'll take a goddamn bushel of kale that you're never gonna sit down and eat you never need that much kale I'll blend that up with a giant chunk of ginger and garlic I'll throw an apple in there and a bunch of coconut oil and I'll throw some celery in there and I'll drink it and it's oh I think I've seen that on YouTube you put like a pear in there to it yeah maybe a pear maybe now except sometimes I put peaches or pineapple in there too you put the whole thing in with the seeds and everything

113:15yeah throw that in and see them write it up and just it's all performance it doesn't taste good tastes like people try to drink it like oh I can't dude I gotta try this but dude I drink it and I feel like a gorilla how much garlic you put in a lot like four or five cloves that's it's rough I just eat it close now yeah I do that too I need a lot of cloves work burns when it's going down yikes but you could feel it within like an hour to your dam there's something in there man especially if I'm feeling anything like I'm feeling a little sick and feeling funky like I'm kind of feeling a little worn down maybe it's going around I'll just chomp on some garlic you ever tried chaga root no I do this I did it well I've only done at one time when I was sick my whole family got sick kids you've been there right you know kids are miserable all of us are laying down like we're laying around

114:08like we're in the hospital you know every couple seconds York off and we're just laying there miserable and I was the only one that did the chaga rude I put it in a crock pot put you know the tin my little chunks in there and I was the only one that didn't get sick or didn't stay sick very long I stayed sick for like a day huh - Chicago root yeah and what's supposed to be the benefit of this stuff man I don't want a butcher this yeah I can't I mean it's an immune system enhancer it's I could I heard it from my friend who's a survivalist specialist expert huh and like he teaches the these classes you know where you go out and live off the land and things like that right and you know he gets it from like Maine or Canada and it's like this fungus that grows on trees and it's really really hard and they chop it off and then you can you grind it up put it in the tea or

114:58something and huh supposedly you know it's really good for your mutant system how does it make you feel I don't feel anything I'm feeling any difference at all I mean I'm sitting there drinking I like here's some I'm drink anyway you know I'll try it yeah my guy told me so you know and that's obviously it's very antidotal and it was like right but one instance and I just I just got sick a couple weeks ago and I completely forgot about how sick for like two weeks but you know you had a pretty significant back injury at one point I heard a desk yeah how did you fix that I guess it's never really fixed fixed right I got a epidural steroid injection first because I wanted to make the fighters what I'm supposed to fight con it the first time it's like two weeks out of the fight and does it what is epidural steroid does it relax the area and loosen the inflammation a

115:47corticosteroid right yes so it gets rid of inflammation it took mine we did it on a Friday this was like two weeks out of the fight so what had happened is about four weeks out of the fight is when I originally heard it and you know I'm Michael suck it up and do I think you said you herniated disc so you know it feels like right now yeah I'm gonna suck this up and I'm gonna get through it and you know I couldn't do anything you barely even had pads right well I eventually ended up you know going to a well actually so this is part of my problem with chiropractors right so I went to a chiropractor first and he's like oh yeah you know and is all you know all this kind of garbage anyway I was seeing a pain specialist and he knew what it was within 30 seconds yeah anyway so I got that bad oral steroid and it didn't work right away so I had to give a second one later

116:39so yeah the second time that's the issue right is it masks the issue yes I think it reduces some of the information so some of the problems of it yeah so that's it I mean hidden he told me that he said you know look we're gonna get you to the fight this is the best way to get you to the fight right but it didn't work well enough the first time so I end up getting a second one and it worked very well the second time but then of course as you know having a herniated disc it just took years to correct it you know and I mean I work on all the time now if I if I don't keep on it then I will feel the effect out feel the issues right yeah especially in jujitsu right as a worse time your lower back yeah yes l5 out there did you use Lewis Simmons reverse hyper to use that machine that effort yeah yeah of course I do tons of the reverse hyper all the time I mean I have a whole routine that I do

117:37pretty much after pretty much every workout just to strengthen you back yep far back and hips a lot of my personal problem was my hip mobility and so I do the hips abs obliques my so as gets real tight so I have to lay on a kettlebell doing that thing you know my hip flexors but you know I start working with this strength conditioning coach now the men you know he does well he works wonders for me now you have your own line of and you sent us a bunch of I sent out some cool hammers and and you got wheelbarrows and a bunch of different things what was your thought process behind what was the name of the company in mortal combat equipment ice and there's it on online The Mortal Kombat my website immortal comic equipment co that's and then it's on Westside barbell we sell on there distribute to them in elite FTEs calm and basically the way that whole started was we go oh there we go

118:41nice here the way that whole started the whole thing started was with the the wheelbarrows Louis had a wheelbarrow that we was using all the time he's used for probably 20 years and we I was like men I you know I could build that thing's a piece of junk he's been around here like 20 years is falling apart and well I said you know let me build one and we built one one person asked me to build one for him is okay cool and then another person asked me to build one for him and then I said oh maybe I should just start making these and I'd had the ideas for the so I talked to a engineer and we just started manufacturing them and you know just it's sort of like an aside project thing for Mesa something I want to get into post-fight career you know there's a few things I want to do you know for one strength conditioning coaching martial arts coaching you know

119:32do some stuff with muscle Pharm and you know I want to you know be able to sell my equipment right the hammers I thought up for a long time I'm not like you guys do the maces you know these are different than the maces that they're actually sledgehammer right I'm sure if if you swing a sledgehammer it just doesn't make sense that you got a Home Depot you buy shit-ass 16 pound 20-pound sledge hammer are start at 15 pounds off pot make it 10 pound at some point maybe an eighth or seven or something and you know they're usually they're square there it doesn't make any sense right so we just made it specifically for swinging for training training FanDuel yeah good fat handling and you see also it has a ball in the end in case it slips out so it keeps it in your hand and it never made sense to me that I would see a 200-pound man 125 pound woman buzz swinging the same

120:19sledgehammer especially these two hundred pound men that you know like me like yeah I swing that 30 35 pound sledge hammer which you got tries just insanely hard but you have to have a right technique and everything but you know I swing that for my workout and for different I mean there's different things depending on are you gonna expand your line because you got absolutely just the right now you got the sledges in the world and the grit balls now the grit balls they would you put them on the like carabiner or something like that and do checks with it yeah connect it to anything actually if you see on that video who would connected to the wheelbarrow and carry the wheelbarrow I love doing that tons of things I mean there's just a tons of options that's that when my kids little baby kettlebells they were doing pretty nice niceness I have some badass ideas man

121:08we're going to build some really really cool stuff you know I don't know I I guess I could just say oh I don't really care I mean you know like one that you use the belt squat before right yeah I'm working on prototyping one right now I have actually about 10 prototypes I just haven't had the time energy to focus I kind of like almost don't want it to grow too fast because like I'm still fighting is something I want to work on after fighting and but basically do a belt squat that you can walk with so it's just gonna have wheels and you just walk around any with it and you could sort of you know even like you know clinch up someone away which I mean you can do it tons of things like that with the west side belt school I already half and there is other belt squats that can do similar things but they're the west side one they were telling me you could

121:51hit pads with it first you have somebody on the platform which I do which I do love that thing just the way it loads up your hips like that and what one of the things I think you probably really like we're gonna build and they have one at Westside you may have seen it when you went there the forced treadmill yes that's just the one at Westside I mean it's just a basic treadmill like if you buy one off like would weigh or whatever they're like 3,000 4,000 I think even like five or six thousand dollars imma build one you could sell for like five six hundred bucks you know like you just put it in your garage whatever like you don't need to buy a $5,000 would--we treadmill right why did you decide to start out with hammers and wheelbarrows well the hammers I wanted for myself is that something you use all the time absolutely it's not probably my favorite

122:36exercise I mean every exercise is a tool alright you know you don't use a socket wrench on screw right so you know we have a there's a million different exercises that we do for MMA everybody asked me what do you do like you name it I'll probably do it right my favorite hammers are probably my favorite thing though if there's if I just had to pick one thing and say this is what you need to do I mean the dynamic strength that builds is insane the explosiveness the core strength the shoulder strength the grips did you start doing this four or five years ago cuz I remember you know back in the day George Foreman used to chop wood I remember thinking like Marciano yeah I was like why they chopping wood my son it was legendary for doing it yeah are not legend Arabi's legend a for other things right he did a lot yeah so we actually built a 45 and a 50 pound

123:26hammer too which became a really good door stopper yeah so we've maxed out it we stopped at 35 but if anybody ever would want one we can get one of those of Francis I know right I'd like to see him do it yeah yeah I mean if you just think about the way of it you know the hammer swings and everything I mean there's a lot of different ways you can do it there's a lot of different exercises you can do with them I mean they're just I think their most amazing tool there is for frame and make I've never used one really yeah like a Home Depot sledgehammer no no no build your endurance up right away but one thing that I love about the endurance part of it is you'll sit there and swing it and like your body's gonna like when your body gets so tired as long as you have decent techniques your body will get so tired you can still keep going though like is it's a lot of momentum you know

124:21what I mean but you can keep going with the momentum right so no matter how tired you are now you sent me some so I'll start doing it here and what size tire should I get tractor time yeah yeah just tractor tire what do you get one of those I know I just go to the you could use a regular tire whatever like I go to like the you get for free usually they'll give them to you cuz they just burn them okay you know they have to like dispose it like a tire shop yeah junk tire shop yeah good tire shop give me a big-ass tire yeah that's what I do and I mean sometimes like they they might give you like a regular tire also you know you just like bolt it together so you know drill a hole and bolt two of them together and you got it right you do that way too but is that would you put stack them guy that's what uh if I've had to do that before where the tire shop wouldn't didn't have a big

125:11tractor tire and I just get sick of looking for one sometimes are hard to find like farmers will have them I don't know about California they could be completely different out here so you know I mean you can buy like off rogue or whatever they have the things that you hit with the hammers you know really broke down something other than a tire yeah they have an actual so that if you ever seen the cross for games like they do the the game I don't know game whatever it is CrossFit competition thing that's like a big piece of rubber and then and they have to move it from like one side to the other like ten yards or sometime you have to hit it with the hammer yeah and said but their hammers so it's like rogue makes a hammer they're just so it's like a big hunk of rubber yeah yeah those are great okay so like rogue makes a hammer right that's adjustable weight too but there's you unbolt it and

125:56pour bb's into it oh my this ridiculous right who's actually gonna do that and then I'm bb's everywhere all this country so that's why you know I was like you know I go to West Side I have a Dave Hoff is there three hundred you know the strongest man in history I'm like if he's gonna swing a hammer it's not gonna be a sixteen pound hammer he'll do that with his you know one-handed right so you know so I wanted to build something anybody could use and then the wheelbarrow you know we had to put where it can hold I've had over a thousand pounds on it at Westside Jesus you know I can't lift a thousand pounds on it but we can put over thousand pounds on there we have different handles so that's what I changed so when Louise was just one handle right so we have D handles so I've seen grip it like this do like a clean pressed yeah we have like a turn it's like a prowler you know so it's got

126:46handles coming up things like that and just do laps with it you just do laps I mean it actually you use like a prowler you can do cleans overhead presses I mean there's a million different things you can do with it so when you're slamming when you doing a hammer workout you're slam at a tire like where are you feeling it most your back your legs you know everywhere yeah usually not the leg so much you know the that's more just you just kind of stabilizing with your legs but a lot of times depends on your weakness - right some people feel more in the shoulders I usually feel more my grip mmm because but there's a few different ways you can do it too so like if I want to feel it more in my grip I'll do a slam where ice try to stop it okay right so you know very end at the very end as soon as it hits because the tire is going to bounce it back and I'll try to

127:31stop it but a lot of times I'll fill it more in the core right and sometimes to do like you know over the head like this boom you bring it down that way to feel way more in the core you ever try to swing it sideways yeah I'm not a quite as fond on that I just it gets a little dangerous and Ryan I think you kind of which I personally I would do it like I wouldn't recommend other people do unless they've been swinging hammers for a while right I remember I've just seen people do stupid things now what other kind of do you do for strength conditioning you name it that's supposed to say you know I mean we follow the Westside conjugate system so it's really you know things change all the time I mean you know depends on his general specific so I always add in a third one there's you know there's GPP general physical preparation there's SBP which is specific physical preparation and

128:21then I add in personally my own which is RSP P which is what I call like the Hammers like the will barrel would be more the war I've caught the war wagon is more general right so it's just gonna build general strength he's gonna bring your endurance up your max capacity up things like that the you know getting on the mats and you know doing 20 double legs that's SVP like very specific right the something like a hammer or maybe a lot of band type stuff like maybe shooting double legs with a band on or something I call that RSVP which is like replicated specific physical preparation some you know I could break down all three of these and just go on forever I mean with when you're in the GPP you're gonna again like build up here max capacity you're gonna build up your strength you want to build it up your bone density your ligament strength your tendon strength you of course like any

129:11weaknesses I'm big on the neck back and posterior chain right though they say the Front's for show the back to forego so we use the iron neck oh yeah yep we use it all the time I love that yeah I love that thing there's nothing amazing genius invention I know I think it's really uncomfortable but yeah yeah yeah I said I like it I don't like I want at home too to be honest I think glitching does more than anything else men for next strengths like I'm right my neck just gets more sword doing that anything else oh sure yeah that's used in my friends at Westside they do a lot where they'll put a band on the war wagon and then carry it at the same time oh wow let's pull on the neck while you're you have to walk this like a very dynamic workout at the same time so your grips giving out your traps start giving out what kind of harness so they're putting on their head just like you know

130:04the leather is next yeah and you're just with a chain and then my band and say you're having to hold this while you're walking makes it much more dynamic so I like that they come up with some crazy there yeah yeah go to the iron neck Instagram page they do a lot of crazy with the iron neck on like a lot of medicine ball a lot of slams while you're you know you pulled back so you're on full full resistance with the band you're moving your head and you're rotating slamming the ball look at slice things almost hard to check that out I've never checked out their Instagram but I try to stay off Instagram personally but why do you do that man for one Instagram to me is the most mindless thing in the world right looking at these pictures and half the time you don't read the breakdown the cache yeah so to me it's it's really social medias first off is pretty dumb down like read

131:02a book right and then you now you have something that's not even you know I've been writing like it's just pictures like you know like the people that are like don't it's a book how many pictures well I'm not going to read it I'm you know so to me and and I also I'm a big believer that the in you know what goes in your brain in your mind what you let in it needs to be very controlled you need to be very specific in careful about what you let in man you never know what you're going to come across on there so it could be something toxic that it could be bad right especially if you're reading comments right absolutely yeah it gets way worse yeah which and you know I use it I mean I'm on there a lot but you know I use it I like to I remember back in the day when I was coming up and you know I I would dream of talking to a UFC fighter right so I use it to interact with my

131:55fans right because I want to give some kids that experience right I think it's a very powerful tool for that oh yeah that's that's a powerful thing for a young guy coming up you know to be able to talk to Matt Brown and you actually respond to him and say good luck you like holy yeah I mean I probably do it maybe even more than I should like I mean I I answered like complete questions sometimes you know like people ask me that the wildest questions you know and my god I'll give them complete responses but and I find that 90% of the time like oh cool man glad you responded and then they forget about it most likely right yeah and then but you know if I can touch just a few people man I mean that's really what the the whole things about do you have a youtube channel no but I probably will that's maybe a good move for you because you've got so much information your head like

132:43but just talking to you before the podcast your rattling off these different training modalities and different recovery methods and techniques and like that Browns got a lot of information in his head yeah I'm not dumb I might be a savage but I mean anyhow people think those things are mutually exclusive absolutely yeah like if you're if you're a savage you got to be stupid absolutely and my thing is my savageness I approach all things with that savage intent right so when I like if I'm into a book like I'm reading a badass book right now and what is it anti fragile what is that I'm trying to remember the name of the author but it's on my Kindle and so if you think of the that there's no turn there's no definition of fragility or anti fragile right so he came up with this term he wrote the book the Black Swan also and now seem Nicolas oh I've heard of

133:43that guy he has a very interesting way of writing and some he really digs deep into this concept of antifragility where it's not necessarily robustness or things like is god I hate it because I hate trying to read spike as I butcher I feel like I don't give it justice but you know I'm only like halfway through the book but I said I've really attacked it like with that savage sort of a mindset right but it's a very very long book well it's basically you know like hit like you know he makes the case that a fragility is you know good right and it creates anti fragility he makes the case anti fragility is good right and not necessarily I say I feel like I'm just butchering it man just read the book when he says about when you're saying fragility do you mean fragility in terms of your mindset in terms of just internal so he's an economic guy uh-huh so he's really I think he I think what

134:47he's getting at get him only have like halfway through the book but I think really what he's getting at is more economic and political it's kind of his long-term thing but he uses a lot of examples and basically from what I've gathered so far it's basically like how stress induces a stress response which which induces strength and which is the closest thing I would say is to anti fragility is strength right and how it's our fragility would make the world a better place more or less and so as a response to stress like training exactly yeah and I mean he even uses out an example you know how we tear our muscles down to build them up that's our entire purpose yeah yeah so that's again I'm only halfway through man I don't want a butcher you know a great book but I said I I mean it's a long long very long book and it's sort of he kind of digs into all these different

135:41subjects on it even though it's really like he could probably sum it up in about a quarter of the book but you know just say I just attack it like that man I just you know like Prince is super training you know this book right I've heard of it I haven't read it though well it's the most probably the most difficult to read book I've ever read and I've read it probably four or five times now what's so difficult about it it's just ultra ultra scientific and it's written by Mel SIF and verkhoshansky who is the inventor of plyometrics or the the fountain biometrics in the Russians and Mel SIF is a biomechanical engineer and the two of them came together and you know this super training is basically like the Bible of straight the conditioning books all together it's the original strength conditioning book I mean there's also like science and practice of strength

136:35training there's a science of sports training there's a lot of really good books but super training is like that just a pioneer the premier book right and it's all very very scientific and a lot of the times man I don't have to read a same paragraph like four times you know and I've read the book like four Thompson and I still I'm going through the paragraph like what the man what is it son of a so anyway so like the other points like I just attack it like a right you know and I think there's other things I think a lot of people again like it's all about inspiring others right and I think a lot of people could learn a lot from that and that's what I try to do in my fights I try to inspire people I want my kids to be that way I want I want I think it could bring the world up that way man people find something they want and it's actually like a goddamn savage well when

137:26people see someone that does really go for it it does inspire them to go for it too they see the excitement in it and they see the response that other people have to that excitement and it just it just makes them want to up their own life performance in a lot of various ways you know not just in fighting but they might want to up their performance from watching you fight in whatever the they're doing in life and that's to me that means more than anything else that's what a lot of people talk about the meaning of life I think I got to figure it out I mean I think the meaning of life is to give I think that's if you look in nature I know your big nature buff I mean that's what everything exists in nature to do that's what's what a tree grows fruit to give more fruit right this is the natural process of the world and humans the human animal has become too analytical to figure that out right

138:17we think the meaning of life is all these other things because we think about other things but really are our entire purpose is to give I think there's a lot of purposes in life but I think that is one of them for sure I think giving is that definitely it gives you a sense of meaning and when you help other people you feel better you know that's one thing that I think people are missing out on they think that it should be all about themselves and I'm just about succeeding and getting by my own well even what you just said you know gives you a sense of meaning yeah or make sure you feel better yeah so you brought it back to yourself right right and that's that's what I figure that's human nature and that's easy but I try to get past that word where it's not about me it's not about how I feel about it it's about just giving you know I'm completely selfless

139:09that's a great way to look at it the way I describe it that way though is to enlighten people to this idea that I think Peter not allowing people but just express my own perspective that I think people spend too much time thinking about what benefits them and that they don't recognize that the more you benefit other people that is really what benefits not just those other people but you as well and that they think of like helping people I can't be good to help people but that's gonna me up because I then I'm gonna spend less time on my own self but it's not really the case you actually enhance your own experience in life by helping other people as we were talking about before the podcast right the abundance mentality yes and that is specifically the abundance mentality ya know I'm a gigantic believer in generosity in abundance mentality and I'm a ferocious opponent of famine thinking I

140:11think that famine mentality it people up so hard you get closed up you get you know culture protective you get ultra I just think that's a terrible way to live your life and you live and let your life with fear and the hard part is implementing it right mm-hmm like I can see a table out all day like I don't give enough to yeah you know I mean I don't give enough away that's for sure I thought about sometimes I think about the crazy sometimes and I was I like I think the ultimate like coolest thing in life so I have to have money like for my kids unfortunately right not unfortunate but right necessity yeah a necessity like that's what the money is about I feel like if I didn't have kids I would just give literally every dime away start from bottom and see how many times because you know so there's like certain qualities and people that they're gonna succeed no matter what

141:02right mm-hmm and I want to see like if I have those qualities right so I want to give everything away right now you definitely do listen man you can do whatever the you want in this life but I feel like a guy like you in particular especially right now when you're on this this fighting journey and you're still on it I think what you give the most is through the best possible performance that you give and when you have these wild crazy performances like the Diego Sanchez fight that inspires the out of people I mean how many people watch that fighting and just wanted to go run mountains and just getting crazy it's just man that's cool you bring that up cuz I mean I never even thought of it that way like I always see it again I always bring it back to myself and I see it as an expression of my own art you're myself yeah you're you're you're not just an athlete you're not just a fighter but

141:53you're also a public performer and an inspirational figure and when you are doing your best that gives a lot to people means this how many people have watched great athletic performances and it's given them the fuel and the inspiration and do great things in their own life but at school he said yeah cuz man I might inspire me to fight a little longer you know that was supposed to be your swan song yeah what what was it just too sweet no no no it was it had nothing to do with the performance actually this year so I think when we started the podcast I was talking about the why and the how little bit right and this is where I think I got a little confused was I think I mean for one I was I was questioning a lot of things I got knocked out by cowboy viciously the worst I've never been knocked out of my life I mean and it wasn't too long after I just got dropped hard by elenberg

142:49which was the first time my life had ever been dropped in sparring or anything I never been dropped so I started just kind of questioning you know what what am i doing okay well how and the first thing I went through was how do I not make it happen again so that gets very exhausting when you just like how how how right right and I think through the Diego camp because again I announced retirement long you know very early in the camp like twelve weeks out or something like that through the camp up men everything went so well I pocus more on my own mind and and a lot of these things were talking about and I started getting back into the Y and I started bringing a lot more clarity to that side of things now I know why I'm doing what I'm doing I feel much more comfortable and now it doesn't matter on the performance anymore now it's about truly going out there and performing the

143:42best that I can and then the second part of the whole thing is you know I was very scared of retirement I was very very nervous to be thinking like what am I going to do you know like how am I gonna feed my my kids and fortunately now you know I I was able to I realized once I announced it and then after the fight I mean just a plethora of opportunities and MusclePharm spot been my best opportunity and that's why you know I bring them up a lot you know because they've helped me so much and and I think we're gonna do amazing things there whether I retire or not and I think it's gonna be a big beautiful thing what do you do for them specifically so I'm kind of tasked with building the fight team and bringing the athletes and and communicating with athletes and you know just making it a solid program there whether I'm the coach or not it does even matter but you

144:44know I want to make a great program and sure that you know the facilities being used properly and bringing different athletes and that would be kind of the first step and then beyond that I mean the opportunities are endless I can do a lot of different things with it so what was the thought process that was it immediately after the Diego Sanchez fight because I talk to you in Denver when when you came to my show with the Belko I called you up we were talking and you said I'm not really sure I'm done and I was like what's going well that was so I don't remember the exact date of that but that was probably you know you know I said the retirement and then again like the camp just started going amazing and again the Y came back man like I knew why I was doing what I was doing like I was enjoying my time at the gym again when weren't you enjoying it there's been a lot of times I mean

145:32what do you think you know my man I've been around and I've had a lot of different coaches and that's my that's my biggest if I had a regret in my career said I wasn't as loyal to one sort of system as I should have been and I have a turn port now called the unicorn fallacy where are you constantly chasing the Unicorn that doesn't exist right um or some people I've heard other people call like the greener grass syndrome you know the grass isn't always greener on the other side right and that would if I had a complaint about myself or if you want to call it a regret like that's my problem like I was like dude I just I just need to go over here and I'll get better because I'm always searching that how right not forgot the why so you know so again you know this is I think a lot of fighters probably also go through this where we're I mean it's hard what we do there's a lot of

146:22pressure on her shoulders there's a lot of especially with a family I got three kids you know it's like I mean I got knocked out in front of my three kids like they were at the fight you know I mean like I had a I think they were I don't even remember because I was knocked out you know like I don't remember anything until I was waking up at the hospital you know and Dwayne is sitting there you know I mean so like I mean looking back I don't even remember all this stuff and it's funny because I've seen videos like you know raising cowboy saying like I don't even remember seeing that like I'm somebody told me that you know we were talking backstage I seen a video I should say talking about I don't remember not right so things like that you know makes you start questioning like do this like is this worth it right right I mean you know and just a lot of internal

147:10struggles right and again you know the camp I had with Diego and everything just all the pieces fell into place and I was like dude if I can do this every time like I could do this for a long time and I could smash a lot of people so that's where you're at right now yeah so you were reinvigorated reinvigorated that's interesting so this long career so many great fights and you still you're still like finings be honest I think I'm hungrier than ever was man I was like because of like a lot of stuff we're talking about today is just wasn't clear you know I mean it was just a scatterbrain like again it was all about the how I was I think I was like a kind of hyper focused on that like how do I get stronger how do I get faster how do I throw a better punch how do i you know analyze this guy and how do I beat him and you know it's just constant how and then you forget like why are you

148:02doing this anyway right you know some and then I mean it I said it's just a it's not an easy sport anyway I mean it's probably the hardest sport existed I don't think there's anything harder yeah I can't imagine what's harder other than actual war yeah right I mean maybe police officer firemen actual war mmm trauma surgeon even then I'm you know I mean it's harder in different ways yeah harder in different ways yeah it's one of the most pressure-filled athletic opportunities that a person can ever be involved in yeah and now what sorry good cause it's a you know the the hard thing is this is all I've done I've I got I'm all in you know from the beginning like I never gave myself an out and I think that's important to do also a lot of the guys that have outs I mean I watched Shark Tank all the time and you see you know these guys if they haven't out yeah the you know kevin

148:55O'Leary whatever is I like you know you I mean it's like this rich kids don't grow up to be world championship fighters except for BJ Penn yeah he's just a animal but yeah he grew up in Hawaii Hawaii's a different place like you're stuck on an island with a bunch of who want to kick your ass such it steward dying who why is an underappreciated place for tough you know I've to go there my wife won't see you never been I'll only there once I'd lived there I was doing like Waikiki the whole time I'd live on the Big Island yeah yeah I live there yeah you would get our island we'll call it island sick no if I did I get a plane people are awesome there man it's just a different more relaxed more I don't know there's just more chill they say Costa Rica is the place to go Costa Rica is pretty badass they say it's a best place to retire yeah that's what I've heard

149:47cuz it's like $1,000 a month you can live well or something yeah Mel Gibson's got fat spread there he's telling me he's got like 500 acres down there nice that was a cool podcast with Mel Gibson he's an interesting cat yeah here's my impression of Mel Gibson just click in the bag he was he just kept clicking the pen and I didn't want to say anything I say stop clicking the pen mouth I was here I went to here like I kind of way to here you knew him a little bit it was like all the stem cell guy well he wanted to come on and talk about stem cells that's really what he wanted to talk about and so I honored that I said all right man you know that's what you want to talk about you take he's your biggest guest you ever had uh it's pretty famous James Hetfield he's pretty famous too I mean I don't know they're up there who else Alex Jones downloads Alex beat

150:42everybody by really fuckload yeah man it was interesting so here's my theory on Alex Jones just if you want to go there okay I love going there so I think he's a government plot he's not I tell you that for sure I've known him forever I've known Alex since 1998 he's not but good luck because she would tell everybody he's not hung out with that guy get high with him drunk with him he's a fun dude he is a guy who started out as a guy who is against the president he was against george w bush with w bush I don't even think he was praised running for president at the time right or was he when was it when did Bush become no Clinton was president yeah Clinton was president george w was the governor of texas and he was getting arrested for protesting against them protesting against the global ëletís and all these different things he had didn't really become a supporter

151:39of any form of government until Trump I mean Trump is like the first guy and he may or may not be getting played by Trump or you know Trump's his buddy and I mean Trump is a he's a slick guy in terms of how he cultivates influence is it an anomaly for sure he's an interesting character in a lot of ways I mean if it wasn't okay so shoot down my theater completely he's just a theory I'm not I don't promulgated it this Factory okay I've always thought the Alex Jones was was built by the government to make conspiracy theorists look like loons he didn't used to make them look like loons no no he was much more my started with 9/11 though right no no she was way before now but I'm sure with Waco but that's when he came to a prominence right like you because he was the first to know even before then man you know I mean when nobody cared about it before he was on AM radio before then right but

152:40he's been around forever I mean like I said I met him I'm right or wrong then I met him in 98 so it was several years before 2001 and he was doing the same back then nice I mean he's always been around doing that he's he's right about a lot of and that's what's so confusing like he is absolutely right about what they call agent provocateurs where the government will send in people if they have a peaceful protest it's very inconvenient for them like the WTO he did this whole video about how the WTO was that in Vancouver or Seattle where was the WTO I forget where it was why don't want if somewhere in the Pacific Northwest I'm confused but I'm not confused about the story so what happened was they had these peaceful protests against the World Trade Organization and it was very inconvenient he's all these world leaders were coming to this this area for this meeting and they sent in

153:31government agents that were dressed with blast black ski masks and government-issue boots and these people started smack windows and lighting things on fire they turned into a violent protest which enabled the police to close in and shut down the protest your WTO protests where did it say Alex Jones police state to to take over Seattle yeah was yeah no okay so they this it but this is a real tactic that governments and intelligence agencies use they have a peaceful protest and then they have these people like they these guys dressed in black ski masks they start tipping over newspapers test like it doesn't even make any sense like I've heard that they're they're government agents meanwhile the these guys have government-issued boots no it goes further so these guys all they all got together at the end and they were cordoned off into a building and then

154:25they were ultimately released they were never charged they were never arrested I mean the whole thing is incredibly fascinating and some of them have been identified as government agents and Alex a lot of way more into detail about it that's why uh you know I'm not a conspiracy theorist so to speak but the one thing I always say is I don't put anything past our government there's absolutely been conspiracies that are real for sure whether it's the Gulf of Tonkin incident yeah whether it's Operation Northwoods there's been and there's I'm sure there's been a bunch that we don't know about I believe that the government assassin or somebody assassinated JFK I don't think it was Lee Harvey Oswald I'm alone I think it's very possible Lee Harvey Oswald was a part of it but I know too much about bullets to think that that bullet went through two people and wound up on Connolly's

155:16gurney in the hospital looking pristine cut the that's all I don't think that's real at all no I've seen this a pruder film and I've read several books on the story I just I think it's very convenient to lump all that into one guy with one bullet I think it's horseshit I think they probably killed him I always always look into a little bit and I'm like you know what the government I did this whatever they probably did a lot that we don't know about that you're not aware of yeah this is how governments work they've always worked with the intelligence agencies work the smart criminals go to politics the dumb criminals go to jail right there's a lot of that especially a lot of that I'm worried or you know the most criminally insane people in this world are attracted to politics I think what's gonna fix human beings and this is a radical idea but I really think the same

156:16thing that's gonna fix human beings is what is in a lot of ways disrupting the standards of our culture right now and that with the internet I think technology is gonna fix human beings because I think what technology is gonna do is eventually there's going to be a way to absolutely detect whether or not someone's telling the truth I think it's inevitable I think as we talk up a lot of people's can enhance most of our lives and I think like you and people like me who tell the truth mmm it's gonna be very good for you because I think there's I think when you lie it doesn't just up the person that you're lying to I think it you up I think it up discourse it up culture I think it up human beings it up our communities it's just it's a it's a an anomaly it's a thing that people have been able to figure out how to do or you've been able to say things that aren't accurate to

157:13convince someone of a reality that doesn't exist I guess where I think it gets hard those the politic politicians specifically are so good at not really lying but like crop you know they're right on that gray area hmm where they don't everybody lying to you but they're not that's but well that's also because you can lie so you like a guy like try who's been busted lying a million times it still is a notion probably every president wanted lying to I don't think he's unique it now that's well he's unique in his propensity for it I mean he loves it he's a good I mean he'd been lying forever but I think that without a doubt there's going to be a time in the future whether it's in our lifetime or after where they develop technology that's gonna absolutely allow you to detect whether or not someone's telling the truth that's intense yeah I think it's gonna be the future

158:05and I think when that happens people are just not gonna accept all the that we've accepted for so many years they could be an app on the phone I think it's probably gonna be something that you wear in your body I think we're real close to that I think we're real close to embedded chips that you wear in your body and I think those chips are probably going to interface wirelessly and you're just gonna be able to read thoughts and ideas that come from people that are gonna come and probably a new language I think we're gonna be able to develop a universal language I don't a lot of religious people say that's the mark of the beast right oh that's it's no like a birthmark or some gently what are the religious people thing like a chip I was raised in an ultra religious thing environment right my mom was it was extremely religious and I'm talking tongues they

158:54probably thought that no no they you know they're very fundamental you know my brother could go away deeper into what they were about I never even paid attention but but I remember them talking about like the mark of the beast and they're like it's going to be something implanted in you and you know if you take it then you're going to hell and if you don't take it you know or something like that and maybe there's planning ahead they want to keep lying you gotta keep that plan ahead these chips are certainly lying to me but I think there's gonna be a language a universal language they figure out how to teach the children that's starting with children because children learn languages very easily and if they develop a universal language that is somehow or another either translated through computers because you know they have a thing now these Google earbuds

159:45that you use with a pixel two phones so if you were talking to me in Spanish I would hear the translation what you said in English in my ears that's amazing when I saw that I was like how is nobody noticing that this is step one this is step one of a universal language yeah the translation like to English is fascinating but I think ultimately we're going to be able to figure out how to communicate with everybody with a new language and this new this is this not hard to do I mean it's obviously not easy but it's not impossible to develop a new language like a universal language that's accepted by everybody yeah yeah I used to I have a Brazilian friend that comes up to my house sometimes and we put the Google Translate thing just right in between us mm-hmm and you can talk and it detects which language and it says it and that crazy yeah that's crazy so it

160:37knows which leg you don't know who's talking mm-hmm without even you know your phones or nothing no to say it out loud yeah that's amazing not I mean it's not 100 percent accurate sometimes yet so I I think this is one step and then I think the next step is going to be some sort of a way to detect whether or not our people are lying and then another step is going to be more enhanced communication then another step after that is going to be some sort of telekinetic or tell is some sort of communication without verbalizing without words that's that's coming I'll just be out in the woods yeah y'all do your thing I'm gonna hang out out here it might be the best way to live I mean that's how I want to live I mean my wife is a more of a city person sort of I made gotta get a weekend spot in Evergreen or something did I want to ya supposed to do a thing with

161:27what's-his-name Denver work oh yeah the Navy SEALs do like campfire thing I better supposed add nice chatting with him yesterday we're text each other not the campfire there no he's about he's gonna come on do the podcast whenever he's in town oh cool figure out the time yeah I was texting with him Oh twittering he's doing I guess it's called like a campfire session so you got there and hang out this campfire and he just tells stories yeah he's a fascinating guy he's been on my friend Steve's television show meat-eater okay he's been on that yeah it's a fascinating intense guy nice you know yeah I want to bring my kids but how do you know he's even it's a great guy I mean I'm sure you could bring your kids but I think anytime you could get a place where you get away where you can get to nature to see the real stars at night and have a campfire it's just reinvigorating it's just great

162:18for you man did you see the Eclipse did you know you didn't a little bit my backyard but I almost burn my eyes I don't have the right goggles I try to put two sunglasses on the shelves like that don't work that was like the probably the the deepest nature well my wife her family's up in Vermont so we get a pretty deep nature out there but but we were up in this place in Wyoming where I mean there was a million people there that weekend but I don't think you know there's probably not a hundred people within you know 100 miles right and man I was the first time I ever looked up in the sky could see the Milky Way though oh you know what you got to do go to if you go to Hawaii you got a planet for when there's no moon and go to the Keck Observatory there's a cat observatory on the Big Island man because the Big Island is designed they have the lighting sister yet

163:07they have the lighting system designed in the Big Island to have diffused lighting on the streetlamps what that means is that the light doesn't disperse into the sky yeah and so when you go up to the Keck Observatory man you see everything it blew me away I saw it yeah that's what it looks like like legitimately what it looks like like you go up there and you look up you're like holy because it's so high I think it's 13,000 feet above sea level oh well you go up there and I didn't know that had mountains that big oh yeah they do and on the Big Island the Big Island has a different world they have a bunch of different ecosystems up there they have a rainforest they have a desert they have mountain ranges they have lava but it's it changed my life and I'm not bullshitting it's like a psychedelic experience when I went up there and saw the stars like that I was

163:56like I mean I don't even I mean if there's something to make you feel like a tiny speck yeah you feel like you're on a spaceship you feel like you're on a spaceship flying through that's how I felt when I was in Wyoming yeah it's just you I mean in that Eclipse obviously blew me away too you don't realize how many stars are up there and how much our street lights are us over mm-hmm because it's changing the way you view the cosmos itself it's changing your relationship that you have with infinity with the universe I mean it's changing it because it's dulling our perceptions by limiting all of this spectacular light and these stars that we the milk the milky way like this there's a reason why it gives you this sense of awe like it's a perspective enhancer it gives you this view of something that's impossibly beautiful and also impossibly huge and it just

164:48puts it all in perspective I think I mean that's why people are so cocky in cities they're just they're missing that they're missing this read this reality check and the weird part is I that's small yeah right this is actually the Milky Way is a small galaxy right yeah yeah it's one of hundreds of billions of galaxies in the known universe and there's not aliens oh well I was talking I did neil degrasse tyson's TV show a couple of days ago and he was telling me that it's the most likely scenario is that we live in multiverses and that our universe which is impossibly large is one of an infinite number of universes there are all these like bubbles can you explain that no I was like wait what kind of guy just trust him on that one right whenever he says on my kind of guy like you're the expert but any time I talk to astrophysicist I just try to probe as much as possible and just trust them

165:51they can't argue with him about it but the idea is that like how we have a planet and the planets part of a solar system in the solar system is a part of a galaxy and the galaxy is a part of the universe the universe is a part of a multiverse and then it's just as there's a fractal nature to it all and it just keeps getting bigger and bigger and the idea that's multiverse is that there is infinite number of different universe now if you say that's uh theoretically the most likely or that's there's some sort of evidence or there's some some reason to believe it outside because my biggest thing is we have all these theories for all this you get big bang god whatever you know have a farther universes but can our minds really even wrap around what you know the reality probably actually is our minds may not be able to to conceive the reality of this you know I mean we may not may not

166:44it may be beyond our imagination where our imagination is kind of limited to the things that we're supposed to be experiencing what we're here you know we could abstractly think about things outside of that but even when someone says to you like a hundred billion stars you're like wow it's a lot but that numbers not even getting in my head even after I said yeah I don't know what that means what is it they say there's more stars than grains of sand yeah on the earth yeah that that's what blows me away yeah I mean just look at a jar of saying yeah those are giant balls of fire maybe it more than a million times bigger than Earth's is floating in the sky so we could see at the Eclipse I had a little observatory like all the colleges and stuff where were there where we're at and you could see you come back in like 10 minutes I and every 10 minutes come back and look through

167:33just one telescope you can see a star going around a star wow that was cool yeah I read something yesterday that Pluto is so far away that one the time they discovered it in 1930 it still hasn't made a complete orbit around the Sun that's it how long a door before as far as the kids are sitting there and they're like oh yeah that's cool to eat some marshmallows or what hit some small a videogames Pluto's unusual orbit takes 248 earth years for Pluto to complete one orbit around the Sun its orbital path doesn't lie on the same plane as the eight planets but as inclined at an angle of 17 degrees and it's not even a planet anymore hmm whew yeah mine Erico how about Elon Musk that crazy and Sean a Tesla up in the space yesterday with a mannequin on board singing to David although it wasn't people on board nah man you know I thought there was no people dude sitting

168:32in a Tesla Roadster that's like a mannequin like it looks like a dude and he's there that's what it looks like yeah is this live right now you could see it yeah that songs on a billion time loop it's gonna play for a bit how does he have the battery but now for this song to keep playing he's got some Sun and he's lying he's lying the guy's why are these batteries run out of this goat you could go 248 miles that car runs out of gas explain I did I thought he said actual Rockets yeah there was an actual rocket and the Tesla Roadster with a mannequin and it was attached to the rocket so at the very apex of this rocket as you know there's multistage Rockets they popped this out and it goes flying through space he shot a car into space like imagine aliens coming to Earth and they said and this is like the first thing they found like what the is this is that a person no there's

169:28a the richest craziest guy one of the richest craziest guys on earth one of the smartest guys he just launches cars into space for a goof like these people are you see a lot of rich people that maybe say this is what they just want to get richer sell the right thing just students how much money is he blowing on this that's it's his main on earth by humans yes I think you blew a hundred million dollars to do this click on that link of the the image of the Tesla with the earth behind it yeah I mean that is just what a crazy image that I want to hear I never talked to Eddie about that I want to hear his real theory on that Eddie Bravo don't talk to me about it I want to hear it it'll change the way you think it's got to change now there's a whole video of this going no it doesn't it's not based in reality man it's not based in logical reason it's because he has no logic

170:22behind it he wants to think the Earth's flat he's like you don't know he doesn't trust science doesn't trust scientists doesn't trust anybody I mean I get that but you got to have some logic still to back it up right you know what one of the things that makes Eddie so good at jujitsu is he has an idea to get a move on you and he's completely locked on that idea and everything that's trying to shut that down is just like he needs to come up with a defense for that he's gonna find a way that's how he looks at ideas as well so if he has an idea that the earth is flat or that there's lizard people that live under the ground like it's I don't know you got to prove that that's not real to him if you can't prove that that's not real and you say well look at these pictures oh that's this they fake you they fake the moon landing six times yeah you gotta get order that I

171:08want to hear is actual argument but they sit down got my filming I wanted to I'll turn the camera on I'll leave the room I went to his gym a couple weeks ago and I'd always heard that he talks a lot at his gym or kind of goes on about different things like that yeah and I was totally prepared yeah let's go here he didn't do anything he didn't barely even talk we just rolled the whole so he's probably happy we were there I wanted to show you some jujitsu he's a wizard he showed me some good jujitsu he just like his system it's an it's an intense system not a you know the moves I only know so much but the the concept of what do we do at 99% of jujitsu classes you go practice some new technique keep I never did before and then you start rolling and then you roll yeah and his the when we went there we you know we drilled drilled drilled this reminded me much more of like a

172:00wrestling's yeah practice and I've liked it a lot yeah in that terms well that's why he that's why he designed it that way he's a real jujitsu genius he really is yeah you know I mean the the conspiracy thing I think he just enjoys it he loves them he loves it he loves he's always sending me crazy I'm afraid I love it too much like once I actually have the time it's a giant distraction if you think Instagram is a distraction go go try to that's a problem I mean you can't like there's no website maybe there should be where you can just go on and say okay this is what this side believes about it this is what this side believes about it and you make up your own mind you got dig through info and of course like if you if you try to tell someone when dude is true said on Infowars they're like okay right you there's a few websites like that right like the Daily Mail like the radar or something

172:55like that there's a bunch of them there's a bunch of weird ones Matt Brown I gotta wrap this up I gotta get the out ever listen man I appreciate your time I mean here's pleasure it's an honor when you fighting Carlos Condit April 14th ooh April 14th tuned in and it's I am the immortal on Instagram right yeah and what's your Twitter same same alright same I am the immortal and then in mortal combat equipment Co thanks brother pleasure thank you