John Dudley

00:00let's get squirrely four three two one boom i gotta ask donnie vincent who made that knife because uh people always ask me about it it's awesome i could have used it on saturday oh when the got squirrely the side that you guys were on where you guys were in the crowd did anybody jump towards you that way no the crowd mainly started it was because we were we had i'm pretty sure we had irish right in front of us and right in front of them was some of khabib's guys and khabib's guys were turning around just literally throwing the fingers right to the irish guys the whole time so then once that happened it was like i was lucky though i had uh i had i had aubrey and whitney right there they were audrey's they were there to protect yeah they were in full throwdown mode i was just i was one of the dumb people just kind of looking around like they were gonna throw mushrooms at

01:01everybody yeah is there any immediate danger no it i mean obviously it seemed way worse over on your side but i was more worried when they made us leave because the further up you got in the bleachers and once you got out into the concession area and in the bathrooms that's where stuff was going down like just people from the crowd um you know guys with irish flags all obviously were getting trash talked to them and there was a big brawl right yeah right next to me on the other side from where they were sitting oh that's right there was one just to our right i was looking left i believe it was the guy that jumped in the red shirt on khabib's team when they were trying to leave when they're getting them out people in the crowd were like ah they started throwing at them first like that's how the that's where the first was getting thrown down and so how did people know that it was

01:48them we we all saw them we could see it i saw that i was like that's the guy that's the guy right there right i was like i i don't know and he went and tried to do something and i was like good luck i know what you're doing bud you know there's a price to be paid for all this like all the all the drama and the trash talking that makes it so fun it also you know it has the potential for blowing up in your face ultimately like a couple people got punched but it was in an event where a bunch of people got punched you know what i mean it's like way more than that it was awesome yeah but you know what i'm saying it's like we made it see it seemed like it was way worse than it really was because in any other situation it would be way worse than it really was like if it was a rock concert and some dudes just from you know like you know if one band was the opening band

02:36and then there was another band that was in a brawl with them and they were they were the main event and then the fans of one band threw down with the fans the other band beat the out of each other that would for whatever reason be way worse than when it's at a fight because if it's out of fight it's just fighters oh i saw this insane clown this was going on this insane clown posse guy tried to drop kick fred durst he fred durst wasn't even looking at him running head start and misses look at he turns around he's like what and he just kept going i haven't seen friends i mean that is maybe the worst public dropkick in the history of the world i think they meant he dropped when he tried to kick well he tried it that was a classic dropkick classic pro wrestling drop kick but his problem is he threw it like a pro wrestler would where you don't really hit the guy

03:33you know i mean he just kind of touched him and if fred was playing along it would have been awesome we need a slow-mo fred would have went flying and it would have been you know i think a lot of the a lot of the uh the thing that's going through people's minds too is when you're at a fight like that there's a lot of people in the crowd that can throw down it's not like you know you go to a well if you go to a hard a hard rock concert of any kind clay guide is going to be there somewhere obviously but as long as you can avoid clay like your opportunity of finding a guy that can really throw cuffs is going to be way smaller than when you're at the ufc and you look around it's hard not to see cauliflower here yeah so i mean someone who's in the crowd that's just a talker he knows if i just turn around and talk i could get wrapped up and be dead quick yeah that's a very high

04:26number of people that could you up at one of those events it's probably like 30 percent 30 of the people in the audience actually know how to fight that's high i think that i think it'd be higher at a ufc at least a basic i think it's about 30. i'd say about 30 i feel like if you just like parse the audience out like how many how many guys ever been punched how many guys ever somebody up how many guys actually train how many guys know how to train and like do it on a regular basis how many guys are in shape like if if went down how many guys could actually throw down for a solid 30 seconds yeah yeah that's that's that's where you that's where i would shine i'm gonna ride this out for two minutes and then these these giraffe elk legs are getting ready to freaking start dancing on some people i'm gonna let some people spaz out for a little while and then then i'm good

05:18people you know when people were talking about um like uh connor and his conditioning for this fight like one of the things that um cam cam hain said was like you know he needs to start running like go go run in the hills i'm like that ain't gonna help like i mean it would help some but the thing is when someone's wrestling you and they're on top of you you up like that you're just getting you're just getting drained it's like a vampire just sucking blood out of you yeah you're exhausted you're carrying all their weight and you're getting beat up and you're stressed and you know you're trying to move and you can't breathe well because the person's weight is on top of you so you're not getting like real breaths and you're constantly resisting their weight and it's way easier for them than it is for you it's way easier to stay on top than it is to be on the bottom

06:10it's a disaster well people that grew up wrestling you know you look at miller mendes guida those guys have experienced that forever like it's it's ingrained in them most wrestlers don't lose like a classic wrestling physique even as adults they still look like they're like they were guys that were real athletic at one time you know i remember one of the first things my dad taught me you know when i was younger in school he's like uh you know i think it was after the first guy you know wanted to fight me on the playground he's like you know if if you don't know if the guy's good at fighting don't worry about it unless he's a wrestler he's like just if it's a wrestler try to back down because he's like you don't know what to do and yeah it was classic this this weekend when i was watching that fight i'm like okay here we go this is just a classic he's gonna you know connor had like 30

07:07seconds at the start of those rounds and then it was just a mauling yeah well john cavanaugh who's conor's trainer will be here next he's going to be here at 11 and i'll get a chance to talk to him and see what the he thinks and what happened and the bottom line is that guy's so much better than him as a grappler so much better yep there i mean he is on such a high level when i talk to daniel cormier daniel cormier says that guy schools world-class wrestlers in the gym just throws people around yeah assassins like probably one after another yeah going to imagine the training special talent he's been wrestling since he was a little kid man i mean he really has there's a you ever seen the video of him wrestling a bear no but i want him you never saw him no but i want to it's hilarious it's him wrestling a brown bear it's like a small brown bear like a russian brown bear

08:03like our version of a grizzly in russia and he's so you're saying like a coastal peninsula bear like a peninsula yeah look look what yeah that's him when he's a little kid look at this i mean who first of all who the lets their kid yeah and the bear is biting them the bear is biting him look at his bear is biting his clothes bear's a total cheater which prepared him for conor this weekend because connor did a lot of cheating okay if i would have saw this i would be making a bet he gave a position because of the bite you see that he was on top and the bear bit him and he let the bear get on top now he's on top yep that's it's over look at this but it's not bears are squirrely man and bears have a really good guard he's laughing that is that's awesome that's him as a little boy look at that 1997. see we can't do that stuff in america i know that's why we lose imagine if

09:00mendez got to go out and just wrestle bears look how little he is too i mean he's a little kid there man he looks like he's about eight years old actually i think in the neighborhood i grew up with the guidance they probably had one of these in the garage a beara yeah clay and and uh and jason they were both kind of nuts maybe they did wrestle some bears what uh what state was that it was in illinois so that were there black bear johnsburg yeah problem this is awesome it's crazy you know what's interesting i've i've been um why doesn't he bite back didn't get that train yeah don't do that because then the bear is really going to get into it look at bears trying to bite his head and well it's a little bear but his dad just like let him ride it out he's good well the bear is obviously being nice they're having fun i mean even that was a bit you know it's like when a dog is biting you when

09:49you're playing with them and they're not they're not trying to hurt you look at that but the bear is also on a chain which is kind of up because the bear can't see yeah but think of those i think i mean that bear that card look at that garden very good bears have a very good guard he shoots it low i mean you russians are a different breed yeah they're a different breed and as things are hard over there we try to make things softer and softer over here we're giving kids participation trophies we don't want bullying they're like we're bringing the grizzly into the assembly and we're gonna wrestle grizzlies today yeah how old are you eight and you haven't wrestled grizzly yet what are you a yeah here we go yeah a couple shots of vodka grizzly bear well you're seeing a lot of very very tough guys come from that part of the world yeah and they're fighting in combat not just guys

10:42yeah women yeah not just guys and and as much as we're talking about wrestling he impressed me stand up oh yeah he cracked connor with that big right hand he he he stood up enough to just say you know i'm gonna sit here and take a few and i'm gonna give a few but then he went to probably what his game plan was i would assume well you have to stand for a little while because if he just shoots in he'll get caught with a knee or caught with a punch rushing in but uh he i mean he landed the bigger shot there was one big giant shot that was landed in that fight and it was by hand yeah and conor hit him with some pretty good front kicks to the body and some other things but didn't really get much off on the feet not like classic left jabs that just break people down yeah and on the ground he just got mauled and it's one of those things where you see that guy in the beginning guys fight

11:35him off a little bit and then as the fight wears on he just gets more and more dominant they get more and more exhausted really this fight just makes ally aquinta look like a god i mean that's the the most impressive thing about it ally aquinta went five rounds with him stood toe-to-toe with him and you know gave him at least a struggle at least he gave him a bit of adversity you know managed to survive on the ground much better than conor did managed to get back up to his feet managed to stuff a bunch of takedowns and on the feet was a real threat you know i mean obviously khabib didn't prepare for ally quinta he prepared for conor but alaya quinta didn't even prepare for five rounds he only prepared for three so there was so much to that fight what do you think will happen with conor now i'm worried what happens with khabib yeah i hope they sit everybody down and they go look

12:29everybody's all right come on yeah you know so yeah the guy who rushed in the cage and punched conor in the face that guy that guy should be in the most trouble because you know the guy just fought four rounds got the beaten out of them got choked i heard a lot of people there's a lot of silly non-experts out there saying that that wasn't a choke or that wasn't a neck crank they don't know what the they're talking about that that is absolutely a neck crank when someone gets their arm around your head like that and then what they do is they grab it like this and they pinch the elbow they put the forearm on his back like this so as the arm is across the neck and then they grip it like this and the forearm goes into the back and as you're pulling like this you're pushing with your forearm and yanking with your hand is a terrible neck crank um they call it

13:23dean lister actually has a video on it it's he calls it the fulcrum choke and it's a nasty choke so you know i thought he was going under the neck here you can see it here dean lister who's a world champion brazilian jiu jitsu black belt and uh that's my friend hans hans mullen camp behind him now watch how he does this see how he's he's grabbing a hold of it and what he's gonna do is he's going to clamp his hands see how he grips his hands yep and so he's doing it like this no no you can go right over your face it can go over your neck and go over your face and go over your cheekbones it doesn't matter it doesn't even have to go under the chin if it goes under the chin that's awesome but you see what's going on with his forearm see how he's put push pulling with his arms or you could do it some some guys do it like this but i think this is probably the best way to do it

14:14but as you're right here this part just digs that elbow yeah perfect perfect example see he's pulling on it with his his right arm and then his left arm is pushing down with his forearm on connor's shoulder it is a nasty nasty neck crank and your your head is getting popped off and first of all that guy can squeeze the out of you all you have to do there's a bunch of guys who could put you to sleep like that uh marcelo garcia is one he puts guys to cease put guys to sleep without even getting under the chin he just gets your head just gets your head in there and squeezes eddie bravo can do that too if he gets your head in there you don't even have to it doesn't even have to be under the chin he just really puts you to sleep with your own head just wraps it around your head and squeezes it so tight that no blood is getting to your brain yeah so there's a lot of armchair

15:07quarterbacks out there saying that that was a neck crank you are incorrect and uh have dean lister do that to you and you will know pretty sure i had jocko do that to me my throat is still you don't want that no why were you rolling with choco that is a terrible idea why did he why did he do that to you what did you do to him i don't know you were just trying to learn right yeah i was trying to learn and i you know he said well who wants to roll and i just said me yeah and and he just he kind of just looked at me he's like well just try to do something but you're taking classes now right you're taking 10th when i can yeah yeah i've got one in um altoona iowa so thanks to you and betty for hooking me up with damien what shout out what shout out to damian what's super important is drilling that's the most important thing in the beginning it's sort of like uh there's very there's parallels

16:05in archery for sure because archery it's what's really important is your technique your technique is almost everything like doing everything correctly that's the same thing with jiu jitsu same thing with muay thai taekwondo anything it's just technique um and doing it over and over again correctly until it's ingrained in your system yeah it's information overload for sure that's one of the hardest parts for me is i'm so new at it that i feel like my cognitive functioning is not at a level to to take in i mean it's there's so much going on and he several people have told me they're like there there comes a point where all sudden it just it something clicks and you start to comprehend everything but until that moment happens it's you know you're going to struggle to remember what you talked about last time or how to do it exactly right but eventually there there comes a time when

17:01when it clicks and it starts to you know you do start to soak in stuff and i'm definitely not to that point yet i mean just even some of the basic drills the one thing i do understand that they were impressed by is just leverage on joints you know because they were talking about some of the different arm bars and stuff you know they were like well if the elbow's like this and i said yeah that won't work the elbow has to be like this and i remember damian looked at me like how do you know that and i'm like you know how many arms i've dissected off animals you know if you have to if you have to knock four hooves off of elk quarter to pack it out if you don't know where the joint is and how to how to bend it and hit it just right to crack that off that's a good point and you know hips shoulders even taking the head off i mean you know i think that too but also your understanding of like

17:52the proper positioning of your shoulders and your elbow and everything in archery yeah i think just an understanding of the human body alone i think that that helps you tremendously it's one of the reasons why people that are really good at gymnastics excel at jiu jitsu people are really good at break dancing yeah i saw that yeah break dancers excel yoga a lot of yoga people that get really good at yoga they can excel at jiu jitsu too it's just you you have just an understanding of what what the way your body moves in my yeah mind mind body just connection like being able to to really have a mind muscle connection some people don't understand that you tell them to do a pull-up and you're like you really want to use lats and they're like well what's that yeah they don't know they have no idea yeah they're just pulling and some people when they when they pull a bow for the first time

18:43even big guys they struggle pulling a bow because they're not their techniques poor so they're you know they're lifting up high they're pulling all with bicep down and it's like man can you just lift up and go straight back with you know just certain muscles of the back and when they see it they're like how do you do that and it's just understanding of leverage and muscle and then it you know once they understand that flow it gets really easy but until that it looks like they're trying to literally do a max rep it's that too but it's also you probably have done it a million times so your your arms are so conditioned to do that it's such a natural movement probably possibly more probably several million yeah i would say probably several here's a perfect example i use most people even if they have like a strong left arm like if i go like flex your arm you see a good left bicep you know you

19:37look like you've got good shoulders in your left hand and then i bring you to a heavy bag and i say throw a left hook most people's left hooks are dog just straight up talk yeah try to get someone to throw it they're like it's just it just doesn't work it doesn't look like someone throw a baseball left handed it just looks terrible it's even worse i think you might be able to throw because the concept of throwing seems normal but the concept of digging in with your toes and turning your body into a hook and then if you do it and you just do it slowly just bang and hit a bag they're like how are you doing that and you just like you just get used to it for the long when i was when i was striking all the time my left bicep was quite a bit larger than my right one my left arm was actually stronger than my right because you're always jabbing you're always jabbing you're always

20:28jabbing and hooking and you're throwing less right hands than you are left hands and so my left side was bigger like my left arm i had a bit like i could see it like if i flex the two of them together my left bicep looked larger and that's a normal thing with boxers there if you if you're not a person who switches stances and you keep yourself in an orthodox stance with your left leg forward you will you'll have a stronger left hand like i would be able to open things better with my left hand than my right hand is that weird well i mean yeah you're and you're you're turning so much too so i mean i guess when you're snapping back you're kind of supinating the when you come back i think it's just the use just the the sheer number like the if you looked at like a really good boxer left hand versus right hand you might throw two to one maybe three to one three to one left

21:15three to three to one you throw a lot yeah so if you're doing it right you know you're supposed to be jabbing more than you are just throwing haymakers well one of my one of the highlights of the fight there were several ferguson's match was amazing ferguson's incredible i mean incredible dude that guy had catastrophic knee surgery like his knee was so blown out they were they were not sure if he was gonna be able to fight again they were like i don't know what's gonna happen here because he had ripped his tendon completely off the bone the scar in his leg is enormous his scar is like 12 inches long it's a massive scar so they had to open him up like a fish and then they have to get in there and they have to bolt down that ligament to the to the bone were they able to use the same one yeah back down yeah he had surgery almost immediately after the injury

22:08he didn't have to have a cadaver or anything like that yeah and the way they do it i don't i honestly don't know exactly what was involved but look at that knee look at the knee man that's incredible that's i mean that is incredible and then six months later he's not just healed up he's got anthony pettis kicking that leg yeah we were very concerned in the beginning of the fight it looked like he got hurt on that leg because pettis hit that leg twice really hard and it looked like he was wobbly a little bit on that leg yeah i was gonna say he survived a catastrophic flurry yeah i mean pettis caught him yeah and he came back big time because it it didn't look good there were several fighters that dug really deep that were in trouble and came back for some awesome comebacks how about derek lewis he's the best he's the best he's my official favorite now i love that that post fight

23:06interview is my favorite postman for sure i go derek why'd you take your shorts off my balls was hot i love that i've always said yeah i got a phone call before the fight donald trump called me said i got to knock this russian out and make everybody look bad when i was pooting i i was in the crowd and i'm like i looked at sharon i go did you say his balls were hot she's like yeah she goes i think he did people in the crowd i don't think appreciated as much as the people back home it was hard to hear yeah people back home they got it straight from his mic into their tv they got the full version of it yeah it was muffled pretty pretty hardcore so classic he's so funny man and and what a puncher holy holy can that guy crack because he was down as down as you can get i mean he was basically three rounds in the can three rounds in the hole and 30 seconds to go boom

24:05and we were saying that we were saying it in the commentary that he still has the kind of power where one shot could win the fight yeah and people like yeah yeah yeah but is he gonna boom he lands it that's what's hard about being live at the fight you um you don't really get the commentary and your guys's commentary is so good when you're watching on pay-per-view it's dissecting so many things that you aren't you know unless you're very seasoned at watching mma you don't appreciate a lot of that stuff and when you're watching with no one's opinion you're kind of just watching and waiting for something like that to happen where there's a lot of times you guys are calling that you you know you're seeing some of that stuff that needs to happen or should happen and they used to have this thing that you could get i don't think they have it anymore it was like a

24:54little fm radio did you see it at the i haven't seen it in a while no i don't think they have it anymore but it used to be a little thing that you would you would buy at the gift shop it's like a little and it doubled as a fm radio so if if you used it like it you would still would work somewhere else as a radio but when you keep it on a certain frequency they would broadcast the commentary so you would get the commentary and you could keep it in your ear while the fight was going on yeah that is one of the things that that's missing just a little bit yeah but it's just there's something about being in the building especially that one yeah there was just electricity like radiating from person to person in the crowd it was electric yeah that was probably the biggest ufc of all time i mean it has to be one of them you know they don't know i would they won't know for another day or so

25:47but i think it's the most important fight of all time because connor being such a huge superstar and then being out of mma for two solid years and then khabib just being so dominant 26 and 0. and then there was also like the controversy of like how he won the title you know he won the title last minute he was supposed to be fighting tony ferguson tony gets injured al iaquinta steps up and it's for the title and everybody's like what how is that for the title yeah you know the whole thing was just very very weird if there's not a a rematch which you would think numbers-wise there has to be i don't think so i wouldn't think there'd be a rematch not for a long time well what's awesome is if there isn't and kind of the counterpolitics are out of that weight class now some of the fights we'd get to see like i'd love to see him in ferguson would be in the fight yeah that's the fight 100

26:45now yeah after ferguson dominated pettis like that and then also overcame that big shot where he got hurt yeah i don't i don't want to see mcgregor versus khabib again i don't think it's going to be any different there's so many more that would just be awesome i would like to see it in the future i mean but conor would have to do something to show that he first of all there is absolutely a factor in that he had not been fighting for two years yeah one boxing match in two years is just not good enough for mma especially with wrestling just not good enough and then i think he would have to like really really concentrate on his wrestling and even that even that i mean how much better can he get dude that guy was wrestling a bear as a kid yeah i mean he's so much better yeah he's so much back in time and rethink this i mean khabib might just have his number for life

27:43you know that's what cormier said mm-hmm you know cormier i was talking to cormier after the fight he said he was like listen to me he's never going to beat him never he's never going to beat him i go you don't think he could ever get to the point where he'd get his takedown defense up enough he's like it'll never happen he's never going to get there he's too far away he's got to get a just a clean one shot that just ends it that would be it yeah that would be it's like that in my field too i mean i stay i guess i stay honed but i'm not like razor sharp in my field just so like you mean like target archery like if you're gonna compete yeah people all the time say you know why don't you why don't you compete and it can i shoot better than most people at this point yeah you know i can answer that without question can i shoot at a at a were like could i have beat myself

28:37when i was shooting on the teams no way like that was a different person and when i stepped away for for two or three years even though i contemplated coming back i'm like this commitment is going to take a year two years of really fine tuning because i mean at those levels people don't miss you know so missing one or two still means it's a burnt weekend it's still a burnt tournament like you have to be flawless and if you're not flawless then all you're doing is donating money and when you compete at those tournaments what's the distance it depended there's several different formats um anywhere from 18 meters which you were shooting at something the size of a dime and most of those you know like a 600 round you would need to be you know then i was shooting like you know upper 590s um at something the size of the time explain what that means so like um to hit that to hit that x the

29:35size of a dime is a ten so you would have to you know literally yeah out of 60 arrows in in like in tournament play you would have to hit that dime you know 57 times um and then you know when we went out to the longer distances uh up to 90 meters i mean you have to be shooting something a little bit larger than the end of that coffee cup you know you'd have to you'd have to be deadly accurate with that thing i mean you're going to have to be in in the high 90 percentile being able to hit that and you also get used to the competition you get sharper because your mind's in that place that's the hardest part even if you're on the game which there's been times like this past summer um i had a event that i did for a cabela's experience where some of the cabela's black signature card members kind of i guess bought an experience and i did some training at the easton center with them

30:33and then we went and shot the total archery challenge in in utah and you know we talked i talked through the technicalities of what you would do on each shot explain what the total archery challenge is for people total archery challenge is a tournament that or it's not even a tournament it's more of a fun event where they set it's in snowbird and they set archery targets like in real hunting situations but with very very technical shots extreme angles longer distances you got crosswinds and canyons and snowbird for people don't know is a ski course what is that sorry i actually had the video oh and uh yeah it's just very technical because you're the footing is poor yeah this is uh this is the total archery challenge so it's really interesting because it's in the summer time but it's at a ski place ski range what would you call it a ski would you call it yeah it's the course no it's a

31:27it's at a ski lodge yeah yeah but what is the where the where the slopes it's literally a resort yeah it's a snowbird so you take the ski lifts up to where these things are and these targets are all set up and they're all these foam deer and foam sheep and all these different uh game animals and they're at extreme distances and weird angles you take the uh you take the the tram all the way to the top of the mountain and then you literally shoot down i think it was about six miles for us to get down i think our total walk one day was about six miles but i shot it with this group and taught him the technicalities of it and because of that i really wanted to be prepared i knew that there was going to be people there watching i knew that because i stepped into an actual event where there were a few thousand archers there i knew that there was going to be a lot

32:22of people watching me because i haven't gone out into like that realm in a while it would be no different than a false and you know you were out of mma for a while and then went in there ever you know there's going to be eyes on you so i just wanted to be on my game um or as best as i could be so i set a goal trying to think what it was i think i set a goal of like um i think it was around 10 000 arrows i wanted to shoot prior to that um so over a course of just a few months yeah i mean i think the one day i shot around 500 a day a time i think i time lapsed one of those i don't know if you remember that but once you go there even if you're totally on your game if you have to shoot with other guys that are elite level athletes there's still a lot that goes into it i mean then especially if you're shooting for score you're shooting for money those pressure factors

33:20if you're not acclimated to them those aren't things that you can just step back into when i was my best as a competitor i alm like my practice was almost at tournaments every weekend it was i mean 40 something events a year you know every three days you're at a tournament in the heat of the moment with the best five or six people in the world and then you go home for a few days you repack you re-tune and then you're right back in the grind again somebody got stripped of a title because they tested positive for thc and beta blockers yeah this is real recent right oh yeah yeah when i competed um so i mean yeah you uh you're depending on what level you're at there was because i shot with the us team certain tournaments didn't have doping and then but when you shot anything that was on a world level you did so i was always in a doping pool so you know it was no different than

34:21like when i was i was uh with chad mendes at a turkey hunt you mean a testing pool yeah yeah so they would test your blood or your urine what would they test either one yeah and you would be on call you'd have to tried beta blockers what does that what do they do well no that it's supposed to um kill your nerves right i would think it blocks adrenaline yeah right the ability for your brain to to dump adrenaline so yeah the the number one thing in archery or any type of finesse sport is you know low heart rate keeping your heart rate down because that's obviously keep you know keeping your mind in the game and stability very minimal movements so yeah there's um i remember i had a coach a long time ago he talked about alcohol and how alcohol could help shooter because we i we were talking about a guy that had done well at tournaments several times and i said

35:16yeah he always does good and he said yeah he's always he's always drunk and i'm like what do you mean and he said well he goes if you play alcohol the right way and you're like not sloppy drunk but you're he yeah he just like stays in his zone and he's just kind of sitting there drinking the whole time and that was but like prior to where they were testing for alcohol so he actually made us uh he said all right well let's see how you how you do if you shoot when you have a buzz going so you know we we drank and shot and uh you know don't try this at home kids uh it wasn't an archery range where they have to buy insurance or whatever but uh yeah and it you know that was part of it because at the time this was in the mid 90s another archer that had won a bunch of titles also tested positive for beta blockers and had had some titles stripped but then for the longest time that was

36:14one of my complaints was once i was shooting um at a level with with the teams and we we had to go through testing or be like if for example at an event when i meddled if you're in the top three immediately you get tested i mean so that's how it is so you know everyone there is level they're all level but then you go to other events like for example some of the biggest money events were the 3d shoots and that was a big reason why i left those shoots because at those tournaments there was no testing there was no testing there was clearly guys there that were shooting that were kind of just out of it there could be fifty thousand dollars on the line and there was just no not a sweat cracked because there you know some of that stuff obviously it is a performance enhancer because of the fact they're not having a deal with adrenaline spikes and accelerated

37:10heart rate for people don't know what we're talking about 3d shoots are a type of tournament where they have those uh realistic looking targets so foam elks or a foam bear and they have yep areas that you're supposed to hit yeah and um the other thing was i didn't like the fact that at that time when you scored it was just based off if there's four guys in the group whatever the majority voted that's how it scored and when there's a lot of money on the line so like say you shot and i shot jamie shot and sharon shot we'd walk up and you know it's their foam ring so the arrow could look like it's in it could look like it's out but it's not a clear line and we would just if me you and jamie said that's out then even if sharon's was close it'd be out um so i was in some groups where things got a little shady people were wanting to make money and it got apparent that it wasn't you

38:07know there wasn't a judge there calling every score which on a world level there's judges there oh so if you guys were all competing against each other you would call for each other i've seen groups where they did oh that's cool yeah yeah wacky yeah i've seen some surely try you ever tried beta blocker no i want to know what that's like i'd like to do something nerve-wracking try a beta blocker and then do something really nerve-wracking can me and andy throw you at a plane please i think you would like it whether i'd like it or not it's not happening well i'm not interested it doesn't get much sketchier than that uh roller coaster we were on yesterday yeah we we did the roller coaster at new york new york sketch city that thing felt like it was tied together with bubble gum i couldn't believe how ricky it feels so uncomfortable you're like wait a minute this is just way it's old

39:05it's outside everything's outside you're flying around the the casino itself like and the whole thing just feels like it shouldn't be there yeah i think there's several things there that are a little outdated yeah yeah i was in the i was i was one row behind you guys and uh i was next to this kid who had never ridden a roller coaster and he was terrified like he was terrified and i thought have i just not been on one of these long for that long to where this feels like it could possibly shake off and we could launch onto when was the last time a roller coaster did break loose like when was last night someone there's something last year i believe that happened something happened last year don't show them when those carnivals roll into town yes that's on you if you get on one of those things i was at one a couple of years back and i took a picture of it for instagram

40:06because there was uh this one of those whirly wind things oh roller coaster derails two riders fall 30 feet to the ground at daytona beach oh don't show me this that's just afterwards oh that's it hanging i don't think they've got the live video oh jesus christ daytona beach but that's florida see anything that's up could happen in florida i guarantee the guy was fixing that's on oxycontin he's probably got a python in his pocket they need one of those in the buckies do they have a roller coaster in the buckies yet no they don't but they need one does texas texas not known for roller coasters they're a little wiser than that i bet you could wrestle grizzly bears in texas though like if someone wanted to train oh yeah you could probably shoot them too probably do whatever you want yeah we could do a brown bear wrestling training camp as long as it's an exotic that's the

41:03whole thing about texas like if thing if it's an exotic animal meaning it's not indigenous it's not native you can kind of do whatever the you want to it it is crazy texas is a fascinating place it's one of the weird states that almost all the land is private and so it's a rare thing like there's a public land system in this country with you know the bureau of land management and all the different national parks there's like none of that in texas you know texas is mostly just private ranches that's weird right it's very weird yeah it's very weird there's been roads i've been down where you're just driving and for miles and miles and miles it's nothing but high fence it's like people's private ranch is just like gated in yeah yeah it's strange because they have these ranches that they seem like wilderness because the ranch would be like 10 000 acres right but it's if it's 10

42:04000 acres it's fenced in and part of you goes well hey man the whole country's fenced in you get to the ocean you can't go any further that shit's kind of like the first excuse but there you go that's how i look at it yeah you go far enough north you hit the ice yep you hit the glaciers yeah where you going yeah but there's something about that kind of experience like that's one of the the weirder things about texas is that they have these enormous fenced-in properties where they have all these african animals running around yeah like nilgai and elins and you name it yeah and they're they're they have more of those animals running around in texas than they do in the wild of their countries like oryx yeah like oryx they're like they're threatened in other parts of the world right they've got a ton of them down there texas they got a load and black bucks yeah lots of stuff

43:01yeah they have lots of stuff access the same way but so how do you feel about that like if you if the place is like this is like a philosophical argument right if it's 10 000 acres and it's fenced in that's far greater than their natural range right yeah they normally wouldn't wander any further than that it's an ongoing debate i mean it is squirrely right yeah it's squirrely yeah there's um because even with like animals that they you know where they want to score and then put into like record books you know to keep track of scores so you you know there's certain score scoring clubs that don't recognize anything with a high fence but then at the same time there's like members within those organizations that are like well wait a minute you know if a ranch is 15 000 acres that's you know they kind of have the same argument and they said well is that and it's like well

43:55yeah i mean if if there is and as a hunter it's one of the things that um there's kind of a continual debate some hunters absolutely refuse to hunt anything that has any sort of containment other people have their kind of their you know they have their own threshold of well if it's 5000 or more then i'm kind of okay with it um it it's hard i mean it's no different than you know some people in the hunting community some people only want to hunt animals that are on public land and then some people you know like to hunt areas where it's you know it's managed properties it's privately owned properties that have really good management and you know that you know you're shooting you know a certain age limit you're kind of culling out you know the older animals maybe that aren't breeding anymore so yeah there's there there's continual differences of what people feel like you know they want to

44:57accept some people want to be able to some people just like hunting like nugent he just loves hunting his ranch right i mean he hunts that thing and i think he also has he's had a problem moving around well he doesn't i mean he can't really go elk hunting like where he goes hiking into the mountains eight ten hours a day but he legitimately loves hunting texas ranches yeah like he legitimately sits at tree stands i mean i think he's limited to that like he has two bad knees like really bad like his he's got artificial knees he's had some serious surgeries we've got friends that love to hunt um like exotic ranches yeah well i can see i could see the argument both ways yeah like look if you're a meat eater and you want to get meat from a free range cattle ranch you know you only want grass-fed grass finished beef that's that's free-range that roams around

45:57like there's a lot of people that feel that way yep well what is why are you hunting are you hunting because you and you want meat are you hunting because you want to kill your own meat are you hunting because you want to eat wild game are you hunting because it's fun or you're hunting for all the reason all the above and if it's if it's in all the above some people feel like the only kind of hunting they want to do is backpacking public land go into the wilderness and they don't want to have anything to do with raising those animals helping those animals they want those animals to be straight up wild you know and they feel like that is the most ethical way there's a lot of weird debates about public land too here's one that really gets me there's a lot of people that are really into public land and they're the public land is super important to them they want

46:49they only want to hunt public land but they have secret spots on public land they don't want anybody to know about them and if you tell someone about their spot on public land they'll get mad at you like if you take someone to a spot i've heard uh ranella talk about this on the show like he's a big public land guy but he'll talk on his show about what a betrayal it is if you tell a person about a spot and they tell someone else about that spot yeah or they go to that spot without you like what the are you talking about is this public land or is it not and if it's not if it is public land if you're telling someone about a spot you're telling me that this public land spot you don't want them going to without you not unless they find it on their own that is ridiculous right that's ridiculous that's like you have a private spot yeah you have a private spot on public land

47:44so you're a public land guy until it infringes on your own privacy like you've figured out a way to have a private spot on public land and if you share this private spot with someone else they're not allowed to go there without you you that's crazy dude it's either the number one rule in fishing too someone takes it or it's not yeah but if someone takes you to a sweet little spot where they just rip lips constantly on on a lake and then next thing you know they go out there on the weekend and you're sitting there in your boat with a bunch of buddies that's stupid this is just going to come out they're going to be like bro i took you to my spot well they're that's stupid i don't think so you think they should not go there i think there's do you think they own that spot it's a joke they don't own it okay they don't own it let's let's talk about like lake superior

48:36okay we've got a giant ass lake yep and someone has a spot where all the lake trout live a little reef yeah yeah where everything's chilling out you tell me about that spot and then you go back there six months later and i'm at that spot you're gonna be mad at me no probably not not me but what if it's a guy that you don't know as well if i went back and you had a whole bunch of guys there would be like dude you should have saved this spot for us that's ridiculous it's a public lake i'm not taking you to any of my spots you better not see this is the thing this these people that say they want everything to be public that's not public it's not public if you don't want other people going back there i see the argument though because he put in the work to find a good place that took work within public lands and you better not tell people about it or they're gonna go back yeah

49:21that's well that's where that you go wrong yeah if you find it you gotta just you gotta just keep it quiet that's so corny that's so ridiculous like do you want that spot to yourself you want that spot to be private in a way yeah you do yeah you're making a private area in public land that's what you're doing yep i think that's preposterous well could you imagine if you say you were going elk hunting you left camp an hour and a half before daylight and you pack all the way out there and there's someone sitting on your glassing rock in that basin it's not yours but you would still say i should have never told this guy that it was here all right someone got there first no one's ever gonna tell you about their spot this is a spot that's been the same way for hundreds of thousands of years it's been that way it has but someone found it put in the work to find it

50:16this is some small-minded thinking man yep this is some small-minded thinking i know sorry but this is a common way of thinking i would say i'd say there's people that don't think that way but there's certainly people that are i would have to side with with renee on that really yeah so you think so let me ask you this so if you if someone takes you to a place and it's this really good mule deer spot and you gotta you hike in seven miles and this is beautiful basin and you go there and it's just always deer there you don't go there without that person's permission i would tell i would say are you going to be there and if you said no and i'd say can i go i wouldn't take it that would be good go to national forest land can i go to public land can i go to this spot you don't own even a little bit out of respect for that guy that found it found it yeah he just walked he walked on the dirt

51:15found what a tree there's a my tree yeah this is crazy this is my rock that i stand on this top to cliff is my cliff that's crazy yeah i mean you can take it to a point but it's crazy i still think it's code it's a weird code the other argument though too is just from a hunting situation jamie is the person who doesn't hunt at all i mean i i've heard it so i unders like it's not a new concept to me but i'm trying to compare it to something else like if it was like a basketball hoop i found somewhere like don't tell somebody to go to that playground because it's my hoop and i show up and people are there playing a public playground find another hoop to play on well or you don't play basketball it seems it seems ridiculous silly but i'm just trying to think yeah that you like you have us especially in today's day and age because today people use like onyx maps and they use

52:04google earth and you you could find these beautiful spots and you just go out to them like if you find a beautiful spot on google earth you go out to it and you go hey man this is a spot i found don't go there there's as much but this is my spot on public land it seems ridiculous yeah it does it does but there i think there's a legitimate code to it it seems ridiculous but it seems understandable that someone would be upset if they're looking forward to going to a place and they told you about it a year ago and they go to that place they hike in takes them nine miles and then you're there yeah tough go another nine should have got there earlier you procrastinating i'm taking you with me when we're going to someone's spot i'll let you don't no one owns any spots see that's what's so weird about it to me it's it's there there definitely is a there definitely is a line

53:04i mean i i see your argument 100 and i know it you know at some point it it could definitely get childish or out of hand i mean obviously there's a ton of ton of stuff but out of courtesy yeah i mean if any time you showed me something cool if you're like hey i got this cool thing that's what i do you know it's kind of private take my family there whatever i'd be like yeah i respect that but it's not private that's what's weird yeah what's weird is the whole water's not either public land but fishermen would be the same right but it's captains captains it is thing about public land is that it's supposed to be everyone's so if you find a really good area in public land that's supposed to be available for everyone but that's not what everybody wants what everybody wants that's one of the things about people not wanting new people to get into hunting like i've heard this argument before

54:00like you shouldn't be telling people to get into hunting because it's already tough tough enough out there on public land there's already so many people hunting on public land if more people get into hunting there's gonna be more pressure like what yeah that's that's not me i'm definitely looking to get more people in for sure right because you're thinking they don't they don't know about your spots i'll find a new spot that's a good attitude one of the um one of the questions or i guess arguments too is you know i don't understand it when people they don't have any tolerance for like hunting private land so to speak or they don't have tolerance for you know i don't mind people that that hunt like exotic ranches or hunt high fence that's just not that's like not what i personally like but i also understand that people do but i i also don't like it when people

54:53are like super negative to that but yet they'll have like a bowl and a pen or they'll have chickens in a cage or they'll have a goat and they're like raisins and they're raising a goat to slaughter i don't know is it yeah it is because it's just a different scale no but it's not because it shows that there's a different thing in the pursuit of a wild animal there's a different thing to that like like here's the thing say if you there's a ranch and the ranch is 5 000 acres which is big but not the biggest yeah and on that 5 000 acre ranch someone shoots a giant buck like a huge 2 4 240 inch mule deer like epic deer and people like wow but it's a private ranch and you kind of know that there wasn't a lot of pressure there so they probably knew where this deer was and people that worked in this ranch told people about this deer and they kind of kept their eye on it and they

55:47knew where to go to find him yep versus you uh getting your truck driving four hours outside of reno in nevada getting out into the mountains by yourself you're like setting up camp by yourself spending three or four days just scouting just finding your spot finding your animals out there finding your spot but it's more difficult is the point so like if someone accomplishes that you look at it differently yeah than someone who shot something in a high ranch in texas it's just a different thing yeah but what i don't what i'm saying is like hunters versus non-hunters people that are non-hunting that really look down on like what we're talking about as hunters but yet they'll raise a goat right to slaughter but they're not pretending that it's some sort of pursuit man versus ant see the thing about the hunting thing is you're you're looking at it like it's a difficult pursuit

56:46like you're out there trying to outwit this animal for me yeah yeah that's what i like about it but if you're in a 400-acre fenced-in property with a bunch of exotics running around you're sitting in a tree stand there's a pile of corn down there and you're waiting for an animal to walk over to that corn and you whack it that is very different than say what you did this year in alberta when you were telling me that you were hiking hundreds of i mean how how many days did you guys go i think we went nine did a hundred miles yeah so you hiked a hundred miles in the wilderness for nine days no elk and never never got one never got one yeah yeah that is very different yep right so oh yeah that's real hunting in comparison to someone who's sitting over a pile of corn in a fenced-in ranch yeah that's that's why i think people have a problem with it yeah that anybody would compare what you did

57:44to that and then there's like the intermediary which is like a really nice ranch that's not a high fence but it's a private ranch like the place we went to in utah yeah that is it's private not everybody can go there but those are just wild animals roaming around and yeah and opportunities high yes more opportunity but no nothing's fenced in nothing's keeping the animals there and they those animals have been there for thousands of years yeah that's just what they do you just have the opportunity to hunt a wild animal on a piece of property where there's not going to be a lot of people there yep yeah i it's my preference i like doing i really like the balance of having really tough hunts especially because i knew my you know my utah hunt wouldn't quite be the same that was kind of a very different experience for me i haven't ever like had an opportunity like that so that was

58:42you know quite a quite a difference for me whereas between the other states that i hunted i think i did i think i was right it up just over 200 miles before uh before we got our first bull you know between there and then hunting some uh some private land but also some public land in montana before finally getting you know that first elk can you talk about what happened with montana with the the bear um yeah i mean i can talk about it they actually text me back and ruled back that it was not a grizzly what yeah they say it's a um a colored black bear do you think that's true um yeah it's possible i was gonna pull up the pictures um it's an enormous black bear yeah yeah it did you thought it was a grizzly yep yeah we shot a actually um our our mutual friend andy stumpf she had a bull on 911 which was which was pretty um pretty cool for him to have an experience like that

59:43and it took us um i forget how far out we were just several several miles from camp and we it took us two trips to pack this bull out and uh the first pack out that we did i think we finally got back to camp i don't know somewhere around midnight or something so the next morning we went back at first light took us a while to pack back in there and when we got there um half of the carcass i had already pulled everything apart we had everything game bags everything was strung up on trees but the actual cavity was half buried and as we were approaching i seen something kind of running off and by the coloration on the hide i really thought for sure it was a grizz because i've seen lots of them and we got up there and sure enough it was it was buried so we kind of took a lot of precaution as we were trying to tell people just explain to people what that means so a grizzly

60:41they will bury something that they find and they i think they do it for a couple reasons one of the reasons is they want they don't want um like prey birds like crows and stuff to be able to see it because they'll start talking and then other predators in the area listen for those birds and then you know it's kind of a magnet starts to draw so they like to conceal it so they'll literally kind of pivot on a circle around that kill and actually claw the ground and and bury them and it's pretty like i've seen uh where grizzlies bury a full moose and it's it is ridiculous the type of dirt they can move i'm talking it looks like a skid loader came in there and buried these things and they can do they can do that kind of work fairly quick but they'll pile up everything around it and then they kind of normally will create one small little hole at the end of that mound where they'll

61:37kind of crawl in there and they literally like eat from one side to the other side you know and uh and it's it's normally the back end first um so yeah i felt like we had just got there when this bear had just discovered the carcass and had just started the burial process because you know he hadn't pulled anything out of the trees he had only started to cover the the carcass which normally they'll cover that seal first then they'll clean up the scraps around and then they'd go to their pile and kind of consume that last but i was certain that we had seen one we ended up seeing a wildlife biologist later on and i told him you know i thought i saw griz and he told me he said well it's pretty important if you did because there hasn't been one naturally on this hill and i think he said a hundred years so he's like you know would you be willing to go back in there to put a camera up

62:42which is not smart if it was a if it was a grizzly it's i mean obviously they're going to be depending on their demeanor they could be very protective of that but we did end up going back in there just to put the camera up and then after the camera was there a few weeks he sent the picture and said you were close to being right it's just a perfectly colored uh black bear that looks like like it would be a grizzly but how does he know for sure you can tell by they don't have um you thought it was grizzly when you saw the photo yeah they they don't have a very i thought it was a younger one but they don't have a very distinct hump on their back and then the claw marks see he went in you can tell a lot by the claws so when you go in and you look at the tracks that's also a really easy way because like like that bear that was wrestling khabib you could see the claws like grizzlies

63:40have very very distinct claws so that was uh just look in here so i can't really pull up the pick for everything send it to jamie let me check it out yeah i could see that that's luke yeah and and that does actually kind of look like a brown bear now that i look at it and then black bear rather yeah and then running the head is going to be narrower and it took several pictures some of the pictures it looked more like a griz just because the coloration some of the pictures it didn't so um you know and keep in mind you know mountain grizzlies will look a little bit different than like a coastal bear or you know inland grizzly but either way it was it was a bear that came in and you know covered the whole carcass and went to eat it now when you were in alberta you went back to that place that you were talking about on the first podcast we ever did where you had that encounter

64:38where you shot that elk that was just outside of that wolf den yeah and the wolves tried to claim the elk you guys had to shoot your way out of there yeah that is a crazy story what was it like to be back there again um it was what was strange about it is while we were there uh i actually found that they were back in that area there was some fresh tracks and then we heard one howl like during that thing so it was almost like it was a little bit weird because um did you guys bring extra bullets this time we only had my bow this time i'm sending you this jamie oh jesus um but uh yeah the the thing that um the thing that was that's always kind of creeped me out a little bit was just it was i felt like i had like a kind of a personal connection with that alpha male because the way you know he came in at the very end because he wanted to know what the heck had taken out

65:40three of his pack he wanted like it's almost like he's like i know we're getting out of here but i want to see this for myself because you know they were close enough but i don't think they could totally see us yet so as that was going away um grizzly yeah it doesn't look like a brown or a black bear though in the nose yep see how the face is more narrow so yeah and then the claws too yep yep yeah which like on the right foot the claw looks more like a black bear on the left foot there was some grass there that made it a little bit strange but um when that alpha male came in to kind of you know i think he just wanted to know okay what's caused all this this stuff so you know i looked at i looked him in the face and just pretty much said i'm going to shoot you in the face um i always every time i go back in that area i'm like you know if this old sucker is walking around

66:38he knows my smell he's probably going to be like this yeah i personally they are smart i could picture him remembering it and saying oh okay this i hold this dude i owe this dude i'm gonna make him into a hairy turd on the side yeah i sent you that uh that wolf that big wolf that had porcupine quills all out yeah i put that on instagram it's funny how many people are like that that is not porcupine quills it's like listen people i i'm in the outdoors 200 days probably a year and if there's porcupine quills coming out of a pile of i'm pretty sure i know what it is it's hard to tell from a photo yeah you see pull it's on my instagram here we go it's a a pile of with porcupine quills in it you imagine how goddamn hungry you have to be to be eating porcupine quilts i don't sweat i think a wolf's that tough he doesn't care it's like a bear look at how many bears just will just go

67:39head first into a pile of ant like a fire ant bed or a or a wasp nest yeah like yellow jacket there it is make that a little bigger please down in the bottom you can see some nice quills yeah yeah some people go that's where the other there is porcupine hair in there correct but those are also coils there's there's a couple of blood drops up there yeah that needs some prep h uh how we yeah they're they're beasts they're beast that is you know i i think i think their intelli their intelligence level is is super high i think a lot of you know the more you're in the outdoors and you experience things demeanors and their uh their ability to survive you know you look at a one of the you look at an old grizzly that's been in those woods for 20 years think of the experience level that thing has surviving every single day i mean every day just maybe making a slight mistake

68:41slipping up a little bit almost getting jacked by another grizzly and then you're like oh yep i know not to do this i know not to do that i mean they're they're intel their intelligence level and their ability to function is extremely high and and wolves are i mean arguably wolves probably get shot less than probably any of the other animals i mean they're in they are incredibly smart so yeah i wouldn't i wouldn't doubt it you know it was um and they're they they were very after that they were very um intent in that area for people to they put up some pretty big bounties on the wolves and they really went after them and and knocked those herds down quite a bit because there was very few mule deer like very few mule deer you'd hardly see a doe and fawn they had to cut the number of tags way down uh elk as soon as wolves like howl at night if a pack moves into an area and they howl

69:40like calling elk is just non-existent they just everything's just like don't say nothing because you know they're here um so yeah i think i think them thinning them down was was very relevant and since then which was quite a while ago um the numbers of like elk and moose like this past year i saw way more moose than i've seen i think they're really hard on moose fawns and yeah i mean moose muleys whitetails i saw way more animals this year uh than in the past up there and i think it's just because that moose number or the wolf number was just much lower but there was like i said there was still sign that there was some in the area just nothing like several years ago when i was there it was you know it was even i would say as much as i appreciate balance in nature it was excessive and it's getting that way now like even in wisconsin i remember i was talking to a friend of

70:44mine up in an area i used to live up by kind of in the lacrosse area actually lived a little northeast of la crosse by a small town called cataract and there was a few times where there were some wolf spottings um there's a big military base here called fort mccoy and i lived up on the northern side of the base what was called the impact area they kind of shot test rounds over and they kind of i don't know went off there or whatever but there was an incredible number of like deer and things that were in there so you know kind of the rumor was that they had introduced wolves into their timberwolves to let to kind of thin down some of those numbers well now it's the point where the amount of people i know in wisconsin that see wolves is just rapidly increasing and obviously when that happens you know they eat stuff i mean wolves don't mess around they take stuff down and

71:37sometimes it's just strange you don't understand the balance of um of why there's an introduction to something that you know has the possibility to just take over you know it's it's strange well it is but it's also there needs to be some sort of balance you don't want the animals overpopulating and you do want some sort of a balance between predator and prey but the real problem becomes when people don't want to manage the predators right they only want they want nature to sort itself out yeah it doesn't really work that way though yeah i mean it just people need to understand like if you do like deer and you like moose and you like all these other animals you can't have too many wolves too many yeah you can't have too many grizzlies because if you do you're going to have very few of those other animals you're not going to see them they're going to get wiped out

72:31and in some places like they're almost at the point of extinction like what that what what is that caribou herd that's in north america one small caribou herd yeah i'm not that familiar with it because i've never really been a caribou person you know from a hunting aspect but they're an animal that's like severely targeted by wolves oh yeah yeah i could see it anything with a very predictable migration is going to be very prone to you know to any type of prey creature you look at you look at any of the migrations of like wildebeests and stuff like that in africa where they're having to migrate it's like those crocs are just like oh yeah here we go we know where that river crossing is we know where the neck down is it's the same thing it's caribou you know i'm sure you know this but many people don't uh the females actually have antlers and the reason why they have antlers is to

73:22fend off wolves i didn't know that yeah female caribou have antlers yeah they're one of the only deer species where the females have antlers yeah i didn't know i'm sure that's make sure that's true i don't think well i mean i guess i'm sure it is i guess if it's for wolves but they all have antlers right all caribou have antlers well you're male 1 i didn't think so but i think they do how good was uh how good was that elk from that you cooked in camp oh fantastic is that true i'm right yeah you're usually right people would disagree i'd say eight out of 10 times there's a few times where i say things though and i go what the are you saying you know what you're saying at least you at least you uh questioned it yeah you questioned it always and you laugh about it yeah no i'm no expert i'm an expert in very very few things but uh i think you have very uh your intelligence level is high

74:20it just says that males are tend to be a little bit bigger yeah their antlers are a little bit bigger but yeah they both have them yeah um see if it's true that the the females have it to fend off wolves i think that's theoretical actually yeah yeah that's the part that that's the part where i was like yeah well i'm pretty sure i saw that in a documentary that the females have it to fend off wolves that was speculative speculation 360 videos oh what a cool animal man they're so cool looking there i've never hunted them i would like to they're supposed to be delicious and there's a shitload of them like that's the crazy thing about alaska the areas of alaska like they'll have hundreds and hundreds of them and these streams you know i think more than that depending on the migration yeah sure but um not streams you know whatever a path full of them there's one with no antlers

75:11must have lost them do they lose their antlers like all of them have them it says there are exceptions like there's only one this one still got jacked but you see elk like that yeah yeah we see that um yours had a broken tine didn't it uh a little one yeah not not a big broken one but we saw one that i almost shot that only had one antler yeah you like that when you were with me and you shot that one whitetail i'm like he's broken on one side you're like i want a gangster they're going down it doesn't bother me the antlers to me a secondary number one i want the meat yeah and i want a mature animal but two it doesn't bother me if they're things snapped off it means they're just going to war yeah you know i was uh i was really pumped for that camp specifically because i had several good friends there and i really you know i'm just geeked out right now about cooking

76:06you know me too just i mean cooking stuff doing stuff different um that neck that you made exactly oh my god i have to figure you got to give me that recipe and i got to figure out how to do that that was sensational man that was so good that roast yeah we had 51 people well there's a lot of camera people there there was guides there was i think people that maybe worked there but yeah i made a massive i took the one half of the elk neck and did a forward sear so you know we've talked about reverse here that our buddy chad ward taught us um but this was a i call it a forwards here maybe i'm wrong but it's just a sear yeah so i see her at the beginning uh in a big cast iron pot we had a massive cast iron pot barely didn't even fit in the traeger and so we seared that whole neck and then seasoned it really well i seasoned it with like a a trigger prime rib rub and then a coffee rub

77:06and then i put some of the black rifle knocked and loaded coffee in there and then put in i think about it it was the pot was so massive but i put in about six cups of bone broth and then covered it with a cast iron lid uh wrapped it all up in foil and then cooked it at 225 i think for about 18 hours because of how big it was and then we knew it was about ready to be done so we grilled some peppers and i think is that all we put in there grilled a bunch of peppers and stuff yeah it was like bell peppers yep bell peppers and um normally i do some jalapenos too we didn't have any and then put onions in there too i feel like yeah maybe some carrots or something in there too well there was there was onions we did grill some onions kind of until they were caramelized but then open that up and more or less just took two forks and it just fell apart yeah i mean just fell apart and kind of did

78:06it all it looked like it looked like a pulled pork butt is what it looked like and then we went ahead and put in all the the grilled peppers and stuff in there put a little bit of um sauce in there some texas spicing a little bit of sriracha covered it back up and just let it we actually took it out and set it in the yeti and then let it just kind of sit in that yeti uh for about well we went out on the evening hunt and then we came back um and then we ate it for dinner so it just sat in that yeti and just kind of maintain temperature and just let all the juices and everything re you know redistribute back through that shredded meat after we shredded it and then people just went crazy the amount of people that were coming up to me saying what was that and i'm like neck and they they couldn't believe it they couldn't believe that a giant bull with this neck that practically dulled knives

79:02trying to cut through was just that awesome but it really is like low and slow is the name of the game on some of that stuff and well the those traeger grills any sort of pellet grill is such a great way to cook something like that too because you can maintain the exact temperature for long periods of time and the thing about if you've never used a pellet grill folks they use these pellets that are made out of wood so like this table if you're going to make this table they would use a saw to make the table and then it would take the actual sawdust and compress it and the natural sugars in the wood make this uh compressed pellet so they don't add any chemicals or anything it's just wood right and then they have this element that heats it up and then they have this little worm drive that feeds pellets down into the heated up area so the heated up area

79:52turns into there look at that bam uh the heated up area um turns into fire and you've got this little fire going on in this hopper uh where this hopper feeds down into this cup rather so the fire's in the cup and it keeps dropping pellets in there so it's a natural fire it's just fire and wood and it gives us great flavor to the food that you're cooking whatever we cooking vegetables or anything you're cooking meat and and those things maintain temperature so well so you could keep it on 190 degrees and just keep it at 190 for a day and they're so efficient that you never have to add pellets like you could do the entire 16 18 hours worth of cooking just on one hopper full of pellets oh easy yeah easy i think they said well i think one bag of pellets is equivalent to like a full propane thing yeah so this is what we cooked in camp john made uh that is what's called the back strap

80:50which is uh would be uh essentially a tomahawk cut yeah it was a full that's a full section of tomahawk steaks those are all elk and there's the pot in the back so it's basically the rib and where the rib goes up to the top of the back and the back that meat that goes along the top of the spine is what most people like best out of elk yeah i gotta find that picture of them so he cooked it like that with um with the bones attached just for novelty yeah but it was super delicious yeah people like having that handle to chow down on it was super delicious and the fact that we were doing it in camp from an elk that you had shot literally the day before yeah it was as fresh as it gets yeah yeah and then you're doing it in the mountains the view out there and just it's incredible yeah it was awesome it was i was happy to to tag out early just because of the fact i was

81:46you know i had a lot of good friends there and we were able to to grill out and chill out and and i think we probably ate about a third of that thing over there yeah yeah we ate a ton of it we ate a ton of it well didn't you when you were in alberta you shot a deer early in your hunt didn't you guys eat the almost the entire deer yeah yeah we did yeah we did that's a big ass deer too yeah we ate a ton of uh andy's elk too when andy shot his bowl on 911 we still had i think five days left of hunting so we ate elk three meals a day um one of the things i always do is i'll always take a trigger with me or or um you know honestly it sounds weird but it's an investment to even if it's one of the portable ones just to get one there well that new one that they have is awesome the ranger the really small one yep that thing is perfect it's perfect and it's not heavy either

82:44no that thing's the perfect size for for camping yeah it's um i'm trying to think i don't know what the weight is but yeah it's perfect for camping and you can just plug it in like i have a ram truck and you can actually just plug in right inside i'd normally just have an extension cord run it through the rear window and just plug and go i mean i took one uh with me and sharon went down to oklahoma hunting and actually that thing right there yep yeah how much does that thing weigh does it say i don't know it's not super light because i mean they they're they are heavy they are heavy duty 41 pounds yeah that's crazy yeah i mean it's for on the go it's awesome and the new ranger one's actually a little better than that one it's got a digital it's got a digital um scale for the thermostat is the new one for sale yeah or what's this one sold out yeah that one's sold out there

83:42was the new one's called the ranger um but yeah they're they're dynamite you can just plug them in you know well we were talking yeah there it is right there 3.99 yeah that's the thing you know if you lived in the city like i've got a i bring him up a lot just because i think what he does is cool but um i've got a buddy that lives in new york and i found him on instagram working out in central park all the time and one time i was in i was close to central park in the morning and i knew he always worked out early so i text him like five in the morning i said hey dude i said are you up and he texts back and said yeah his name is joseph and i said i want to do one of these central park workouts with you and he just carries some supplies in a big backpack and he rucks in and then he literally just like has certain rocks and stuff and he has uh if he got there and you were

84:35on his rock would he get mad no he would be happy see we got to learn a lesson here by joseph um yeah exactly so i did a workout with him but you know he was telling me he's like you know if you ever get any of that elk meat or anything i'd love you know i'd love to try it and he's big into i think keto uh but he was telling me how much he pays for store-bought meat in new york and i'm like oh my goodness that is astronomical and he's like and i don't really know where it comes from you know and for someone that's that in tune with his body he was you know kind of disappointed that that's what his options were but then i started thinking i'm like well do you have you know do you have the ability for like a grill you know living in iowa or living where you know you are we've got some some big grills we have the space for it but you know some people i think

85:28back to myself when i was in my 20s living in an apartment you know i wouldn't have the space for that that right there is a great pl great option yeah you know it's literally not much bigger in a couple briefcases put on your patio put it on your patio if you're cooking for two it would be perfect yeah you could easily cook for two on that thing you cook for more than two on that thing and the cleanup is the most important thing with any pellet grill if anyone's ever to get one the two things i can tell you are most important is one just recognize that you know it runs off a wooden pellet so treat pellet like treat the pellets like you would campfire wood you know if you're if you leave campfire wood out where it's getting rained on all the time you know it's going to be a pain to start it or it's not going to burn that grate so if you keep those dry

86:14i always put my pellets after i pour the bag in whatever is left i actually put in one of my yeti buckets and put that you know that kind of it's i don't know it's like a sealable lid that i pushed down um traeger makes buckets they make buckets specifically for them they sent me a couple of them yup the buckets are good but keeping your pellet you know if you're in a high humidity place like florida um don't keep yeah don't keep your pellets outside um you know if they're in the grill and you're using the grill that's one thing but don't keep the the bags of them out there all the time and then as you use it there's the little it's called a i think they call it a burning pot essentially your pellets are burning in a small pot uh think of that just the same as you would a campfire pit as you're burning wood all the time there's going to be ash left and

87:04if that pot fills up with ash there's not going to be the ability for as much pellets to go in there so it's not going to burn as hot so you know if you get to the point where you're not able to get to your higher temperatures it's probably because you have too much you've got too much ash in your pot so yeah clean it out and then it'll pretty much from there be as easy as flipping it to on and turning it to the to the temperature that you want it's done yeah i was telling you that i tried cooking on a regular grill or propane grill the other day and it just sucked it was flaring up there's you know fire and smoke because the fat was dripping down into the fire it's a shitty way of cooking they do have a really cool grill though that cooks from above i've seen one of those it's pretty bad ass like you you uh you can raise or lower the heat and bring it closer to the meat

87:57or lift it above and so you don't get any flare-ups it just cooks from above well it's definitely a better way to do it if you're using propane because i i remember i remember once i bought some some rib eyes and this was back when i didn't have the money to buy good steaks but i had some people over and i thought i'm gonna buy some good steaks went out and you know spit quite a bit getting some good rib eyes and everything and because there's so much marbling i remember i came inside i had those on the grill i didn't even have them that high for temperature i came inside and i you know started working on vegetables or pouring drinks for people and also i look out and there's just smoke rolling out of my weber and i go out there and lift it up and my rib eyes all that marbling just it was just a big burning mess it looked like i took a flamethrower to one half of my rib eyes i was

88:45so bummed out yeah it's hard doing it right yeah that's there's an art to cooking there is one of the things that i'm really uh learning from getting into hunting and getting into cooking my own food is uh learning how to do it correctly and it's fun there's a real art to it you know like like that necros that you made or like some of the more interesting things do you ever do shanks yeah yeah i did um i did two last week yeah um i shot that whitetail in south dakota and i took both of the front quarters and then did slow cooks with those and they're they're awesome you know the key for any of that stuff that normally has a lot of tendons and stuff that's a tougher section of the meat a lot of people try to cook them too fast and you don't break down that cartilage you know you need that cartilage to really cook slow to the point where it like gels and it breaks down and it almost turns

89:42into marbling and then it'll turn into flavoring which is kind of what happened with that with the neck you know once it cooks slow enough even all those harder tendons that are in there they just slowly start decomposing they become like more of a marbling that's mixed in and it's really really good i mean it's it's awesome and i'm i'm a big advocate on the simpler you keep things cooking wise for me the better the flavors are that i get i'm a very simple cook and when people ask me to do you know people see pictures that i post cooking they're like well you know you need to do a cookbook no i'm not my cookbook would be boring because it would be you know olive oil probably you know i would have coffee for rub and have like a prime rib rub you know probably a decent like rock salt but other than that like grass-fed butters olive oils or a couple basic rubs that's

90:39all i use period in a bone broth if i do like a if i cook something slow to break down but i just literally stay with those staple things and from there you know i'll cook according to the directions one of the things i learned to do was was rest my meat so i won't take meat off and just cut right into it and you rest it in a cooler yeah i rest in a yeti all the time all the time you cover it with aluminum foil and it works your paper when you do it like do you get it to a certain temperature like say if you want your your meat to hit an internal temperature like 130. do you get it to like 120 and then put in the cooler and then let it rise to like 130 while it's in there because it keeps cooking right yeah it's gonna it's gonna rise some yeah it will rise some you gotta plan that out before you rest it too if you're gonna do it in a cooler right yeah normally i it depends how long

91:32you're going to rest it um normally i plan on about six degrees it'll go up but you can as you're resting it in the cooler you can still check it you know you can let it sit for 10 or 15 minutes and then check it normally for me 5 degrees is a really good number like i'll stop 5 degrees less than where i want to eat it because when i put it in there and wrap it up most vegetables for me take 20 minutes like as soon as i pull that off my traeger i'll turn it up to high and then take vegetables i just like toss in olive oil and i'll season them with a basic rub put them in there but anything like broccoli asparagus peppers cauliflower anything like that that i cook on there is going to take 20 minutes roughly on high and the meat is just resting at that point and then i can literally pull the meat off if i want to do reverse here i can do it just long enough to where that temperature

92:25hits the exact number if it hadn't reached that yet otherwise i can just slice it and according to you know the color throughout that i'll serve it out to everybody according to whether they want something a little more done you give them one of the end pieces if people want it less done you give them the piece in the middle but typically if i'm going to let it rest for 20 minutes i'll pull it at about you know 129 degrees because i like mine at like 135 or so you like yours a little less you like yours a little you know redder than me i think you like yours it more like 130 finish don't you yeah yeah and that's the other thing too is besides keeping you know the basics for seasoning is those thermapens right i mean if you have a probe that's the one thing that i learned from our buddy chad ward is you know when he travels he travels with a good knife

93:15and he travels with a probe and mine's from thermal works is one i got um as a gift someone gave me and i can tell you that that was one of the best things to get because yeah i have a regular internal thermometer that's or it's it's really cool because i can keep it in the kitchen and it's got one probe and then the uh it registers to uh a second unit which you can keep like as a remote you keep it far away from the grill it tells you what's going on you know it's like bluetooth or something or wireless yup um uh steve varnela actually has a really good cookbook that just came out i should say that i was gonna have it in here today uh he sent it to my house and it's at my house right now but it literally just came out his are on ninja ninja level yeah if you want to take things to the next level i mean he is uh he's he's he's one of those rare guys that has a television show

94:12a hunting television show where literally most of the episodes he's cooking something that's it right now meat eater fishing game cookbook okay it's available november 20th it's not available to you yet i already have it sorry folks but uh it's really good though it's excellent he sent me a you know publishers version that had like just black and white photos but i just got the full version uh a couple of days ago and it's it's really excellent and but he's got really really cool recipes and interesting stuff and and if you don't have any wild game me you could always buy bison from supermarkets some supermarkets have that and you could cook that and cook it in the same way we're going to bust a bison yeah in this winter yeah for a good cause i'm going to come in and put a bison coat on son i'm gonna do all my podcasts with a giant bison coat you better get an air

95:03conditioner in this sucker dude i love bison yeah it's delicious it is it is awesome it is awesome yeah um you myself and our buddy andy stump are going to go uh for sure me and andy both of our bison are going to be for that meet is going to have a purpose um andy and i kind of i don't know through through some just talk at a hunting camp kind of started this thing that we call free range american right and it's it's literally a brand that's not really about us it's just about all these we have we have all these friends that just do crazy stuff and andy's arguably one of the craziest friends i got oh he's crazy yeah he's probably the craziest holds the world record for the furthest distance travel one of those flying squirrel suits yeah he's out of his mind he is the craziest but you know we just one time we were just talking about um you know just awesome people do and

95:59he's like you know we need to just we just need to motivate people and and just talk people into to tagging us when they do awesome and so then uh that's the shirt yeah the shirt you're wearing yeah awesome yeah and so did you guys start this company together this t-shirt company something yeah yeah well it's more than just that but yeah the entire brand or you know like the social media stuff is all just it's it's based around people that you know just tag us with the hashtag do awesome and they show us what they're doing is free-ranging americans and you know it's anything it's not just what andy and i like i mean we you know we uh you know some guys are you know firemen that just do crazy stuff there's people that have some you know there's been some motor some mx guys that just post some crazy ass pictures like shane dorian some of the waves he's on that's just crazy what are you

96:54gonna do with the the meat from the bisons we're gonna um andy's got a big uh a big fifth wheel calls it the do awesome mobile and we're going to pull that from we're going to start on the west coast this spring and we're going to start where andy went through buds and we're going to hit a base for one of each of the military branches we're going to try to end at fort bragg where i was born but we're going to start with the navy we're going to end with uh with the army and we're going to go to bases and we're just going to cook wild game out on the do awesome mobile we've got traegers chad ward's going to be following close behind with some giant rolling traegers and we're going to we're going to get these bisons ground up to do some some cool bison burgers and stuff like that and you're going to hit a bunch of military bases you're going to need a lot of body we're going to

97:52take some buffalos down and then we're going to we're going to also have some really cool brands uh supporting us but yeah we're more or less just trying to support the troops promote you know clean eating doing awesome and um it's gonna be fun so we're still working out the details but that's gonna be coming and uh i'm super thankful all my all my friends that are that are military based or have you know served for us and and uh you know it's just another way that i can do one of the few things i'm good at you know i can show people how to shoot archery or i can cook for them that's that's kind of my forte and uh yeah i'm looking forward to it i think it's going to be i think it's going to be a mobile party that sounds fun so when that all goes down i'll i'll let people know i'll put it on social media and we'll talk about it here and let let folks know

98:40uh john kavanagh should be here in a second now if he's not already here i don't know if they're here yet are they here yet someone's here they're here okay so we're going to talk to conor mcgregor's coach and george lockhart who's uh connor's uh um weight cutting coach and i think he does his nutrition as well he looked up to talk to him he did look dynamite while he's getting up he looks pretty good very true it's a hard sport it's a hard sport you know he he i'll tell you one thing though he his it would have been nice to talk to him afterwards because i think he would have been gracious in in in defeat i really do yeah i agree with the past i agree i think uh he was on social media you know he said it was a good crack you know uh i mean maybe we'll get a rematch you know he talked a tremendous amount of and it's it's just hard for people to recover from that

99:30yeah but it's part of the game part of the fun part of it john dudley all right uh knocking on tv you can uh catch him on instagram and you could no no k on the front nock archery knock and and if you're interested in archery that's the man to follow or free range american dot u s there you go all right see you soon